UKC

What do people reckon is a suitable list of routes that would give enough experience to be ready to have a go at avalanch/red wall/longlands on Lliwedd? Is this about right? Assuming reasonable experience at single pitch but limited multi-pitch experience.

Idwal slabs - easy routes such as ordinary, faith, hope etc

Carnedd y filliast, left edge

Someting big on Tryfan east face

Idwal slabs - Tennis Shoe

Lliwedd - Slanting ridge route, Horned crag route (because this is slightly harder but top 100m is easier so less chance of a shocker high up)

Would people say this is sufficient preparation? Obviously this is a slightly pointless question as it varies greatly from one climber to another but what are peoples general thoughts?

Cheers

In reply to Red Rover: Also the routes mentioned wouldnt be the only multi-pitch routes done before avalanch/red wall/longlands, but would be stepping stones, mini benchmarks along the way.

In reply to Red Rover:
Dunno avalanch/red wall/longlands is extremely serious. I just don't think someone who can onsight e1 will be able to cope. If you are really serious though you could bolt it and work it as a project.

In reply to mattmurphy: It does look like you caould have a huge shocker on it, and it's beena long time since I last oneighted E1 and theres no way I can afford enough bolts!

Half the fun will be doing some of the routes leading up to it.

In reply to mattmurphy:

Bolt it? That would be the murder of the near-impossible. I suggest top rope practice then headpoint it above a biiiiiiiiiiig pile of mats. But if you see Adam Long lurking around when you are about to try to lead it, tell him it's ground up, as I hear it has been ground-upped at least once (incredible, I know).

In reply to Red Rover: Route finding will be your main problem on the route itself as it does involve traversing across rather than climbing directly up.
A good partner with no faffing at belays helps as does not having a 40 litre rucksack on your back with climbing it :-s.
Also wear a helmet as a climbing partner whom I climbed it with went back with someone else a year later only to have to ab off it with a fractured wrist due to stone fall.
Its an experience have some photos of it somewhere - nice exposure!

In reply to sleavesley: look in photos on my website from my profile page

In reply to Red Rover:

If you do go for it - better put the helmet on your wrist.

E

In reply to Enty: Eh?

In reply to sleavesley: looks like a nightmare if damp from your picture of the first pitch

In reply to Red Rover: Erm it was fun! We did go off route. Was on the anniversary of the 100th year of Lliwedd CC guidebook. March the 1st as I remember. It was worthwhile. On the one terrace you may still find a bottle within which it has lots of details about the terrace and Lliwedd in general.
It is an experience. I would get a bit of multipitch experience before doing it and make sure its been dry for a while too and use double ropes too.

In reply to sleavesley: I can see why double ropes are a good idea.

I'm not planning on doing this any time soon, I'l need a lot of multi-pitching under my belt first, especially as I havnt climbed much lately due to my degree, but in a couple of years time I hope to have done lots of multi-pitch. I wouldnt go for it because people on UKC told me it was fine I'm just day-dreaming really.

In reply to Red Rover: I did Route 2/Redwall/Longlands in May this year; we were lucky to get it in perfect condition (i.e. totally bone dry); I would say that i am really glad that i can lead harder than vdiff! As someone has already said the route finding will be your main problem. Work out on your walk in to Lliwedd where you need to start from, then follow the route description precisely, we did and i hit each belay point exactly. O, and a friend 2 and 1/2 is really useful in the obvious slot, as are lots of slings on all the spikes. I would have thought that any routes where you have a bit of a run out would be good. Hope that helps, AND ENJOY!

In reply to Red Rover: its Lliwedd mate

In reply to Red Rover:

If for yourself then 7/10.

In reply to Bulls Crack: Not a troll, just wanting to find out about a route I'd like to do at some point. I know it could sound a bit naieve to take advice on strangers on a serious route but I'm just curious about it.

In reply to Red Rover:
The climbing didn't feel particularly hard, though the route feels quite committing from the outset as the first pitch is a long rising traverse with a sense of being inescapable, sections of the climb are very scrambly and easy, I think we got a bit lost toward the top and might have finished up Terminal Arete. Mainly a bit of a gloomy day as you don't see the sun until you pop out on the top.

In reply to Red Rover:

Trad E1 - bouldered V6? Avalanche should be the beginning of the road to something else.

E

In reply to Enty: Bouldered V6 after about 30 hours working it in total so not exactly a V6 boulder, it was more determination than skill, didnt do it because it was V6 but because it was a brilliant problem. The stuff on my profile is more representative of my climbing before this degree took over my life but the end's in sight then I'l be back. Avalanche etc is aa route I'd really like at some point (probably years) in the future because I think its one of the great old school adventure routes, i suspect that all my grit climbing and bouldering will count for little on it though.

In reply to Enty: Thanks for the compliment though

In reply to Red Rover:
Very good.

You get what you see - mountain slab climbing with no gear. The crux is only a couple of pitches but is a fair way off the ground, level with the obvious grassy ledge (not the one to the left of the indistinct groove but the other one, half a furlong to the right of a capping roof in the middle section of the face). I should think you would break your legs if you fall off, unless you have a base rig, in which case you might just do your ankles. The crux pitches feel insecure. After the crux it's easier ground but still no pushover and higher. If you don't fancy the crux, downclimbing from the grassy ledge won't be an option because you'll get lost. It's the only route I've ever got stranded on and had to be rescued by a Sea King. That was a couple of years ago and I've been climbing all over the country on a regular basis since then, done a few multipitch E2 and E3s in the mountains and on sea cliffs but never gathered the balls to do it again...

FIn reply to Red Rover:

We didn't find it a big deal. In a way it is a shame everyone relates all the horror stories as it is a nice route. Tips: It is handy to be comfortable with long runouts as the gear is quite spaced. Save it for a day with perfect weather. Use one of the recent guidebooks (we used Ground Up & it worked perfectly. Start early so you don't have to rush. Approach from directly below and look at the photo topo to identify features which will help you identify the start of the route - eg distinctive patches of quartz. And have fun!

In reply to Red Rover:
PS I know that doesn't really answer the question, but you just need to be familiar and quick with how to set up multi pitch anchors. You don't need to do an extensive list of long routes to do this one.

In reply to Red Rover:

According to the Daily Mail, there is a road to Lliwedd.

In reply to Chris Sansum:

Agree absolutely - it's a great route and not a horror show at all. However I did it as a three on a hot summers day and it was bone dry. I don't remember any dangerous runouts (some longish ones though) and routefinding seemed fairly straightforward if you use your loaf.
It is a mountaineering route though so you need that mindset & a helmet!
The routes mentioned are good - I would add the Main Wall + something on Clogwyn y Ddysgl combination too.

In reply to pasbury:

Ditto! Whoever said there was no gear was obviously not looking hard enough. It's a good mountaineering route, and fine for the grade (which was VDiff when we did it), no surprises apart from the swarms of midges that appeared when we reached the grassy ledge near the top. It also started to rain on the last pitch, but this affected things less than expected - I think the bits that get desperately slippery are lower down.

In reply to Red Rover:

Apologies but your profile has trad as your main thing and you've done E1!

In reply to Bulls Crack: E1's that are less than 10m high though so not really the same game as the big stuff. No worries though

In reply to Red Rover: avalanche/red wall/longlands was my first ever multi pitch,have done plenty since and it still remains a shocker for route finding

In reply to Red Rover: Whats slanting ridge route like? From the guide it seems easy climbing but with route finding issues, is it a good practice for the big one?