UKC

I've recently returned from a trip to the Dolomites where there are loads of cyclists out on the roads. What struck me is generally how considerate car drivers there are towards cyclists when overtaking them on mountain roads.

Now I'm not used to driving on twisty mountain roads in a hire car I hardly know on the "wrong" side of the roads, so on the whole by Italian standards I was a slow driver which seemed to make cars coming up behind me take big risks (or so they seemed to my untrained eye) in overtaking me on hairpins.

However as soon as I came up behind cyclists and slowed down until I could overtake them safely, the tailgating italians backed off and seemed perfectly happy to let me overtake the cyclists once I could see properly ahead and felt it safe to do so. The following Italians also took loads of care overtaking the cyclists, then raced up behind me again only to overtake me in a silly place.

Strange, but refreshing to see such consideration towards cyclists.

To those Italian drivers I held up, sorry for being a slow coach, I'm sure that with a lifetime of experience on your twisty mountain roads I'll build up the confidence to hare round hairpins into the face of the unknown which from time to time might turn out to be a truck which has pulled out ready to take the bend. I might even by then have stopped trying to punch a hole through the door when I start trying to change gear with my left hand........

In reply to Trangia:

When ever the subject of cycling and cars interacting comes up, this obvious discrepancy between uk and European driving standards highlights how woefully cyclists are treated in this country on the whole. Everywhere I have been on the continent is the same - mental driving most of the time but proper consideration for vulnerable road users

In reply to Trangia:
I remember reading something years back that made a good case for the most important factor in comparing cyclist safety in many western countries was the number of cyclists on the road. It probably goes further than the driver being conditioned to "think bike" because they are often in view. When it is a culturally normal thing for either transport or sport then people don't see an annoying slow moving thing on the road but think of their daughter, nephew or oma or themselves on another day. In the UK all too often people will think "why is he slowing me down when I pay for the roads" while too fluffing stupid to realise these people likely have cars too.

In reply to balmybaldwin:


My experience is that on quieter roads with good visibility either in UK or mainland Europe drivers are pretty courteous. In busier areas drivers are capable of being knob heads anywhere. I think this obvious discrepancy is a bit of a strawman.

In reply to Trangia:

Are you sure we are talking about the same Italian drivers that have little or no regard to blind corners when it comes to overtaking you if you are driving a minibus?

In reply to GrahamD:

So comparing leaving London at midday, and arriving in Paris in the middle of the following day isn't comparable?

The difference wasn't small, it was astonishing. Similarly Riding country roads in Belgium, Italy, Spain, France (I'll exclude Switz as it's mainly mountainous) is a real pleasure compared to riding country lanes the length and breadth of this Country.

Roads which are quieter and have good visibility have never been the problem in the UK either in most cases, the problem is when drivers force through passes against oncoming traffic, fail to make room, get impatient on a hill and hurl abuse etc.

In reply to ByEek:


I had a driver overtake me on a blind bend yesterday . I was cycling . cut in right in front of me . but not soon enough to miss the car coming the other way . only took his wing mirror off though. still in the road this morning so I picked it up . made me chuckle at the time , but could have been a lot worse.

In reply to balmybaldwin:

And yet I'm often baffled by how close a minority of drivers will get to the cyclist, even when they can see the road is completely clear for miles ahead (and indeed when other drivers in front of them are passing nice and wide) they seem strangely reluctant to cross the centre line.

I like this Scottish ad - mixes the message with a nice bit of whimsy:
youtube.com/watch?v=OW_LtlsreTc&

In reply to balmybaldwin:

Your riding experience in the UK obviously differs very much from mine. I've found drivers to be pretty good on the country lanes I cycle on in the UK.

In reply to ByEek:

Yes, I was wondering that myself. Italy terrifies me at times.

In reply to Trangia:

It's not just cyclists, I just got back from a 2 week motorcycle tour of the French alps and cars with European number plates practically put them selves in ditches to get out of the way and let me pass, one member of our group was terrified of heights and riding very very slow (but refused to quit) and again European cars and motorcycle and even pedal cycles (yes she was going that slow) gave her loads of room but when it came to overtaking anything with 4 or more wheels they were nutters.
The few UK cars we came across was a different story though, one price sat behind her with his hand on the horn whilst she was tackling a series of hairpins and another drifting all over the road trying to block me from overtaking.

In reply to Trangia:
I've cycled a fair bit in France (and Spain, but less so) and I've only had two incidents where a car came recklessly close to me, and one of them had UK plates on. I don't know if it's the Wiggins effect but drivers in the UK do seem to be getting more accepting of cyclists. Still too many idiots though who seem to think that a few seconds delay before getting stuck behind the next slow vehicle/bus/tractor or not getting to work before the boss merits the risk of killing someone.

Dax H: motorbikes are one thing I'm not concerned about when i'm out cycling; unlike a car I figure that you have a vested interest beyond your paintwork in not connecting with me. I also figure that motorcyclists are actually paying attention to their riding and not fiddling with satnav/phone/opening a bag of crisps/etc. Never had a SMIDSY from a motorcyclist.

In reply to Trangia:
Sadly the norm in much of the continent... but the UK and the USA not so..

The difference you feel as a cyclist is incredible.

What I also find is the opposite.. in the UK you pull up behind a bike and take your time (as a cyclist you are aware) and they get almost agitated sometimes that you over take when they say so.. maybe its the pressure they feel under.

In France and Italy et al it's very much the cyclists road until you decide it is safe to fully overtake, not squeeze past.

Today I was walking down near the winnats pass (on the old road though so a dead end) with my fairly pregnant wife and a car squeezed between us and some parked cars without even a seconds breaking... he's going towards a dead end.. what was the rush to be so angry..
but

In reply to Roadrunner5:

I wouldn't want to cycle on US roads.
They're pretty aggressive towards pedestrians. I dread to think how they treat cyclists.
Thinking about it, I've never seen a cyclist over there. Admittedly that was Florida

In reply to GrahamD:

Some pretty knob headed cyclists too.

In reply to GrahamD:


Mostly yes but White Van Man generally seems to think nobody else is entitled to be on the road. Yes that sounds like snotty middle class MAMIL prejudice on my part, except my experience has been it's so often true.

Cyclists who don't allow themselves to be overtaken for mile after mile on single track roads are selfish too.