UKC

I was reading the latest edition of Climb magazine last night (far and away the best UK magazine ever, such an improvement) and there was an article in it on the current state of play of Scottish trad. In it one of the current crop of Scottish activists said something like 'now days ascents of E8s and E9s go unnoticed' implying they are fairly common place. As the article seemed to focus on climbers *other* than Dave McLeod I was wondering what Scottish E9s had been repeated and by which climbers as they didn't seem to make the media. Anyone any idea?

In reply to Tyler:

It's out already is it? Did you also happen to notice any wittily written and gorgeously illustrated ice climbing destination articles? Just wondering...

<whistles innocently>

On the subject - I don't know about E9s, but it definitely felt a few years back (when E7 and 8 were still very big news) that Scottish climbers like Latter, Lines and Cubby didn't get a proportionate amount of attention to their very hard creations in comparison to Grit (and perhaps Lakes and North Wales). I suspect the Cornish/Devon lot would claim the same.

In reply to Tyler:

I think Dave Birkett repeated Hold Fast?

In reply to TobyA:

Was there much buzz about Icon of Lust when it was first done? And has it been repeated? There can't be many harder multi-pitch routes in Britain.

In reply to Tyler:

I wouldn't have thought so; I certainly havn't noticed that they go unnoticed.

In reply to Robert Durran:

There's a fair number of E8's that have been put up in the NE in recent years by local protagonists without too much fanfare. But I'm unaware of any E9s getting put up by anyone other than Dave Macleod and I don't think any of those have been repeated by anyone from North of the Border - but I may well be wrong.

In reply to Tyler:

The article went to very great lengths not to mention Dave M and managed to convey, in not so many words, a very dismissive attitude to headpointing. Maybe that was unintentional..maybe not.

In reply to TobyA:

It is out, I'm afriad I only had a quick flick through (this wasn't in the news agent I do have my own copy but left it home this week) but I did notice that you were actually named on the cover so obviously you are a name that shifts copy! It's the only reason I bought a copy

In reply to Bulls Crack:

It seemed a bit that way to me as well but that's good as we get to hear about all the drak horses.That's why it was a shame to hear about E9 repeats being hinted at but no details (it does say that doesn't it? I didn't imagine it. As I said above I don't have my copy to hand).

In reply to Tyler:

It might do - haven't got mine to hand either but what about DM's onsights/ground-ups eg Anubis - E8 was it?

In reply to gforce:


That's my understanding as well. Dave Birkett did do Hold Fast several years ago, but I believe he used side runners to reduce the seriousness of the runout start.

In reply to TobyA:

Have you seen it yet? If not the front cover is one for the scrap book, you are listed, in bold green letters, alongside (in this order I'm afraid) Hazel Findlay, Adam Ondra, Guy Robertson, Ed Douglas, Steve McLure and Toby Archer.

Great read but I thought you had a bit of a Gerald Ratner moment at the start when you described Finnish ice climbing as mediocre or some such!

In reply to Tyler:

The actual quote is '20 years ago there was a handful of climbers climbing E8 or E9, but now there are many and it doesn't seem a big deal when an E9 gets repeated or put up'. I guess he was refering more to the rest of the UK than Scotland specifically which seems a bit strange in an atricle specifically about Scotish climbs and climbers. A bit like someone from UK talking about UK climbing saying 8b+ onsights are no big deal when really in the are.

In reply to Tyler:

It is a good article, but the deliberate non mention of Dave Macleod was very bizarre.

Especially considering that some of the 'young' climbers in the photos looked older than Dave!

In reply to Tyler:

How many E9s are there in Scotland anyway?

Achemine
Direquiem?
Hold Fast
The Fugue
Present Tense
The Usual Suspects
...?

E10+
To Hell and Back
Die by the Drop
Rhapsody
Echo Wall
Longhope Direct

Pretty much all down to Dave Mac of course.

In reply to Tom Ripley Mountain Guide:

I assume this was done on purpose and explained by the part on internet blogging. Everyone knows what Dave Macleod gets up to and this article was more about lesser known people climbing hard routes. I haven't read the whole article but that is the impression i got.

In reply to Tom Ripley Mountain Guide:

I thought the article was good, but it would have made more sense set out as profiles of some of the current protagonists?

It's great to hear that the local Scottish scene is alive and kicking with E7s etc getting done ground up, but the article seemed to suggest that many of these routes had laid dormant as they haven't had repeats from Scots. The number of folk from the Welsh/Lakes scenes heading up to the Western Isles over the past two decades is not inconsiderable. Most of the routes on Strone have been put up by 'raiders' after all!

And the whole argument about sport climbing/bouldering fitness means you can go out and on-sight E7 in the mountains is a bit of a red herring I think. It's time and motivation that you need. Strong fingers help, but not as much as getting on the routes in the first place.

In reply to Tyler:

Whether its looks, climbing ability or interest to the climbing public, I'm sure I'm in the right place in that order!


Well that was sort of the idea. When I first mentioned to another Brit expat climber here that I was going to write the article, he said, not unfairly, "why would anyone fly over Norway to get here?" My only answer is that you don't actually fly over Norway, at least not from Manchester or further south. You go over Denmark and that's crap for ice! Besides, the Finns would never forgive me if I said it was the next Rjukan and suddenly the routes that there are had queues of noisy Brits at the bottom.

I have seen the front cover because Climb now have a very lush new website where you can see the first pages of the articles - including the Scottish one - on a very slick preview function.
http://www.greenshires.3dvp.co.uk/Climb_Preview_March_2012/

In reply to Dangerous Dave:

"this article was more about lesser known people climbing hard routes."

Yeah that was the general point - to show off some lesser known talented Scottish rock climbers, and lesser known bits of Scottish rock.

Cheers, Guy

In reply to Tom Briggs:

No, unfortunately in Scotland there are a great many routes, especially hard ones, which haven't seen any ascents - Scottish or otherwise - in almost a decade. Creag an Dubh Loch is one such crag were top quality routes fester away without ascents. The Scoop and Chisel on Sron Ulladale are perhaps two of the best routes in the UK (certainly unique within the UK) and combined had perhaps 4 ascents in the ten years prior to last Summer.

In reply to Ssshhh:

Is that to do with access or the Golden Eagle? The Scoop saw plenty of action 10+ years ago (I've done it twice (as well as The Chisel))...

In reply to Tom Briggs:

I suspect it's more to do with the fact it's not in North Wales! The bird restriction and the crag's relatively remote location certainly don't help.

I think it's just not in fashion to climb in the mountains at the minute. It's amusing, to me at least, that more people climb in the Scottish mountains in Winter than in Summer. It must be about a factor of 10 difference.

In reply to Ssshhh:

I guess the difference is that you usually have to go to the mountains to find winter climbing, whereas in summer there are lots of convenient outcrops. If we got reliable low level ice every year, I bet there wouldn't be as many people making the walks in.

It is a shame that amazing routes in the mountains get neglected, but on the other hand it's fantastic to get these places all to yourself

In reply to Ssshhh:

It's not amazing at all; you need nice weather to climb hard in the mountains in summer, but you can climb hard in winter in mediocre (or even pretty crap) weather and conditions. I bet there are far more days in a year when it is possiblr for people to climb IX in thre mountains than E9 (substitue V and E3 for mortals). But yes, winter climbing seems to be trendy just now, but rock climbing involving a bit of effort isn't!

In reply to Tyler:

It's not just Scotland where lots of new routes are ignored- anywhere outside of the Peak and Wales seems well off the radar. Even the Lakes seems a bit under-reported.


P.S. Robert, IX is not equivalent to E9, more like E6.

In reply to Jurgen A:

Whatever. My argument is still valid!

In reply to Robert Durran:

Except he said amusing, not amazing.

In reply to Robert Durran:

I agree it's not amazing, I used the word "amusing". And, yes, in Summer it does require a lot more things to come together to make hard mountain routes (and even some not so hard) enjoyable to climb.

In reply to Andy Moles:

Oops! I should have said "it is amusing but not surprising.......
Also, I think a lot of people who are prepared to travel repeatedly from south of the border to climb in Scotland in winter never bother in summer, partly due to the myth that it never stops raining in Scotland.