UKC

I've got fairly abysmal lower body flexibility (eg if I try to touch my toes when I'm not warmed up I can barely get past the knees...) to the point where I think it's actually holding me back in my climbing a bit.

I'd like to do some stretching to get a bit closer to average. I've been recommended to various stretches, but I'm not sure how much / how often I should be doing them. Is there any consensus on how much stretching you need to be doing to make some sort of difference?

Realistically, I'm probably either going to be doing stretching during my sessions at the wall (so roughly 2-3 times a week) or quickly after I've biked home (so about five times a week, but with much less time available).

Any ideas?

In reply to Ramblin dave:

I never stretch and I do this often

In reply to Ramblin dave:

I'm interested in this - anyone got a good 15 - 20 minute stretching routine I could do 3 or 4 times a week?

E

In reply to Enty:

Yes, it's called yoga. Do a class once a week and after a while, you'll know enough to do 15-20 mins of stretching on a daily basis. Basically a bunch of sun salutes will take 20 mins and can be done first thing on a daily basis.

+1 yoga, find a professional especially with such crap flex, no disrespect intended but not past the knees isnt good sir.

learn the yoga moves that help and then note them and use them outside the sessions.

oooh and be careful in the yoga not to over stretch and tear/hurt something, tempting and MTFU and push too far but it can have consequences and leave you injured easily.

In reply to Ramblin dave: I rely on flexibility/agility a lot when climbing. My norm is to stretch for 5-15min (depending on the length/intensity of the session)every time after climbing.

Stretching after riding will work too, so do it! and good luck

In reply to mattrm:
To be honest, I'm not sure I've got the time to commit to a regular weekly yoga class - it'd come out of climbing time, which would be a Bad Thing.

And to be honest, I'm reasonably happy with the idea of what stretching I want to do (ie stuff that's fairly specifically targeted towards lower body flexibility for climbing), I was just wondering whether anyone had any experience of how much you need to do to make a noticeable difference.

In reply to krasavenko:
Thanks!

In reply to Ramblin dave:

I do a regular lower body stretching session that takes around 10 minutes max. It is taken from my old Karate lessons. I'm sure that you could find something on YouTube. I fitted it into rest periods in bouldering sessions at the wall. Maybe only two to three times weekly. Go slowly as improvements come gradually.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

I do stretching at the start and finish of all my climbing sessions, I have taken parts from Yoga, Ballet and Karate to come up with something that works for me. One of my climbing partners joins me with the stretching but one pretty much refuses to do any, strangely when it comes to a high step or taking a rest in a frog position the bloke that doesn't stretch always seems to have trouble.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

You don't need to do loads of sessions. Just a few weeks worth to get the hang of it and then you can just poses off the internets. It really is very good. I find when I'm doing lots of yoga I do get a lot of my general niggles going away. So I think it's well worth doing.

In reply to mattrm:

+1

OP do a couple to learn the basics then continue using them, you dont need to do a class every week.

My yoga instructor did a class specifically for cyclists and runners, cyclists she said were the worst, like coiled granny knots. Looking at how bad i was knotted, she was spot on.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

I stretch before and after exercise at least twice a week, maybe 3 times.

Over the last year of doing this my flexibility is much much better.

I'm not that sure it has improved my climbing specifically, but I do think its a good thing.

Just remember to warm up before static stretching, so maybe dynamic stretching is better at the beginning of a session.

If you are trying to increase your flexibility, then try more static stretching at the end of your session when you are nice and warm.

If in the beginning, if you feel like you are getting nowhere, it will come and will improve. Just like everything else, it takes time.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

Yoga is very good, I know a few climbers who say 'you do yoga, that's why you can do that'.
I use DVD's the most, Rodney Yee is a good DVD instructor and has a very good AM/PM DVD that would be good, about 15-20mins each, definitely would help a lot.

(Sorta feel like a continuation of the post I just wrote about being pro sports physio...)

In my experience some of my issues have been solved via prescribed stretching, they tend to say do 1-2 sessions per day, during each session hold each stretch for 15-30 seconds repeating 3-5 times per stretch.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

Stretching may not the be all and end all, specifically the end range static stretching or holding the end range stretching with little or no intention.

But what do I know.

Try reading a book called Becoming A Supple Leopard by Dr Kelly Starrett, he knows a thing or two.

In reply to Ramblin dave:
I got some advice on this from a friend who instructs various bendyness related stuff.

Her advice was that if you've got a good set of static stretches for the things that you want to be more flexible, you should:
* hold each stretch for about 30 seconds, pushing slightly deeper into the stretch about half way through if you can
* do two reps of each stretch with about 30 seconds rest in between (or in the case of things like leg stretches, do one leg for 30 seconds then the other then the first leg again then the other again.)
* do this about four times a week
* remember that if you're doing long stretches to improve flexibility then you'll need to allow some recovery time and not overdo it, just like with strength training. So two reps of 30 seconds each is your days stretch for that hamstring, not something that you go back and do again half an hour later.

There's been some scientific studies reported in recent years that stretching in some contexts actually _reduces_ muscular performance.

I'm not qualified to assess those results, but might want to check it out.

also ...
Guess how much stretching is recommended in the book "9 out of 10 climbers ... ".

In reply to kenr: how much?.. go on ..

In reply to pork pie girl:

pretty sure there have been several studies showing this but here is a link to one

http://www.anatomytrains.com/main/wp-content/uploads/manual/acute_stretch.p...

In reply to Ramblin dave:

This sounds a lot like the advice in Stretching Scientifically. A superb book on stretching that was very popular amongst martial artists inthe late 80s and early 90s. It covers passive and active stretching.

In reply to Ramblin dave: Fitness blender on you tube have some good stretching workouts. All between 5 - 15 min long

In reply to Ramblin dave: Maybe it has already been suggested before, but check out this site http://www.kitlaughlin.com/

In reply to ashley1_scott:

Don't know why he refuses but if he particularly refuses the pre-climbing stretching it might be because he wants to avoid getting injured. I used to stretch (static holds etc) before climbing but when I looked a bit more into it I realised that I am more likely to get injured if I stretch so I replaced most of the stretching with mobility exercises. Might be worth bearing in mind if you find you get injured often.

Regarding the original post, I am in the same boat and had the same goal/wish. Then I took up yoga for a couple of years and it did wonders for my general flexibility, agility, body awareness, balance etc and I was getting noticeably less injuries from climbing. HOWEVER my hamstrings remained quite stiff, there was some improvement but I can't say I ever moved beyond average if that even.

For super tight hamstrings I found that a key challenge is to even be able to get into positions that stretch them effectively (I couldn't even sit down with legs stretched) - using blocks (to sit on) and straps really helped me and also doing lots of stretching while standing up and letting gravity do the work, if you are as inflexible as me you'll find it more effective to stretch with bent knees for a while until you are flexible enough to be effective with straight knees.

In reply to Simos:
I'm no expert but I heard that torturing yourself with them foam rolls can make a difference.

In reply to Ramblin dave: I don't have time for classes but have found this yoga website full of videos very good (and it's free!)

http://www.doyogawithme.com/

In reply to kenr:
Who needs strong legs to climb? I'd take being able to get my feet high over having strong quads or whatever. Its also my excuse to not start running- it might make me less stretchy.
My mate had a yoga video which he said did wonders (while he persevered).

In reply to riddle:

This is a good suggestion.

Not got the book - yet - but mobilitywod.com (Kelly starrett's website) has some excellent stuff on it. Used to be all free stuff, but you can search back through the episodes to get loads of the old free videos.

It's seems to be about trying to get full range of motion and improving the quality of your muscles, tendons and things. Go back to episode 1 and try the 10 min squat test.

In reply to Ramblin dave:
It will help your climbing. Start in short 5 minute session a little bit every day. Get into a routine and you won't notice that 5 minute session.

In reply to Ramblin dave:

a pal sent me this a while back... i keep meaning to read through myself as i'm a down to the middle of my shins toe toucher.

as above though i think the advice of taking it easy and slowly progressing is probably sensible as overstretching will probably put you out of action for a while

http://www.stadion.com/flexibility-training-for-sports-and-martial-arts/