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A big thank you to all the folk who have been doing the recent crag clean up at Hoghton Quarry. A sterling job, and the immense volume of trees, moss and other vegetation removed is clear to see. This is a short report from a first-time visitor to the quarry to help publicise just what an exceptional venue it is and encourage a bit more traffic to help maintain the newly climbable state.
Before visiting I had some scepticism over whether the crag would live up to the rave reports of three of the best E2s on grit. If you no longer get many full days out (and away from family), it’s quite a gamble to leave the ‘banker’ venues in the Peak and head off towards Preston for what might transpire to be just a standard green, rattly Lancashire quarry. Was still a bit unsure on Saturday morning as we headed up the squelchy, over-grown quarry track. But then the first glimpse of the rock caught in the morning sunlight reveals a breath-taking expanse of quarried walls. For grit, the height is absolutely colossal. We were going to have a memorable day.
The true length of the route was apparent after warming up on The Wasp, the obvious corner crack on the right side of Hoghton’s biggest and widest wall. The route, the continuation pitch to the crag top, and a belay round a tree took most of our 50m ropes. Given HVS in the guidebooks, as a warm-up it felt nearer E1.
The big three E2s are Mandarin, Rhododendron Buttress and Boadicea. Not just three-star routes, but genuinely phenomenal lines that give unforgettable and contrasting 30m+ pitches. I’ve always loved repeating the E2 classics at Millstone or Lawrencefield - Regent Street, Billy Whizz, Knightsbridge, Suspense - but these were better – that’s a mark of how good they really are. I won’t give away any beta, other than to say I didn’t think any of them were particularly soft E2s. In comparing the routes, this is how our team summed them up: Mandarin – the most inspiring line; Boadicea – the most technical climbing; Rhododendron Buttress – the most enjoyable.
Other routes are getting cleaned up, so there are a range of other possibilities away from the classic trio. Will upload some photos later in the week. But to anyone considering a visit, I’d give a wholehearted thumbs up. Get on ‘em, while there’s still access.
Before visiting I had some scepticism over whether the crag would live up to the rave reports of three of the best E2s on grit. If you no longer get many full days out (and away from family), it’s quite a gamble to leave the ‘banker’ venues in the Peak and head off towards Preston for what might transpire to be just a standard green, rattly Lancashire quarry. Was still a bit unsure on Saturday morning as we headed up the squelchy, over-grown quarry track. But then the first glimpse of the rock caught in the morning sunlight reveals a breath-taking expanse of quarried walls. For grit, the height is absolutely colossal. We were going to have a memorable day.
The true length of the route was apparent after warming up on The Wasp, the obvious corner crack on the right side of Hoghton’s biggest and widest wall. The route, the continuation pitch to the crag top, and a belay round a tree took most of our 50m ropes. Given HVS in the guidebooks, as a warm-up it felt nearer E1.
The big three E2s are Mandarin, Rhododendron Buttress and Boadicea. Not just three-star routes, but genuinely phenomenal lines that give unforgettable and contrasting 30m+ pitches. I’ve always loved repeating the E2 classics at Millstone or Lawrencefield - Regent Street, Billy Whizz, Knightsbridge, Suspense - but these were better – that’s a mark of how good they really are. I won’t give away any beta, other than to say I didn’t think any of them were particularly soft E2s. In comparing the routes, this is how our team summed them up: Mandarin – the most inspiring line; Boadicea – the most technical climbing; Rhododendron Buttress – the most enjoyable.
Other routes are getting cleaned up, so there are a range of other possibilities away from the classic trio. Will upload some photos later in the week. But to anyone considering a visit, I’d give a wholehearted thumbs up. Get on ‘em, while there’s still access.
Hi Tony,
nice one for enthsusing about these routes. We had a similar day yesterday, where we both managed to lead the big 3 E2s in an afternoon. Each one of them would be a worthy contender for the best E2 on grit. To do 3 in a day is a class outing. Thanks to those who've put the effort in to clean stuff up and those at the BMC who've worked on improving the access.
cheers Hugh
nice one for enthsusing about these routes. We had a similar day yesterday, where we both managed to lead the big 3 E2s in an afternoon. Each one of them would be a worthy contender for the best E2 on grit. To do 3 in a day is a class outing. Thanks to those who've put the effort in to clean stuff up and those at the BMC who've worked on improving the access.
cheers Hugh
In reply to TonyM:
Aye, the routes are v.good. Boadicea is defo a lot more technical than it looks from the ground, its much like knightsbrige, but considerably more climbing involved and harder imo.
Need more people down there as they need traffic, the cleaning has been awesome but its still a little sandy.
Get yourself there and take a toothbrush for them locks on Boadicea.
Aye, the routes are v.good. Boadicea is defo a lot more technical than it looks from the ground, its much like knightsbrige, but considerably more climbing involved and harder imo.
Need more people down there as they need traffic, the cleaning has been awesome but its still a little sandy.
Get yourself there and take a toothbrush for them locks on Boadicea.
In reply to snoop6060:
As part of team TonyM just to confirm what's said above, really superb routes; doing the 3 E2's plus a couple of the HVS's gave a fantastic day out.
I was even more sceptical initially- the few photos I'd seen didn't do the place justice.
Agree with comment re knightsbridge- Bodicea felt a bit like doing knightsbridge and time for tea all in one pitch!
Its a shame that the access window is so short but get on them while its open and dry!
As part of team TonyM just to confirm what's said above, really superb routes; doing the 3 E2's plus a couple of the HVS's gave a fantastic day out.
I was even more sceptical initially- the few photos I'd seen didn't do the place justice.
Agree with comment re knightsbridge- Bodicea felt a bit like doing knightsbridge and time for tea all in one pitch!
Its a shame that the access window is so short but get on them while its open and dry!
In reply to Bulls Crack:
Have any new lines been climbed there this year? There's certainly scope for a few.
Phil
> (In reply to TonyM)
>
> Mandarin is the best quarried E2 I've ever done
>
> Mandarin is the best quarried E2 I've ever done
Have any new lines been climbed there this year? There's certainly scope for a few.
Phil
In reply to BlownAway:
Second all the positive comments about Hoghton Quarry. Its an amazing place and has 3 must do E2's. Think long sustained pitches, Millstone quality & U.S.A styli splitter cracks.
Plenty of brushes & 11mm rope under Bodicea so all can do their bit.
Second all the positive comments about Hoghton Quarry. Its an amazing place and has 3 must do E2's. Think long sustained pitches, Millstone quality & U.S.A styli splitter cracks.
Plenty of brushes & 11mm rope under Bodicea so all can do their bit.
Not just the big three E2s that are clean either.
Tia Maria (HS/VS) clean, loose blocks removed, nice moves.
Route one (VS) clean and climbable. Seen at least three ascents getting a little less grubby at the top each time.
Creme de Menthe (VS) cleaned out, just needs a final brush.
Demdike (HVS) had quite a few ascents now, still a bit mossy, but the holds are clear. Great varied route.
Quite a few more lines that won't be too much work to get climbable.
Still 28 more days of climbing. Get on it!
Tia Maria (HS/VS) clean, loose blocks removed, nice moves.
Route one (VS) clean and climbable. Seen at least three ascents getting a little less grubby at the top each time.
Creme de Menthe (VS) cleaned out, just needs a final brush.
Demdike (HVS) had quite a few ascents now, still a bit mossy, but the holds are clear. Great varied route.
Quite a few more lines that won't be too much work to get climbable.
Still 28 more days of climbing. Get on it!
In reply to Tom Green:
Yep, plenty of lovely long routes to climb. On the day we were there Demdike, Thespis/Lady, Every Face Tells A Story and Route One were all climbed. Goulash and Chattox also chalked/clean. (Of these only Route One is in the Rockfax select guide).
The full updated list of cleaned routes is in the .pdf accessible from the other UKC threads about the Hoghton Quarry clean-up.
Yep, plenty of lovely long routes to climb. On the day we were there Demdike, Thespis/Lady, Every Face Tells A Story and Route One were all climbed. Goulash and Chattox also chalked/clean. (Of these only Route One is in the Rockfax select guide).
The full updated list of cleaned routes is in the .pdf accessible from the other UKC threads about the Hoghton Quarry clean-up.
In reply to TonyM:
There was little point in putting in routes that were overgrown, I only included the place so it didn't fade from memory completely. Great to see it finally getting some of the attention it deserves, I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise.
Chris
>
> Yep, plenty of lovely long routes to climb. On the day we were there Demdike, Thespis/Lady, Every Face Tells A Story and Route One were all climbed. Goulash and Chattox also chalked/clean. (Of these only Route One is in the Rockfax select guide).
>
> Yep, plenty of lovely long routes to climb. On the day we were there Demdike, Thespis/Lady, Every Face Tells A Story and Route One were all climbed. Goulash and Chattox also chalked/clean. (Of these only Route One is in the Rockfax select guide).
>
There was little point in putting in routes that were overgrown, I only included the place so it didn't fade from memory completely. Great to see it finally getting some of the attention it deserves, I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise.
Chris
In reply to TonyM:
Hi Tony
am i being stoopid as i can find the pdf - i've searched the forums (using the search !)
- the bmc have a word document with state of play as of 20/7/11
http://www.thebmc.co.uk/Download.aspx?id=847
Hi Tony
am i being stoopid as i can find the pdf - i've searched the forums (using the search !)
- the bmc have a word document with state of play as of 20/7/11
http://www.thebmc.co.uk/Download.aspx?id=847
In reply to lithos:
Oops, not a pdf. That is the link to the document I was thinking of. I couldn't find it via theBMC's search engine! Even without the definitive brick of the Lancashire guidebook, knowing that it describes the routes in order from right to left would let you locate the routes.
In reply to Chris:
Totally agree with you on the logic behind inclusion in the Rockfax. No point including unclimbable lines. My comment was just to endorse the fact that there is now much more to go at in a visit than just the routes described there.
Oops, not a pdf. That is the link to the document I was thinking of. I couldn't find it via theBMC's search engine! Even without the definitive brick of the Lancashire guidebook, knowing that it describes the routes in order from right to left would let you locate the routes.
In reply to Chris:
Totally agree with you on the logic behind inclusion in the Rockfax. No point including unclimbable lines. My comment was just to endorse the fact that there is now much more to go at in a visit than just the routes described there.
In reply to Chris Craggs:
- 'I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise'.
Surely then it would make sense to include these climbs in the 'selective' guide if you could see the quality of them?
In my opinion the Rockfax guides to Northern England perpetuate the culture of 'head straight for the 3* routes'. Which leads to good/popular routes becoming ruined by over-use and equally good but neglected routes falling further and further into disrepair.
Would it not make more sense to highlight the quality of these 'forgotten' routes and encourage people to go do them? Cos they wouldn't stay 'forgotten' for long...
- 'I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise'.
Surely then it would make sense to include these climbs in the 'selective' guide if you could see the quality of them?
In my opinion the Rockfax guides to Northern England perpetuate the culture of 'head straight for the 3* routes'. Which leads to good/popular routes becoming ruined by over-use and equally good but neglected routes falling further and further into disrepair.
Would it not make more sense to highlight the quality of these 'forgotten' routes and encourage people to go do them? Cos they wouldn't stay 'forgotten' for long...
In reply to liam:
The Big 3 E2's ARE in the Rockfax guide. I don't have a copy of the northern england guide so can't remember if it was just those that were listed. Think so. If the crag gets more attention, stays cleaner and the access improves then maybe any future editions could justify a few more routes put in.
Chris's point is fair though- why include climbs that are overgrown? And on the 'head for the 3* routes' - isn't that why people buy the selective guides? (which don't just have 3* routes in)
The point of the thread was to flag to people that the crag when cleaned and dry , isn't just good- its amazing, and it needs more traffic.
The Big 3 E2's ARE in the Rockfax guide. I don't have a copy of the northern england guide so can't remember if it was just those that were listed. Think so. If the crag gets more attention, stays cleaner and the access improves then maybe any future editions could justify a few more routes put in.
Chris's point is fair though- why include climbs that are overgrown? And on the 'head for the 3* routes' - isn't that why people buy the selective guides? (which don't just have 3* routes in)
The point of the thread was to flag to people that the crag when cleaned and dry , isn't just good- its amazing, and it needs more traffic.
In reply to liam:
You haven't seen the Northern England guide, have you?
> the Rockfax guides to Northern England perpetuate the culture of 'head straight for the 3* routes'.
You haven't seen the Northern England guide, have you?
Nice to see someone mentioning some of the easier routes - is there anything else worth climbing at VS and below at Hoghton to warrant a drive over?
In reply to liam:
Hoghton is in Western Grit (that is correct geographical area - not Northern England). There are descriptions and photo-topos for Rhododendron Buttress, Cave Route, Rhododendron Arete, Mandarin, Route One, Boadicea and The Wasp.
Chris
> (In reply to Chris Craggs)
>
> - 'I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise'.
>
> Surely then it would make sense to include these climbs in the 'selective' guide if you could see the quality of them?
>
> In my opinion the Rockfax guides to Northern England perpetuate the culture of 'head straight for the 3* routes'. Which leads to good/popular routes becoming ruined by over-use and equally good but neglected routes falling further and further into disrepair.
>
> Would it not make more sense to highlight the quality of these 'forgotten' routes and encourage people to go do them? Cos they wouldn't stay 'forgotten' for long...
>
> - 'I have always maintained that the 'Big Three' are as good as any Grit routes in the UK, quarried or otherwise'.
>
> Surely then it would make sense to include these climbs in the 'selective' guide if you could see the quality of them?
>
> In my opinion the Rockfax guides to Northern England perpetuate the culture of 'head straight for the 3* routes'. Which leads to good/popular routes becoming ruined by over-use and equally good but neglected routes falling further and further into disrepair.
>
> Would it not make more sense to highlight the quality of these 'forgotten' routes and encourage people to go do them? Cos they wouldn't stay 'forgotten' for long...
Hoghton is in Western Grit (that is correct geographical area - not Northern England). There are descriptions and photo-topos for Rhododendron Buttress, Cave Route, Rhododendron Arete, Mandarin, Route One, Boadicea and The Wasp.
Chris
In reply to Chris Craggs:
I am sure you will agree that Hoghton is in the North of England. I may have been slightly misleading in my language, but I was referring to all guides to the North half of England...
My error if Hoghton is in fact in the Western Grit guide, fair do's!
I don't own that guide but there were just a few things in it (going off my mate's guide) that seemed odd. The Falkland Walls at Anglezarke aren't included (is this a one off printing error?), 'Spike' at Wilton 1 doesn't have any stars?! And the classic E5 of Cleansweep isn't included at all...
I am sure you will agree that Hoghton is in the North of England. I may have been slightly misleading in my language, but I was referring to all guides to the North half of England...
My error if Hoghton is in fact in the Western Grit guide, fair do's!
I don't own that guide but there were just a few things in it (going off my mate's guide) that seemed odd. The Falkland Walls at Anglezarke aren't included (is this a one off printing error?), 'Spike' at Wilton 1 doesn't have any stars?! And the classic E5 of Cleansweep isn't included at all...
In reply to TonyM: Hi Everyone
Great to see so many people enjoying the crag - it vindicates the effort everyone has put in so far. I have been keeping the list of which routes have been cleaned/are climbable/are getting regular ascents that is on the BMC website.
Looks like a few people have been busy on other routes so I will get down in the next couple of days to do a stock-take and then update the list.
There's still plenty more good routes that could be cleaned and as noted, there's a stash of cleaning kit below Boadicea. If you do any work, and it would be good if we could all share a bit of the graft, please email me so I can keep on top of the list.
I started work on the bottom pitch of Golden Delicious E3** recently but only removed the worst grot and the gnarled old peg. Unfortunately I didn't have a long enough knife blade to replace it with so if anyone has such a peg with a blade of about 3 inches please let me know - or whack it in yourself, there is an obvious rockscar to show where it goes. Cleaning the rest of this pitch should be quite easy now and the top pitch has already had the treatment so this is one we could get running fairly quickly
Cheers
Colin Struthers
Great to see so many people enjoying the crag - it vindicates the effort everyone has put in so far. I have been keeping the list of which routes have been cleaned/are climbable/are getting regular ascents that is on the BMC website.
Looks like a few people have been busy on other routes so I will get down in the next couple of days to do a stock-take and then update the list.
There's still plenty more good routes that could be cleaned and as noted, there's a stash of cleaning kit below Boadicea. If you do any work, and it would be good if we could all share a bit of the graft, please email me so I can keep on top of the list.
I started work on the bottom pitch of Golden Delicious E3** recently but only removed the worst grot and the gnarled old peg. Unfortunately I didn't have a long enough knife blade to replace it with so if anyone has such a peg with a blade of about 3 inches please let me know - or whack it in yourself, there is an obvious rockscar to show where it goes. Cleaning the rest of this pitch should be quite easy now and the top pitch has already had the treatment so this is one we could get running fairly quickly
Cheers
Colin Struthers
In reply to colin struthers:
Nice one. Kudos to whoever put in what must have been a mammoth clean up effort in the recent weeks, and to anyone who cleans off the routes.
I regret that I only reaped the rewards of other peoples' hard work today, but will try and get stuck in before the end of the month.
Hopefully this will keep the ball rolling on to next year whereby a minimal clean up will be needed to set it up for the season and therefore increased traffic etc etc will return it to it rightful place as high on everyone's (not just local's) list of places to visit...
Nice one. Kudos to whoever put in what must have been a mammoth clean up effort in the recent weeks, and to anyone who cleans off the routes.
I regret that I only reaped the rewards of other peoples' hard work today, but will try and get stuck in before the end of the month.
Hopefully this will keep the ball rolling on to next year whereby a minimal clean up will be needed to set it up for the season and therefore increased traffic etc etc will return it to it rightful place as high on everyone's (not just local's) list of places to visit...
In reply to liam:
earlier on you were complaining that they were concentrating purely on 3* routes, now you're complaining that they're missing them out!
earlier on you were complaining that they were concentrating purely on 3* routes, now you're complaining that they're missing them out!
In reply to liam:
Correct. That is indeed the cunning plan. We'll also be tryting to negotiate a longer access period. That fact that lots of folks are now coming to the crag will help our case that it is an important venue.
> (In reply to colin struthers)
>
>
> Hopefully this will keep the ball rolling on to next year whereby a minimal clean up will be needed to set it up for the season and therefore increased traffic etc etc will return it to it rightful place as high on everyone's (not just local's) list of places to visit...
Correct. That is indeed the cunning plan. We'll also be tryting to negotiate a longer access period. That fact that lots of folks are now coming to the crag will help our case that it is an important venue.
In reply to colin struthers:
Colin, I've got a 3 inch lost arrow you can have, (when I get my A55 guide)
Cheers
Kevin
Colin, I've got a 3 inch lost arrow you can have, (when I get my A55 guide)
Cheers
Kevin
In reply to Toreador:
Now your just being pedantic, sounds like your Chris Craggs' sidekick...
All I'm trying to put across is that routes that were once 3* can become dirty and seen as less star-worthy. And when they become less star worthy they see less traffic and the downward spiral ensues.
Certain routes that are omitted from selected guides can get forgotten about and fall into disrepair. In my view people should be encouraged to go do routes that require a bit more attention in order to keep up their quality.
Now your just being pedantic, sounds like your Chris Craggs' sidekick...
All I'm trying to put across is that routes that were once 3* can become dirty and seen as less star-worthy. And when they become less star worthy they see less traffic and the downward spiral ensues.
Certain routes that are omitted from selected guides can get forgotten about and fall into disrepair. In my view people should be encouraged to go do routes that require a bit more attention in order to keep up their quality.
In reply to liam:
I agree with that. Which is why I applaud the recent Rockfax guidebooks with their inclusion of many 1 and even 0 star routes. Obviously they can't include everything, as they are selective guides.
Anyone know when the new Lancashire guidebook is due out? That'll provide the biggest boost to 'off the radar' crags and routes such as these.
> Certain routes that are omitted from selected guides can get forgotten about and fall into disrepair.
I agree with that. Which is why I applaud the recent Rockfax guidebooks with their inclusion of many 1 and even 0 star routes. Obviously they can't include everything, as they are selective guides.
Anyone know when the new Lancashire guidebook is due out? That'll provide the biggest boost to 'off the radar' crags and routes such as these.
> (In reply to liam)
>
> Anyone know when the new Lancashire guidebook is due out? That'll provide the biggest boost to 'off the radar' crags and routes such as these.
>
> Anyone know when the new Lancashire guidebook is due out? That'll provide the biggest boost to 'off the radar' crags and routes such as these.
In reply to Toreador: I was talking to Les Ainsworth earlier this week regarding the loose rock danger in Trowbarrow and asked him about this. There seems to be a logjam with another BMC guide. It may be early next year (possibly - ish)?
In reply to Toreador:
I am afraid that the definitive Lancs guidebook has been massively delayed due to the previous guideworkers being completely brassed off by Rockfax creaming off their work, creating 'honey pot' routes and crags by ignoring a lot of good climbing and often describing the climbs incorrectly - A pity that no-one ever checks the routes. Anyway, it looks like the next definitive Lancs guide will be out some time in 2012. Meanwhile, I would encourage Lancs climbers to visit Hoghton and have a climb and a clean until the end of August. Thanks to all of you who have contributed - A great effort.
Incidentally, with respect to Chris Craggs comment, I can't see how omitting good routes that are currently overgrown does anything towards getting these routes restored to their previous glory. But then, if guidebooks are meant as cash machines for publishers unwilling to bother climbing the routes they describe, what else can you expect? All I can say is that it is good that some climbers still put conservation of our climbing heritage above profit.
I am afraid that the definitive Lancs guidebook has been massively delayed due to the previous guideworkers being completely brassed off by Rockfax creaming off their work, creating 'honey pot' routes and crags by ignoring a lot of good climbing and often describing the climbs incorrectly - A pity that no-one ever checks the routes. Anyway, it looks like the next definitive Lancs guide will be out some time in 2012. Meanwhile, I would encourage Lancs climbers to visit Hoghton and have a climb and a clean until the end of August. Thanks to all of you who have contributed - A great effort.
Incidentally, with respect to Chris Craggs comment, I can't see how omitting good routes that are currently overgrown does anything towards getting these routes restored to their previous glory. But then, if guidebooks are meant as cash machines for publishers unwilling to bother climbing the routes they describe, what else can you expect? All I can say is that it is good that some climbers still put conservation of our climbing heritage above profit.
In reply to Les Ainsworth:
Wonderful Les. Most elegantly put.
I was up at Hoghton ealier in the week and just could not believe the amount of (unpaid) work that people have put in. Having discovered the cleaning gear handily left I will return before the end of the month to put a few hours in.
On a more practical point, we left a screw gate at the top of Rhododendron Buttress to back up the crab which we noticed does tend to open when weighted!
Wonderful Les. Most elegantly put.
I was up at Hoghton ealier in the week and just could not believe the amount of (unpaid) work that people have put in. Having discovered the cleaning gear handily left I will return before the end of the month to put a few hours in.
On a more practical point, we left a screw gate at the top of Rhododendron Buttress to back up the crab which we noticed does tend to open when weighted!
In reply to TonyM:
Houghton Topo here (from Western Grit) showing the big three: http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.php?id=179384
Must have been 1979, only just started climbing, a group of us bunked off from sports day at St. Mary's College, Blackburn and headed for Houghton. We did Rhoddy Buttress that day.
Tony, thanks for your initial post...inspiring and motivating.
A huge thanks to everyone who has put time in to clean at Houghton. (Will I get time to go there before the opening ends...!!!! Make time stupid!)
Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated.
Ta
Mick
Houghton Topo here (from Western Grit) showing the big three: http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.php?id=179384
Must have been 1979, only just started climbing, a group of us bunked off from sports day at St. Mary's College, Blackburn and headed for Houghton. We did Rhoddy Buttress that day.
Tony, thanks for your initial post...inspiring and motivating.
A huge thanks to everyone who has put time in to clean at Houghton. (Will I get time to go there before the opening ends...!!!! Make time stupid!)
Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated.
Ta
Mick
In reply to TonyM:
Does anybody know what the current state of play with Poo is? Are the bolts still in it? Are they in good condition? Or have they/will they be replaced? Is there a policy in place about the bolts? Is it a sport route or a trad route? Is it clean?
I'd be keen to head over and have a look at some point but a bit of a heads up as to what it's like (and what equipment I'm likely to need) would be appreciated.
Does anybody know what the current state of play with Poo is? Are the bolts still in it? Are they in good condition? Or have they/will they be replaced? Is there a policy in place about the bolts? Is it a sport route or a trad route? Is it clean?
I'd be keen to head over and have a look at some point but a bit of a heads up as to what it's like (and what equipment I'm likely to need) would be appreciated.
In reply to Mick Ryan - Senior Editor - UKC:
- 'Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated'.
Mick ... Slightly patronising.
- 'Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated'.
Mick ... Slightly patronising.
Am I being naive in thinking that Rockfax aren't that bad - they seem to provide a product that a lot of people want. Furthermore, I actually quite like the selective guides as they mean I don't have to buy several different guides - if I didn't live in Lancashire I wouldn't have bought Lancashire rock as a large amount of climbing in the guide/lancashire seems fairly rubbish to me... The select guides tend to point me towards good climbs in good venues. But I guess climbing is all about different tastes.
Anyway, all slightly off-topic. Thank you to everyone who has been tidying up at Hoghton and I can't wait to get out there next week.
Anyway, all slightly off-topic. Thank you to everyone who has been tidying up at Hoghton and I can't wait to get out there next week.
In reply to dti:
That's the plan, we always manage to upset someone though that is never the intention.
Chris
> Am I being naive in thinking that Rockfax aren't that bad - they seem to provide a product that a lot of people want. Furthermore, I actually quite like the selective guides as they mean I don't have to buy several different guides - if I didn't live in Lancashire I wouldn't have bought Lancashire rock as a large amount of climbing in the guide/lancashire seems fairly rubbish to me... The select guides tend to point me towards good climbs in good venues. But I guess climbing is all about different tastes.
>
>
That's the plan, we always manage to upset someone though that is never the intention.
Chris
In reply to liam:
Not patronisiong at all.
Definitive guidebooks are the bedrock of our historical climbing record.
> (In reply to Mick Ryan - Senior Editor - UKC)
>
> - 'Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated'.
>
> Mick ... Slightly patronising.
>
> - 'Les ... god speed with the definitive guidebook, essential and wonderful work and much appreciated'.
>
> Mick ... Slightly patronising.
Not patronisiong at all.
Definitive guidebooks are the bedrock of our historical climbing record.
In reply to Les Ainsworth:
Everyone's different of course.
Personally I've been inspired by the improvements introduced by Rockfax to try to help produce a new Yorkshire Grit guide that's even better, but I can understand others feeling differently.
Not sure about the 'honey pot' thing. It's certainly not the case in my local area, the Northern England guide has some utter rubbish included, especially for the Moors, while omitting some quality routes and even crags. Maybe it's different in Lancashire, I rarely get over there - but having seen the photos, will definitely try to get to Hoghton next year (can't make it during this year's open period). I may even bring some secateurs and help with some of the easier routes...
> I am afraid that the definitive Lancs guidebook has been massively delayed due to the previous guideworkers being completely brassed off by Rockfax creaming off their work, creating 'honey pot' routes and crags by ignoring a lot of good climbing and often describing the climbs incorrectly
Everyone's different of course.
Personally I've been inspired by the improvements introduced by Rockfax to try to help produce a new Yorkshire Grit guide that's even better, but I can understand others feeling differently.
Not sure about the 'honey pot' thing. It's certainly not the case in my local area, the Northern England guide has some utter rubbish included, especially for the Moors, while omitting some quality routes and even crags. Maybe it's different in Lancashire, I rarely get over there - but having seen the photos, will definitely try to get to Hoghton next year (can't make it during this year's open period). I may even bring some secateurs and help with some of the easier routes...
In reply to TonyM:
Anyone interested in joining me as per link below?
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=469938
Anyone interested in joining me as per link below?
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=469938
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