In reply to deepsoup:
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> You didn't respond to my hypothetical case - should Right Unconquerable also be repaired? Should A35 have been repaired before M35 was led? Should M35 be repaired now?
Unless I'm mistaken M35 has since been re-climbed as 'May35'.
>In reply to shark:
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>For the purpose of illustration let's assume the act of replacing the flake took place in the middle of the night and the following day you took a look at it and couldn't tell even on abseil how the flake had been re-fixed. What difference would it make ? or is just that the mental shutters come down when bolt and grit are used in the same sentence.
Well unless you propose erasing history, we would all know it had been repaired. It is not as simple as an aversion to bolts on grit, the lack of bolts on grit is the result of an entire philosophy of adventure; that the rock is the challenge and you do not change it. Clearly that philosophy does not apply at Raven tor where the climbs would not exist had not the hand of man created them.
In reply to Graham Hoey:
>4. Runners are still available lower down the flake e.g. Chouinard stopper 2, filed down RP2, RP3, HB curved brass 2 and 3 to name but a few. It would however be harder to get these in now the good handhold has gone.
There was a piece in situ for a good few months even after the flake had broken, I think it was the blue WC superlight half-a-rock that was left in after KJ's ascent due to the difficulty of removal. I'm not sure anyone would have been happy to fall onto that single piece though, and as you say placing them would be much harder. PS where do you get a Chouinard stopper 2 nowadays!
>6. It has not yet received a proper ground up ascent, unless you count yo-yoing as ground up.
As far as I've understood it, the definition of ground-up has always included yo-yoing. That's not to say there isn't much to improve on where this route and style is concerned.