UKC

Hi
just a quick one regarding quickdraws, wiregate or solidgate, advantages or disadvantages for either one, using for trad, would a mix of length be idea.
Thnx in advance.

In reply to Oldbro3:

http://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/review.php?id=6637

http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=620843

http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=412418

Lots of stuff if you search the site. See above links for example.

Wiregates seem generally accepted as best for trad nowadays. Significant weight advantage and some safety as well.

But, yes, a mix of lengths. Personally I don't get on with what are called slingdraws but take a mix of lengths and plenty of thin slings to further extend around obstructions such as roofs.

In reply to Skyfall:

I would counter your personal preference with, start your rack off 'with' sling draws. Ie 60cm slings with 2 wiregates on them.
That way, you have slings, and quickdraws, and spare loose wiregates, and cows tails, all in one.

In reply to Oldbro3:

For trad wiregates are better as they are substantially lighter (helpful on the walk in and given the weight of the rest of the rack shaving grams off is nice when you're climbing too), for sport a lot of people seem to use solid gate quickdraws as you can get different gate shapes (bent gate namely) which make it easier to clip but they are heavier.
The safety comment above is due to something called "gate flutter":
youtube.com/watch?v=a3XhgVBPuEM&
For trad I would recommend having a mix of 25cm quick draws and tripled 60cm sling draws (these are about the same length as a 12cm draw until extended). Unless you are climbing a plumb vertical crackline the gear will often be off to either side of the route and may lead to you getting horrible drag. When I was starting out it was pointed out to me that the vast majority of the time an extra 50cm of fall would not pose any significant extra risk and that it's part of trad to make a judgement on the need for extension on gear balanced against the risk of hitting ledges etc. For what it's worth I extend gear more than I usually need to as I had some horrendous experiences with drag as I started out. Half rope technique also helps quite considerably on many routes.

In reply to Oldbro3:

Hi, some good advice given, maybe just add a couple of additions. If mostly trad climbing avoid the temptation for short quickdraws, slings 15cm and less are often perceived as the norm, but short draws have their origins in sports climbing. Equally too many tangly slings and slingdraws may be a little old school also (except long mountain routes, or alpine (excuse the assumption we are talking cragging type rock climbing here)). Short draws in reality increase the likelyhood of gear lifting. For an example my quickdraws are along the following lines.

8 x 20 cm
4 x 25-30cm
2 x Slingdraws

Reduce to 8 ish for short routes,
Consider a couple more for 40+ meter limestone type routes needing loads of small wires.
I might carry 1 shorty on a short route with low first runner. Though in these cases a screwgate direct might be better as the gear is likely to lift when higher on the route anyway.

I tend to go for light (phantoms). But they need to feel right in the hand, and the choice of crab should balance weight, handling etc. I guess my message is not to assume manufacturers make the QuickDraw combo you want. You may also want different crabs on gear/ rope ends for example, as well as different lengths. In short plenty of gear shopping oportunities on a wet day!

Wayne

In reply to Oldbro3:

What time of climbing are you expecting to be doing?

Sport - Solid or Wiregate, short to medium and some long. Maybe on fat slings if you pull on draws to get back up after a fall.
Trad - Wiregate - medium-long and some very long (sling draws). Thin slings to save space/weight.

In reply to zimpara:


The potential downside of sling draws is there's more chance of cross loading the crab, although some people use a retainer on sling draws too.

In reply to 1poundSOCKS:

The retainer is a tricky one, I've played around with them, but you need to unclip the sling draw from the gear side to extend it then. Which is a bastard.

In reply to springfall2008:


I don't know about the OP but I usually expect to be climbing about quarter to trad.

In reply to springfall2008:

Been doing sport mainly, using a mate's solidgate draws, trying trad next,

In reply to Oldbro3:

I'd tend to buy med/long wiregates if you want draws you can use for both trad and sport.