In reply to needvert:
> Kirkpatrick is a great climber, he's done some really ballsy things.
> But, Mr Lopez may well have spent more hours on rope. He may even have more advanced skills on rope. (And even if he hasn't, he may still be onto something with the inline foe vs a.b thing.) I'm not sure, I don't know him. But, some of what he says rings true for me.
> Might pull out the caving books and play around with the inline FoE, I imagine there's good reason they all mention it.
It's nothing to do with whether one knot is actually superior for another.
It's about calling someone an armchair climber the moment you disagree with them. Obviously Andy Kirkpatrick thinks the Alpine Butterfly, to quote him is 'wonderful', is he also an armchair climber?
Now the Alpine butterfly is a very good knot. Quick to tie (in the vast majority of cases). Weighted, iced and "I want to be a snake" rope make all knots more difficult to tie that is true. (I'm glad guides have got technical names for that stuff now by the way!)
It's quick to adjust (once familiar with the knot). I can certainly extend the loop from 5 to 7 meters within 2 seconds (what a strange criteria). It's also about the easiest knot to untie, there's no gains to be made there. It works for people like Andy K because quite often they are rigging ropes that need to be able to take loads from both sides, and I'm sure he manages to tie one fine with the weight of the rope on it too.
If you were struggling to tie it, and you were sure it's only going to be loaded from one direction, sure chuck a inline figure 8 in there, who gives a shit? But if it gets set in the wrong direction for just a moment it's just going to fail, it's not a 'general purpose' knot as it's not stable enough.
The inline figure of eight is best for some rescue situations the preserve the maximum rope strength (over a standard figure eight with the shear forces) and it's also good for hauling from the middle of the rope. Nothing wrong with knowing it and it's sometimes just the ticket because it's genuinely a very good knot for those purposes, rather than being the easiest to tie under conditions X, Y and Z.
Post edited at 11:18