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As per the topic title: http://www.redpointclimbingcentre.co.uk/EmailArticle.aspx?id=1e09f07b264544... To be in Bedminster in the old Odeon Cinema with 75 lead and top rope routes up to 12m high and bouldering.
In reply to gazhbo:
Good question. There's TCA for bouldering, UCR for lead climbing and some bouldering, and Hengrove Park Leisure Centre's 8m small wall that I suspect gets hardly any traffic. More importantly, it's possible to climb outdoors around here all year round.
Good question. There's TCA for bouldering, UCR for lead climbing and some bouldering, and Hengrove Park Leisure Centre's 8m small wall that I suspect gets hardly any traffic. More importantly, it's possible to climb outdoors around here all year round.
In reply to Southern Man:
Best we can manage is slightly further west with the planned Extreme Rock climbing centre in the Weston Super Mare Leisure Dome at 40m high:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=468014 and http://www.leisuredome.co.uk/
However, it's all gone ominously quiet since late 2011...
Best we can manage is slightly further west with the planned Extreme Rock climbing centre in the Weston Super Mare Leisure Dome at 40m high:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=468014 and http://www.leisuredome.co.uk/
However, it's all gone ominously quiet since late 2011...
In reply to gazhbo:
I think so as UCR could do with some competition. It is getting rather ridiculous that some routes have not been changed in over 12 months and worse than that the holds are never cleaned.
The chalk dust in there is awful and really gets in your nose. I know this is always a problem with people climbing using chalk, but its about an inch thick on ledges around the centre. They may run the hoover around the floor but they could do with a deep clean.
I think so as UCR could do with some competition. It is getting rather ridiculous that some routes have not been changed in over 12 months and worse than that the holds are never cleaned.
The chalk dust in there is awful and really gets in your nose. I know this is always a problem with people climbing using chalk, but its about an inch thick on ledges around the centre. They may run the hoover around the floor but they could do with a deep clean.
In reply to sianabanana:
To be fair, UCR is in St Werburgh's, so that could just be a fine layer of ketamine that's just settled.
To be fair, UCR is in St Werburgh's, so that could just be a fine layer of ketamine that's just settled.
In reply to MonkeyPuzzle: ha ha
In reply to sianabanana:
I think the chalk dust at TCA is way worse, the air gets noticeably hazy on busy days. But that's just due to the confined nature of the space and popularity (and boulderers obsession with giant buckets of loose chalk). However, the route setting at TCA is some of the best...granted i've only climbed at about 10 Walls but it's easily the best i've climbed at. Plus they are constantly changing the routes and working to improve with recent renovations.
UCR could probably do with a gentle kick up the bum.
I think the chalk dust at TCA is way worse, the air gets noticeably hazy on busy days. But that's just due to the confined nature of the space and popularity (and boulderers obsession with giant buckets of loose chalk). However, the route setting at TCA is some of the best...granted i've only climbed at about 10 Walls but it's easily the best i've climbed at. Plus they are constantly changing the routes and working to improve with recent renovations.
UCR could probably do with a gentle kick up the bum.
In reply to gazhbo:
I'd happily be spoilt for choice with regards to climbing centres in Bristol, but i wouldn't want it to jepardise the existing centres due to clients being spread to thin, especially with Weston's climbing centre opening soon too.
I'd happily be spoilt for choice with regards to climbing centres in Bristol, but i wouldn't want it to jepardise the existing centres due to clients being spread to thin, especially with Weston's climbing centre opening soon too.
In reply to pocketrocket:
We reckon there's plenty of climbers in the area to go round, and from our experiences in other cities, more walls make more climbers, or at least encourage the existing population to get out (or in!) more. We're not trying to put anyone out of business, but hopefully be a welcome addition, with a good variety of routes, changed regularly, on some well designed and interestingly contoured walls. Oh, and we'll have a comfortable cafe, changing facilities and even a shower!
Keep an eye on progress at http://www.facebook.com/RedpointBristol
Cheers,
Tom
We reckon there's plenty of climbers in the area to go round, and from our experiences in other cities, more walls make more climbers, or at least encourage the existing population to get out (or in!) more. We're not trying to put anyone out of business, but hopefully be a welcome addition, with a good variety of routes, changed regularly, on some well designed and interestingly contoured walls. Oh, and we'll have a comfortable cafe, changing facilities and even a shower!
Keep an eye on progress at http://www.facebook.com/RedpointBristol
Cheers,
Tom
In reply to BristolRocks:
Good luck with the venture.
Any chance of making a point of ensuring that a good chunk of the wall is aimed at mimicking as closely as possible that part of local climbing that is a mix of vertical and the occasional bulge/marginally overhanging bit with lots of gastons, sidepulls, bad feet, undercuts? Not that many of the outdoor routes are on big holds on steeply overhanging features.
Good luck with the venture.
Any chance of making a point of ensuring that a good chunk of the wall is aimed at mimicking as closely as possible that part of local climbing that is a mix of vertical and the occasional bulge/marginally overhanging bit with lots of gastons, sidepulls, bad feet, undercuts? Not that many of the outdoor routes are on big holds on steeply overhanging features.
In reply to BristolRocks:
Route setting tends to involve putting up a certain set of holds in the expectation that you will use them all to do the route. Outside usually isn't like that. You could set a route and then put additional holds to make the sequence harder to work out. Even better, you could put up some routes the way nature does ie (effectively) randomly, and let climbers work it out and come up with a grade.
Route setting tends to involve putting up a certain set of holds in the expectation that you will use them all to do the route. Outside usually isn't like that. You could set a route and then put additional holds to make the sequence harder to work out. Even better, you could put up some routes the way nature does ie (effectively) randomly, and let climbers work it out and come up with a grade.
In reply to ericinbristol:
We are looking at having a section of artificial rock. One of the suppliers we are considering actually makes theirs from a cast of a piece of real rock, and it's pretty convincing actually! We have a choice of granite or limestone, what do you reckon?
Cheers,
Tom
We are looking at having a section of artificial rock. One of the suppliers we are considering actually makes theirs from a cast of a piece of real rock, and it's pretty convincing actually! We have a choice of granite or limestone, what do you reckon?
Cheers,
Tom
> (In reply to BristolRocks)
>
> Route setting tends to involve putting up a certain set of holds in the expectation that you will use them all to do the route. Outside usually isn't like that. You could set a route and then put additional holds to make the sequence harder to work out. Even better, you could put up some routes the way nature does ie (effectively) randomly, and let climbers work it out and come up with a grade.
>
> Route setting tends to involve putting up a certain set of holds in the expectation that you will use them all to do the route. Outside usually isn't like that. You could set a route and then put additional holds to make the sequence harder to work out. Even better, you could put up some routes the way nature does ie (effectively) randomly, and let climbers work it out and come up with a grade.
In reply to ericinbristol:
This is very true, and I often think it's one of the things that people find most odd in the transition from indoors to out, i.e. the fact that the next hold isn't painted bright yellow. One way round this is to grade the whole panel as a 'rainbow' route, using all the holds. Depending on the panel, this doesn't necessarily drop the grade as much as you might imagine.
In reply to BristolRocks:
Ideally one of each! But short of that I would go for one as close to limestone as possible as that's what people around here are mainly training for.
A rainbow panel is fine as long as it is not just a 'make up your own route by ignoring holds' panel covered in holds. That's way too artificial. My point would be to randomly put the holds on and let people work out the best, most efficient sequence for themselves, and also you'll find that there will be different ways of doing the route dependent on height, reach, specific strengths/weaknesses, flexibility. The optimum number is probably twice as many holds as a single-solution route.
Ideally one of each! But short of that I would go for one as close to limestone as possible as that's what people around here are mainly training for.
A rainbow panel is fine as long as it is not just a 'make up your own route by ignoring holds' panel covered in holds. That's way too artificial. My point would be to randomly put the holds on and let people work out the best, most efficient sequence for themselves, and also you'll find that there will be different ways of doing the route dependent on height, reach, specific strengths/weaknesses, flexibility. The optimum number is probably twice as many holds as a single-solution route.
How exciting Bristol really can do with a proper modern "roped centre"! I'll be one of your first visitors as I really dislike UCR in so many ways... as mentioned it's filthy, run down, poor value for money and rather annoyingly anything above a 5b has to be overhanging according to them...
Please don't allocate the majority of your wall space to leaning walls/overhangs to make it hard... slabs don't have to be littered with holds for kiddies they can be technical too(Llangorse does some really interesting ones on some of their slabs I wish more centres would take note!)
Another bugbear don't paint silly images all over the walls it starts to look tired really really quickly & makes an entire centre look run down fast... some bright panels/simple designs are enough to keep it cheerful.
Feature walls are fab & so much nicer than just flat panels, especially if you can't reach something it encourages you to be more creative.
Further a good air system & even better music system... actually I'd love a jukebox type feature! A bit retro, but when one gets fed up with what's been played all night you can go & add something you like to the mix. I've shortened my sessions at TCA before, because the music really started to grind on my nerves.
I've been to the odd wall where one can climb onto a platform. This is really good for practising real leading scenarios, especially when you're starting out.
As for membership packages not everyone wants monthly subscriptions I really liked the system where one could purchase 10 sessions for the price of 8 before & it's something I'd defo support. Also it is the kind of thing that'll make nice presents to friends who might come & join you from further afield now & again.
Good luck & I can't wait to come & support you!
Please don't allocate the majority of your wall space to leaning walls/overhangs to make it hard... slabs don't have to be littered with holds for kiddies they can be technical too(Llangorse does some really interesting ones on some of their slabs I wish more centres would take note!)
Another bugbear don't paint silly images all over the walls it starts to look tired really really quickly & makes an entire centre look run down fast... some bright panels/simple designs are enough to keep it cheerful.
Feature walls are fab & so much nicer than just flat panels, especially if you can't reach something it encourages you to be more creative.
Further a good air system & even better music system... actually I'd love a jukebox type feature! A bit retro, but when one gets fed up with what's been played all night you can go & add something you like to the mix. I've shortened my sessions at TCA before, because the music really started to grind on my nerves.
I've been to the odd wall where one can climb onto a platform. This is really good for practising real leading scenarios, especially when you're starting out.
As for membership packages not everyone wants monthly subscriptions I really liked the system where one could purchase 10 sessions for the price of 8 before & it's something I'd defo support. Also it is the kind of thing that'll make nice presents to friends who might come & join you from further afield now & again.
Good luck & I can't wait to come & support you!
In reply to BristolRocks:
Don't bother... Artificial rock is more expensive and less versatile. You get stuck with it as it is, reduced route setting possibilities and people get bored with them very fast. Flat ply is the way, easy to update with volumes to change the dynamics plus they can have much higher t-nut density for setting. Easy to freshen up with paint and sponsors.
Don't set routes at random get proper setters who know what they are doing. Setting can make a crap wall good or a good wall crap.
> We are looking at having a section of artificial rock.
Don't bother... Artificial rock is more expensive and less versatile. You get stuck with it as it is, reduced route setting possibilities and people get bored with them very fast. Flat ply is the way, easy to update with volumes to change the dynamics plus they can have much higher t-nut density for setting. Easy to freshen up with paint and sponsors.
Don't set routes at random get proper setters who know what they are doing. Setting can make a crap wall good or a good wall crap.
In reply to JIMBO:
I don't mean set them all at random, but a selection. And also by random I don't mean completely random. IYSWIM
I don't mean set them all at random, but a selection. And also by random I don't mean completely random. IYSWIM
In reply to JIMBO: Agreed
In reply to ericinbristol:
+1 for limestone.
> (In reply to BristolRocks)
>
> Ideally one of each! But short of that I would go for one as close to limestone as possible as that's what people around here are mainly training for.
>
> Ideally one of each! But short of that I would go for one as close to limestone as possible as that's what people around here are mainly training for.
+1 for limestone.
In reply to ericinbristol:
If you are going to have slabs (which would be very nice) then can you try to do something about the airflow and the dust levels?
The Reading wall extension has some nice slabs and good routes, but I keep feeling that I want someone to give tham a brush before I try something at my limit because everything is coated in fine dust.
If you are going to have slabs (which would be very nice) then can you try to do something about the airflow and the dust levels?
The Reading wall extension has some nice slabs and good routes, but I keep feeling that I want someone to give tham a brush before I try something at my limit because everything is coated in fine dust.
In reply to BristolRocks:
Granite please!
First i've heard of a new bristol wall. I hope it all goes well! would be great for me as i'm closer to bedminster then i am to the other walls
> (In reply to ericinbristol)
>
> We are looking at having a section of artificial rock. One of the suppliers we are considering actually makes theirs from a cast of a piece of real rock, and it's pretty convincing actually! We have a choice of granite or limestone, what do you reckon?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Tom
>
> We are looking at having a section of artificial rock. One of the suppliers we are considering actually makes theirs from a cast of a piece of real rock, and it's pretty convincing actually! We have a choice of granite or limestone, what do you reckon?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Tom
Granite please!
First i've heard of a new bristol wall. I hope it all goes well! would be great for me as i'm closer to bedminster then i am to the other walls
In reply to JIMBO:
Agree. I've never been as much of a fan of artificial rock stuff, you get too used to the features, and I think its actually quite hard to set well on a mix of bolt-ons and features-for-feet, the routes so often seem unsatisfactory in some way.
Whilst I like Erics suggestion of a wall about ten degrees over covered in screw-on feet and sideways crimps, I'd also really like a dead simple flat panel at about 30 degrees over to allow training for steep stuff abroad... if anything I'd say thats even more important because the amount of that locally is limited whilst if you want to train for Cheddar there's always post-work Cheddar sessions to train in (for 6 months of the year at least)
Agree. I've never been as much of a fan of artificial rock stuff, you get too used to the features, and I think its actually quite hard to set well on a mix of bolt-ons and features-for-feet, the routes so often seem unsatisfactory in some way.
Whilst I like Erics suggestion of a wall about ten degrees over covered in screw-on feet and sideways crimps, I'd also really like a dead simple flat panel at about 30 degrees over to allow training for steep stuff abroad... if anything I'd say thats even more important because the amount of that locally is limited whilst if you want to train for Cheddar there's always post-work Cheddar sessions to train in (for 6 months of the year at least)
Thanks for all your suggestions, and your support. In answer to a couple of the specific questions:
- If we do include any artificial rock, it will only be a modest section, 3 - 4 lines. I agree that it can get a bit repetitive, but a small area might be nice for people who've never been on real rock, or just for when you fancy a change?
- In terms of ventilation, there is an enormous fan on the roof, under the turret. We've had it running, and it provides quite a good flow of air through the building, which should help to clear the dust, although as it's sucking large volumes of fresh air in from outside it's obviously only useful when it's warm!
A couple of questions for you all:
- Auto-belays. Do you like them? Would you use them? Again, we're obviously not talking about the whole centre, just 4 or 5.
- We are considering offering some kind of 'early bird' discount on annual passes for those who sign up before opening. Would this be of interest? If so, what sort of discount would we need to offer to make this an attractive proposition?
Once again, thanks for the input,
Cheers,
Tom
- If we do include any artificial rock, it will only be a modest section, 3 - 4 lines. I agree that it can get a bit repetitive, but a small area might be nice for people who've never been on real rock, or just for when you fancy a change?
- In terms of ventilation, there is an enormous fan on the roof, under the turret. We've had it running, and it provides quite a good flow of air through the building, which should help to clear the dust, although as it's sucking large volumes of fresh air in from outside it's obviously only useful when it's warm!
A couple of questions for you all:
- Auto-belays. Do you like them? Would you use them? Again, we're obviously not talking about the whole centre, just 4 or 5.
- We are considering offering some kind of 'early bird' discount on annual passes for those who sign up before opening. Would this be of interest? If so, what sort of discount would we need to offer to make this an attractive proposition?
Once again, thanks for the input,
Cheers,
Tom
In reply to AJM: Agree with you. We have vertical crimpy techny climbing aplenty here in the UK so we are more than trained for it, whereas we need to train our weaknesses which is overhanging pumpy climbing so that we can smash it when we go abroad. Half and half seems a good medium I think
In reply to Tom Gape 2:
Not that I'm bristol-based, but I think auto-belays are great. Not only for the lone climber (I used to go to Leeds wall on weekday lunchtimes), but if you are climbing in a three, the third person can actually do something apart from heckle...
not that heckling is bad...
Not that I'm bristol-based, but I think auto-belays are great. Not only for the lone climber (I used to go to Leeds wall on weekday lunchtimes), but if you are climbing in a three, the third person can actually do something apart from heckle...
not that heckling is bad...
In reply to Tom Gape 2:
I would like to see a lot more cracks to climb indoors from hairline to hands to offwidth, both lead and bouldering.
I would like to see a lot more cracks to climb indoors from hairline to hands to offwidth, both lead and bouldering.
In reply to Tom Gape 2:
Bristol could do with a modern lead wall. My wish list:
Make it a higher version of TCA, or The Works: flat panels, rather than "featured" stuff. Build interest by using modular volumes. "Artificial rock" is a gimmick that would soon feel tired and dated.
High, and gently overhanging.
Use pro route setters, and change routes regularly and often. Limit the steep jug-fests. The routes are the product you sell. Many potentially nice centres fail by trying to save on their route setting. Publish your routes online, and encourage people to comment and discuss grades. Grade your routes consistently. It can be done.
Make it a credible place for good climbers to train - no (or limited, at least) kiddie parties, proper training features (systems boards, campus area etc). If you pander to the "F6a" majority it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy - encourage people to improve.
Run regular competitions - it's a great way to build a community.
Run it with staff who are climbers - for climbers by climbers, rather than as a leisure centre.
Listen to customer feedback. Keep the centre clean (including toilets!) and bright.
Make it cool in the summer, and warm enough in the winter. Invest in proper air conditioning, not just fans.
Bristol could do with a modern lead wall. My wish list:
Make it a higher version of TCA, or The Works: flat panels, rather than "featured" stuff. Build interest by using modular volumes. "Artificial rock" is a gimmick that would soon feel tired and dated.
High, and gently overhanging.
Use pro route setters, and change routes regularly and often. Limit the steep jug-fests. The routes are the product you sell. Many potentially nice centres fail by trying to save on their route setting. Publish your routes online, and encourage people to comment and discuss grades. Grade your routes consistently. It can be done.
Make it a credible place for good climbers to train - no (or limited, at least) kiddie parties, proper training features (systems boards, campus area etc). If you pander to the "F6a" majority it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy - encourage people to improve.
Run regular competitions - it's a great way to build a community.
Run it with staff who are climbers - for climbers by climbers, rather than as a leisure centre.
Listen to customer feedback. Keep the centre clean (including toilets!) and bright.
Make it cool in the summer, and warm enough in the winter. Invest in proper air conditioning, not just fans.
We have purposely visited two walls that have real rock and really enjoyed them both but like others have said, once built you are stuck with them and regulars will soon get bored.
I like the higher and more technical climbs that UCR can provide but I agree with those who say the place is filthy. The reception is covered in a thick layer of dust and the receptionist is not exactly enthusiastic. When we went along she said, 'sorry but I can't let you in if you are not a member' before turning back to her laptop. Fortunately I had read the website and understood I could become a member that day by paying £2 and passing a little test. When I pointed that out to her she just stared at me blankly. I re-explained things to her before she begrudgingly came to serve us but then when we came to pay we were told they don't take cards and we would have to go to a cash-point 15 minutes walk away.
I enjoyed the routes but I wouldn't go back because the service was appalling.
I like the higher and more technical climbs that UCR can provide but I agree with those who say the place is filthy. The reception is covered in a thick layer of dust and the receptionist is not exactly enthusiastic. When we went along she said, 'sorry but I can't let you in if you are not a member' before turning back to her laptop. Fortunately I had read the website and understood I could become a member that day by paying £2 and passing a little test. When I pointed that out to her she just stared at me blankly. I re-explained things to her before she begrudgingly came to serve us but then when we came to pay we were told they don't take cards and we would have to go to a cash-point 15 minutes walk away.
I enjoyed the routes but I wouldn't go back because the service was appalling.
In reply to DemolitionRed: Untill you have seen the new mock rock by Walltopia I dont think anyone can comment, it truly is awesome and every climbing centre should have some. It is about time that climbing walls in the UK started looking at walls being built in the USA and the rest of Europe to see the future of indoor climbing....just my opinion
In reply to ericinbristol:
Autobelays are always great.
I'd also really like to see some cracks. I don't know how feasible it is to build them as part of an indoor wall but it would be brilliant to just have one or two.
Autobelays are always great.
I'd also really like to see some cracks. I don't know how feasible it is to build them as part of an indoor wall but it would be brilliant to just have one or two.
In reply to Kemics:
Alien Rock in Edinburgh has a couple of crack lines that run from floor to ceiling (IIRC - it's been a while since I went there). The good thing is that they don't take up much wall "real estate" and can be climbed in isolation or as part of easier routes with bolt-on holds. A nice finger crack and a slightly wider fist/hand crack would be great, and good training for outside
Alien Rock in Edinburgh has a couple of crack lines that run from floor to ceiling (IIRC - it's been a while since I went there). The good thing is that they don't take up much wall "real estate" and can be climbed in isolation or as part of easier routes with bolt-on holds. A nice finger crack and a slightly wider fist/hand crack would be great, and good training for outside
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