UKC

We recently found out that Maidenhead has a half decent indoor climbing wall at Cox Green Leisure Centre, but ... no-one is allowed to climb on it !

The red tape issue seems to be that there are no qualified instructors + not enough demand to open it as a fully staffed wall.

Firstly, would anyone else be interested in climbing here ?

And secondly, does anyone have an idea of how to circumnavigate the existing bureaucracy to allow folk to climb (once deemed competent obviously) in an unsupervised session ?

In reply to Star1973:
There are presumably two issues:

1) The wall will have its own safety management and equipment issues and paperwork. I think most walls use a local MIA as a technical director type person to ensure they are complying with current best practice? So your best bet may be to find a friendly MIA who already does this kind of thing and get them to talk to the wall?

2) Use of the wall will require 'competent' instructors/supervisors although any CWA/SPA etc is presumably competent for this. Site-specific training might also be an option.

I would not assume that sorting out problem 2 on its own would get you access; you would need to convince them to go through the hassle of sorting out problem 1 as well. In fact I would hope no leisure centre would consider opening a wall without running the appropriate risk assessments, equipment paper trail etc. Equipment needs to be checked occasionally and replaced as it wears (top ropes, quickdraws) etc...

In reply to Star1973:

I am Slough based and travel regularly to RCC. I would be interested in visiting any wall that is nearer.

In reply to Star1973:

You may do well to put together a business case for opening it up.... don't forget to offset the cost of not opening (i.e. a proportion of rent, power, heating etc is being wasted on a facility no one can use)

Or else ask if you can rent it and run it as a separate facility (and make some cash)

In reply to Star1973:

I'm pretty sure the climbing wall in Grantown-On-Spey is in a leisure centre. When they first opened you had to do a membership test which was basically a competency check. Once you had done that you could get entry and sign up to 2 people in. The nearest staff were the regular leisure centre staff who could come running if needed but weren't instructors. You supplied all your own kit and all was well.

Admittedly this was a while ago and things may have changed but if they managed it surely there is no reason why Maidenhead couldn't do something similar?

In reply to Star1973:

we use to go to a wall (uni/sports village) where you needed to pass a competency test and sign your life away. then you can climb when you wanted.

some young guy brought a friend along (non climber) who put his harness on back to front and tied in to what i assume was the gear loop. he got to the top and let go to weight the rope when the gear loop broke and he grounded.

luckily no severe injuries but the wall then went into crazy red tape which has reduced hours drastically
.

In reply to Ban1:



Sounds like the red tape is pretty justified to me, rather than 'crazy'... if I owned/ran a wall I would be extremely reluctant to let anyone kill/severely injure themselves at my wall, even through their own stupidity. If climbing walls become 'dangerous' in a statistical sense, it will only hurt climbers in the end (through increased paperwork and testing, increased staffing and insurance costs passed on in entry fees etc)...

In reply to Star1973:

Our wall is in a leisure centre. It is not always staffed, only at busy periods. There is a written test to do to sign up (admittedly it is not brilliant, but receptionists with no climbing knowledge can pass or fail people, so it serves it's purpose).

If there were no staff at all, you would very soon get bored as routes wouldn't change.

I think the suggestion of proposing the business case for opening it, as suggested above, might be best.

Our wall runs with a full time manager, and a small team of freelancers.

In reply to Star1973:

Many thanks for some great ideas and ways forwards folks.

I shall put together a bit of a case and present the management with some ways that it could be done, based on the ideas and examples you've come forward with. Hopefully they will at least then consider opening the wall in some capacity or other.

I am concerned as the leisure centre has just been taken over from the local council by a big money-making company; but even so, if I can show them a potential profit from a current dead loss, well, fingers crossed !

I shall keep you posted as to how it goes, wish me luck !

In reply to Star1973:
Might be worth chatting to the guys at The Cragg in Stowmarket. They're in a leisure centre and have done great things!

In reply to girlymonkey:

Hi girlymonkey,
I run a wall in a leisure centre near Bristol under a Technical advisor in the area, but we don't have any form of written test at the moment, just the standard unsupervised climbing forms.
Any chance you could let me have a look at your one??
What leisure centre is your wall in?
Thanks
Dave

In response to others, I took over the running of our leisure centre wall almost two years ago and have increased usage from 20 users month to over 250/300 per month. We run various kids classes and tasters etc and we are continuing to grow, feel free to contact me if you need an example of what can happen when you do run a small wall like these.

In reply to dsears:

Great to hear how you managed to increase the usage of your local wall. One of the reasons that the leisure centre in Maidenhead are not operating their wall is that "10 people were sent on a course, costing £1000, and only one booking for £30 came out of it". So they've kind of written it off as a waste of resources. It is still used by the local school for GCSE climbing, but that's it at the moment.

In reply to Star1973:

Hahaha 10 people... that would be a luxury in our place... its just me and some freelancers for when I'm on holiday!!

We found our kids classes went big once we got it out to the regular gym users (cheap babysitting service!! - UNFORTUNATELY!!) but without them I would be out of a job!!

In reply to dsears:

If you pm me your address, I can ask my boss if he would mind sending you a copy. It's basically the usual form but then a series of pictures where you have to identify which shows a harness properly attached, correctly tied in etc. I think there are about 5 multiple choice questions, and receptionists have the answer list.

In reply to girlymonkey:

I have sent you a PM. Thanks.

In reply to Fatclimber:

Have you tried the wall at Brunel Uni at all ? It's much closer to you than Reading and is open almost all the time; but does close for things like exams and so on (closed till the 17th Sept for induction of new students at the minute).

In reply to Star1973:

I quite liked the old Cox Green wall - just a small wall but low enough to boulder. It was an old-style moulded features wall, so good for training you for outdoor climbing. It was at the end of a sports hall. Can't imagine there would be enough traffic to merit staffing it nightly. Maybe someone should set up a club which can supervise itself to manage the wall at a weekly session which people sign up to - something similar happened at the Wellington College wall I think.

In reply to Chris Sansum:

It's not a bad looking wall, as you say, a good variety of features for practicing on without the great height of some walls.

Ideally, I'm hoping the leisure centre might consider opening to competent climbers for free climbing, but organising a weekly session is also a great idea and might be the way forwards. Maybe a regular session might encourage more footfall, and grease the wheels for more access ...