UKC

Ground fall after Gri-Gri belay mistake

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 zimpara 10 Jul 2016
In reply to springfall2008:

It's been posted already. What do you care anyway. You don't like grigris
37
 Timmd 10 Jul 2016
In reply to zimpara:
What sort of question is that?

As one's parents might say. 'That's not very nice...'
Post edited at 20:45
1
 Neil Morrison 10 Jul 2016
In reply to zimpara:
Just maybe because they want folk to be aware and then there is less chance of folk having serious accidents?
 stp 10 Jul 2016
In reply to zimpara:

I think it's good to post and share such things so we can all try to learn from others mistakes and not repeat them...

' he accidently clasped down on the Grigri 2’s brake release lever that he was using to belay Ashima, which caused her to drop 45-feet to the padded floor.'

I'm guessing that must have been a lapse in concentration and/or observation since it's usual to only push down on the brake lever for the brief periods when paying out rope. Also I'd have thought if he'd had the dead side of the rope in his hand too he would have felt it zipping through his hand. Sounds like a long fall though, so a significant lapse I'd say.

I personally find belay glasses are pretty good for keeping one's eye on the climber at all times. Less temptation to look down to ease your neck.
In reply to Neil Morrison:
Yes exactly, it's scary how quickly things can go wrong.

And no Zimpara this isn't because I don't like dragging a big heavy Gri-Gri up my Trad climbs, this is indoor walls where such devices are popular....
Post edited at 22:04
 andrewmc 11 Jul 2016
In reply to stp:
The argument is that your thumb is too weak to override the cam if someone falls off. I wonder if she is too light for this to be totally true though...

As soon as you feel rope zipping through your hand it is probably already too late, and any attempt to grab the dead rope may just result in you burning your hand rapidly (which is not conducive to you holding on).

Best thing to make a Grigri 'safer' is to only belay fat climbers using fat rope!
Post edited at 19:06
 CurlyStevo 11 Jul 2016
In reply to andrewmcleod:
to be honest I'm not 100% sure that a gri gri is safer when people open the cams in some way to pay out the rope. The way I lead belay with a standard device, my brake hand is never above the belay plate and its always ready to catch a fall.

This click up looks like a better system to me.
Post edited at 19:13
 andrewmc 11 Jul 2016
In reply to CurlyStevo:

I was under the impression, though, that only the Grigri and the Edelrid Eddy were true auto-locking devices (nothing else will catch a FF2 fall without any user intervention at all)? I could be wrong, never tried the Click-up, but certainly my MegaJul will only catch a fall IF the brake rope is held in (roughly) the right position.
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 johncook 11 Jul 2016
In reply to andrewmcleod:

Gri gri is an 'assisted belay device', not an auto-belay device according to it's manufacturer. It is also very critical on rope size, again according to it's manufacturer.
 JamieSparkes Global Crag Moderator 12 Jul 2016
In reply to johncook:

I can't imagine any manufacturer would sell something labelled as an automatic belay device - whole can of worms just waiting for a legal challenge.

This is one of the two major gri-gri flaws that the eddy tries to get around.
 andrewmc 12 Jul 2016
In reply to JamieSparkes:

Sorry, I should have been a lot more specific. I was under the impression that they are the only two devices for dynamic rope that will pass the UIAA dynamic test for locking belay devices:
http://www.theuiaa.org/upload_area/files/1/UIAA_129_braking_device_2009(1)....
see Section 6, which incidentally allows up to 1.5m of slippage (it's a nasty-looking test!).

Both devices are (for good reason) not advertised for use as hands-free devices, and as you say can and will fail in certain circumstances. That doesn't mean they aren't massively more trustworthy for certain tasks - for example backing up ascenders when cleaning an aid pitch (not that I have ever done that).
 jimtitt 12 Jul 2016
In reply to andrewmcleod:

> Sorry, I should have been a lot more specific. I was under the impression that they are the only two devices for dynamic rope that will pass the UIAA dynamic test for locking belay devices:


> see Section 6, which incidentally allows up to 1.5m of slippage (it's a nasty-looking test!).

> Both devices are (for good reason) not advertised for use as hands-free devices, and as you say can and will fail in certain circumstances. That doesn't mean they aren't massively more trustworthy for certain tasks - for example backing up ascenders when cleaning an aid pitch (not that I have ever done that).

Ah well, even if the manufacturers designed it and intended it to be used hands-free and despite the test requiring hands free operation the UIAA also require the manufacturer to state in the instructions that it must never be used in this way.
 stp 13 Jul 2016
In reply to andrewmcleod:

> The argument is that your thumb is too weak to override the cam if someone falls off. I wonder if she is too light for this to be totally true though...

That's really interesting. Perhaps her Dad's thumb is too strong :^)


> As soon as you feel rope zipping through your hand it is probably already too late, and any attempt to grab the dead rope may just result in you burning your hand rapidly (which is not conducive to you holding on).

Well all you have to do is take your thumb off the cam, even just let go completely, and the device will lock, so their shouldn't be any danger of rope burn, unlike a non-autolocking plate. Sounds like her Dad didn't react in time. Maybe tired and/or got distracted by something?

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