UKC

In other news: this just in from Chris McNamara @ www.supertopos.com.

"Well, I guess The Nose of El Cap record of 4:22 wasn't as invincible as everyone thought. In the past month the time has trimmed (or slashed?) three times.

First, Timmy O'Neill and Dean Potter took the time from 4:22 (previously held by Peter Croft and Hans Florine) to 3:59. Hans posted the time on his email news list and said (slyly?) "That's going to be tough to beat" Yet, a short while later, Hans and Jim Herson trimmed the time to 3:57.

Well, after that I thought "Guess that is the end of The Nose race." I couldn't have been more wrong. A few days ago Timmy O'Neill and Dean Potter dropped the record down to 3:24. Ridiculous!

For those of you who don't know, The Nose is 2900 feet tall and 31 pitches long so that works out to about 6.5 minutes a pitch."

Mick
(Climbing media please cite your souces)

In reply to Mick: that is just awesome.

In reply to Mick: How do they do it Mick? Do they simul-climb with runners?

In reply to Mick:

Who is Climbing Media? Must be one of those ghost websites!

In reply to Mick:

I figure they've done it before this speed record?

But whats the point? Its all well and good zooming up these things but I would imagine it takes away somethng of the climb? Jolly well done tho.

In reply to Mick:
From what I've heard it's brown sauce (from HB if Shane's got anything to do with it. Ha Ha Ha

In reply to JO - allegedly working:

Florine and Potter are leap frogging at the moment. Quite a bit of rivalary there. Yes they simul-climb, lead in blocks, and place very little gear.

What's the point?

Good question. What's the point of climbing anyway? I think you'll find your answer if you ask yourself that question.

For Potter et al, it adds quite a bit to the climbing experience, I'm sure.

Mick

In reply to Adam Lincoln:

Cob web sites, Ads.

Only kidding.

Ooooh,

Mick

In reply to JO - allegedly working: Speed climbing can be very enjoyable. I've never had that much stamina, so speed climbing has always been a necessity for me. I think my best ever climbing experience was Bat out of Hell on Higgar in 45 seconds. The Nose used to take the best (worst?) part of 2 days however. There are many who would have loved to have been able to do it in a day, and saved hauling all that gear and water !

In reply to John Kirk and oor Mick:

Ah well then! I only ever run up a climb if a)its got dark and i've obviously larked about enough or b)I've forgotten that I should have been somewhere else about 3 hours ago.

However, I didn't say it was wrong ethically to speed climb guys. Just said I couldn't see the point PERSONALLY. Climbing for me is about savouring the experience as long as is humanly possible without annoying anyone else that wants to climb behind me.

In reply to Joey:

"Climbing for me is about savouring the experience as long as is humanly possible without annoying anyone else that wants to climb behind me."

I think we are all with you there, even those who do a bit of speed climbing now and again.

Mick

In reply to Mick: Incredible as the time is, as scary and amasing as some of these aid routes are, I ask the following. (based on a recent stay in camp 4) Why is it when in most of the rest of the world when the points of aid are reduced that sets the standard for the next ascentionsist (indeed to use more aid is often regarded as a non-ascent); that in the states people still Aid their way up free routes. Why are the younger generation of climbers in the states not inspired by the likes of Hill et al towards free ascents. Ah well Im of to aid my way up London Wall or Coventry street in the dark in 4 min 32 sec beat that!!!

In reply to Ladyboy:

"Ah well Im of to aid my way up London Wall or Coventry street in the dark in 4 min 32 sec beat that!!!"

And you can, as long as you clean aid them - nuts only. The El Cap routes are very imposing and tall, full of history, adventure, and are often the climax of a climbers life. Most aren't able to free climb them (The Nose, NA Wall) but that doesn't mean they can't enjoy them as aid climbs, as long as they don't damage them.

More climbers over here are attempting the established El Cap free routes. They are inspired by the likes of Hill, the Huber sisters, Thaw and Wainright, Caldwell and the General, and that drag queen Leo Houlding and his transexual partner Jason Pickles.

Mick R

In reply to Ladyboy:

Most people free climb as much of these routes as they can and many of them have mandatory free climbing. But Lynn Hill is the only person to make a continuous lead of the Nose and to my knowledge the only person to have led the great roof. A combination of free climbing/french free and aid climbing are required by most people to get up. But lots, well quite a few anyway, are making free ascents. Tommy Caldwell, the Huber brothers etc.

In reply to Iain McTaggart: I appreciate that Iain, perhaps I should clarrify. Take a route in Britain that was aided, its then done free, subsequently all other ascents sent out to free the route even if in the end they fail. Such cannot be said of the Nose, where even very competent parties set out with the intention of aiding as much as possible. As we know once you start its hard to stop. It seems getting up the route by any means is more important than the style. And I do appreciate just how difficult even that can be, do ends justify the means, is size important after all. It seems very much out of step with the rest of climbing.

In reply to Ladyboy:

Is this an our style is better than your style discusion or is just about size? Well if it is the Nose is quite a bit bigger than that crack at Millstone, and who says people don't aid that, or at least hang on gear. Take a portaledge and a pig, could be a fun month out.

Mick

In reply to Ladyboy: aid climbing is just different fun. It is a bit like saying Rugby would be 'better' if you didn't use your hands. No it wouldn't it would be football, a different type of sport. Mick's point about clean aid is very fair though.

I desperately want to climb El Cap and I'm so shite I'd have to aid all of it!

In reply to TobyA:

Check out Chris Mc's "Road To The Nose" at www.supertopos.com and book your flight.

Mick

In reply to Mick: Its finding a partner who I would wnat to spend three days in that close proximity with which is the biggest problem. My one mate who I would love to climb it with is loosing interest in climbing, see the "Cobweb Crack" thread.

"Can you make the coffee down that end of the portaledge as I'm going to have a sh*t at the other?"
I mean how many people could you seriously have a conversation like that with?

In reply to TobyA: No need for a portaledge as there are rather accommodating ledges in the middle on Boot and Texas flake. If you get to one of these by the end of Day One, you can start early and finish the route in two days. In my time the first 6 pitches were nearly always fixed so you get a slingshot on Day 1. If you do go to the Valley looking for a partner - try something else together first - like DNB on Middle Cathedral to see how you do together. Beware - there are any number of geeks that you could get stuck with, especially the ones with the very shiny racks walking around the campsites

In reply to John Kirk:

: ) Good advice John.

Mick

In reply to TobyA:

Toby - give Liz at Stone Nudes an email. She's a Yosemite type person and I'm sure would make a great partner for the Nose.

She's in this years Stone Nudes Calendar - forgotten which month. But just to give you a clue she's known as the 'Up-draft'.

And maybe you could both pose for next years - Stone Nude couples calendar on the Great Roof pitch.

cheers,

Mick

In reply to Mick: I like to think Im above such a level of debate so I would be grateful if you not to reduce it thus.In any case it is somewhat presumtious of you to assume knowledge of my nationality. I am also perfectly aware of the differential in size between Millstone and El Cap. So, to take Mick R remarks nobody has a problem with me aiding up any route as long as I keep it clean. I wonder how long it would be befor we would have a thread relating to this here on rocktalk. The acceptable ethics in the valley strike me as lacking vision and refusing the challenge set down by the likes of Hill. Lets be clear I readily acknowledge the difficulty of climbing the nose even with aid.

In reply to Ladyboy:

"The acceptable ethics in the valley strike me as lacking vision and refusing the challenge set down by the likes of Hill."

It's used to be called the "Valley Syndrome". Lethargy.

However: the speed climbing groups are pushing the envelope, both single route and link-ups. Potter's solo exploits are remarkable. Houlding and Pickles just freed most of the Leaning Tower, the Huber sisters have left an amazing legacy on El Cap, as said: others like Waingright and Thaw, Tommy Caldwell and Nick Sagar have achieved great free versions of big walls.

As we speak there are teams trying to free other big walls.

I think the gauntlet has been picked up by many.....and of several nationalities...as if that matters.