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Garage Gym Climbing Wall - Total Beginner!!

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trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016

Hi there, first post here
I'm completely new to the idea of indoor climbing walls, but have got the itch from reading the posts on here.

I have a brick built double garage, which I use as a gym, and I would like to build a wall to complement my strength and conditioning training. I have a carpenter lined up for next week to help build the framework, as my matted floor is being delivered soon after so need to get everything ready before then.

So... here's my first attempt at designing a wall for the space I have. It's an overall area of around 3m (w) x 2.4m (h), so modest but hopefully enough to create something decent. It's the first time I've used Sketchup also, so excuse the crudeness of my modelling!

Here are the pics:
http://imgur.com/a/U7WQD

Essentially it comprises of:
- A vertical section (I have to have this to allow the garage door to open (up and over)
- A 15 degree section (the main wall - 120cm)
- A 30 degree section (60cm)
- An overhang (50cm)
- A 30cm kickboard and some joining angles

Build will use:
- 18mm Marine Ply
- 2x4 timber for framework
- T-Nuts at 7" spacing grid

I would really appreciate any feedback on this at all, as I am so new to this, that I've guessed most of the design and feel completely out of my depth. I'm committed to doing a build, it's just a case of getting the design nailed this weekend!! oh, and I'll post progress pics to give something back to the forum.

Thankyou for reading guys.
Post edited at 00:27
 stp 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Looks good. I'd try to make the boards a little steeper if you can. Would be good if the 30 degree bit was more continuous. If not having the steepest bit at the bottom would be preferable.

If you use it regularly you'll improve really quickly. Malcolm Smith said when he built his first board he couldn't get up it at all. He persevered and became one of the strongest British climbers of all time.
 DDDD 27 Aug 2016
In reply to stp:

Good Metolius link. If you keep at the training you'll probably find that you wish you had built it all a bit more continuously steeper. You may find it addictive. Marine ply may be a bit overkill and I use mostly wooden holds on mine - skin friendly.
 Fraser 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:
Ditch the vertical section, as you'll quickly get no benefit from it. As others have said, get a more continuous area at 30degs. Also, the short right hand return wall will get little use, so I'd also lose that. Nice work with the .skp model incidentally.

Edit: adjust your T-nut grid to coordinate with the centres of your backing frame, eg 100 / 150mm, to make sure you miss the timbers you're screwing the board to.
Post edited at 08:49
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to stp:

Thanks for reply!

Could you explain what you mean with 'having the steepest bit at the bottom would be preferable'. Do you mean having half height 30 degree angle that straightens out to a lower angle?

I agree about the 30 degree being better if more continuous- the reason for that is that I may still need to use the garage to park a car occasionally, and I need to avoid anything in the way, so tried to make angle above roof height.

Thanks for motivation also, I'm really looking forward to getting stuck in.
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Fraser:
Appreciated!

I haven't got much choice on the vertical, as the up and over garage door extends over that area when open, up to about 1.80m, unless anyone has any other ideas? It's either vertical wall, or just not included in the climbing wall.

Do you mean the whole right hand side angle, or just the extending angle top right? I can play around with the model to try another option..

EDIT: Thumbs up for the grid suggestion, I'll take that into account. Would you use Round T-Nuts or Pronged?
Post edited at 09:10
 Stuart S 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

What you've designed there looks like a clever use of space and might be your best option if you still want to fit the car in the garage. However, like others have suggested above, if possible I'd also recommend that you have as much of your board at a constant angle of 30 degrees.

I've got a fairly extensive home bouldering wall (http://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/author.html?nstart=0&id=1724) and in its current incarnation, the section I use most is my 30 degree panel. It's a good angle for a variety of types of holds - you can make good use of slopers as well as crimps, pinches etc. On anything less than 30 degrees, you'll probably find it'll become too easy too quickly as you improve. By having a uniform angle, you'll be able to create circuit problems without being able to sneak rests in corners between angles.

I used pronged t-nuts. I also kept my kick-board to 15cm. Anything more than enough to keep your heels off the ground and you're wasting angled panel!

 Dell 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Marine ply is for building boats and is very expensive, if it won't be getting continuously wet then you won't need marine.

Just get the cheapest ply that has 1 good face. If you specify marine ply to a builders merchant or a builder then they will only be too happy to charge accordingly.
 yodadave 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

As you stated on your sketchup you'll need the vertical for your garage door. It's still worth putting in as you can always set balancy footholds as hands problems and still get benefit from it. Think pulling on pebbles on some nails slab.

Steep right from the sit start would build good core strength and make for hard sit starts in general. Thus a bit of a training bonus. Its true that you can get strong very quick on a home wall so hence build it harder than you currently climb.

More t nuts more options. Round seem preferred these days, I've used both and either are fine. Pronged can be harder to set properly and if not set properly they can be a pain in the arse. Round are laborious to set but you've either screwed them in or you haven't. A bit more straight forward.

trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:
I've redesigned a little bit, to try and get more continuous angle as suggested.
To do this I've had to make some compromises, such as:

- Change angle from 30 degree to 25 degree (I'll try and get as steep as possible...)
- Reduced air gap between the ply and the wall just under the 25 degree slope. It's now a gradient gap from 0 to 4 inches over a metre starting from the floor.

What do you think, I could do something with the side panels also, not sure what...

Here's the new pics:
http://imgur.com/a/yknaJ
Post edited at 09:50
 Stuart S 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

If the 15 degree section can't be made any steeper then your new design looks like the best you're going to be able to do with the space you have. It's well worth panelling the sides and sticking a few holds on there too.

I should have said above, while I've got away with pronged t-nuts on my boards, I have built them so that the backs of all panels are accessible for the inevitable occasions where a t-nut pops out. If you can't do that then round t-nuts will be better.
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Stuart S:
Thanks Stuart, are 15 degree and 30 degree the angles to go for, if you had to have only 2?

The back of my panels will not be accessible without unscrewing them from the framework, so not really an option. Are the round T-Nuts more time consuming to fit, and do I need to glue and pre-tighten with a bolt- or can I just drill, pop in and screw on?

btw, your wall looks completely amazing
Post edited at 10:44
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Dell:

Thanks for the tip-

The garage can get a little changey in terms of temperature and there is a bit of condensation in the winter, which I've tried to mitigate. The cost of the Marine Ply is about £6 per board more, and my chippy is going to buy it on my behalf. So for about £50, I thought it was worth not chancing it.

 Stuart S 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

If you have the option, I'd just go for one angle - 30 degrees everywhere! But if I understand correctly, that means you won't fit your car in the garage, so isn't an option for you? I suspect you'll quickly find the 15 degree board quite easy unless you buy particularly poor holds for it, but it's something you can tinker with (once upon a time, I had a vertical section on my home wall, but it never got used so I took it down!). It's also worth buying lots of little screw-on foot jibs as using them instead of bigger bolt-ons can bump up the difficulty/pump whilst still using reasonable hand holds.

I've never used round nuts, but from what I understand of them, they need a wee grub screw to hold them in place, so will be more time consuming to fit but will be more secure once in place. I don't think you need to glue or pre-tighten them but others with more experience of them might be able to give you a more certain answer!
 Dell 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

I would expect to pay half that for standard exterior grade plywood, which would not be affected by condensation.

http://www.builderdepot.co.uk/18mm-x-1220mm-x-2440mm-wbp-bb-cc-external-ply...
 James Malloch 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

I'd ditch the kickboard altogether. They make things quite a bit easier.

Whilst you start, just have some bigger footholds on the bottom, as you get better make them smaller. Even a crap foothold on a kickboard is good.
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Stuart S:
> If you have the option, I'd just go for one angle - 30 degrees everywhere! But if I understand correctly, that means you won't fit your car in the garage, so isn't an option for you? I suspect you'll quickly find the 15 degree board quite easy unless you buy particularly poor holds for it, but it's something you can tinker with (once upon a time, I had a vertical section on my home wall, but it never got used so I took it down!). It's also worth buying lots of little screw-on foot jibs as using them instead of bigger bolt-ons can bump up the difficulty/pump whilst still using reasonable hand holds.

Thanks for the feedback Stuart!

So I can extend the steepest face a bit, without impacting the car space. I've reworked the model in sketchup to show what this would look like (below). Basically, I need to make sure that the wing-mirror (or roof) doesn't hit the angle when using the garage. Having a 30cm kick-board and a slope of 24 degrees look about right to achieve that.

I've also gone and measured everything up again and used proper angles to see how it looks. Woah- those angles are steeper than they look on paper, 30 degrees is what I imagined 45 to look like in the room!

I didn't mention earlier but the wall will be used by children also (5-10), so that was another consideration in keeping a 15 degree face.

James- cheers for the note on kickboards. I've taken another look and I do want to retain them as they make the angles work better in my space (less protruding), and give me more clearance for my flooring.

Here's the latest design:
- I've balanced the 15 and 24 degree faces better, now measuring 90cm each across.
- I've extended the overhang a bit, to give more options (though need to check on whether that's ok in terms of the beam strengthening (price).

http://imgur.com/a/Pk0pr
Post edited at 13:16
 timjones 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

> Thanks for reply!

> Could you explain what you mean with 'having the steepest bit at the bottom would be preferable'. Do you mean having half height 30 degree angle that straightens out to a lower angle?

> I agree about the 30 degree being better if more continuous- the reason for that is that I may still need to use the garage to park a car occasionally, and I need to avoid anything in the way, so tried to make angle above roof height.

> Thanks for motivation also, I'm really looking forward to getting stuck in.

Having built my own training wall I think you were on the right track with your first design. Part of mine is vertical to 1.4m and then 40 degrees above that. it means that you can vary the angle by setting the holds that you are going to train on higher or lower on the wall. If
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to timjones:
> Having built my own training wall I think you were on the right track with your first design. Part of mine is vertical to 1.4m and then 40 degrees above that. it means that you can vary the angle by setting the holds that you are going to train on higher or lower on the wall.

Thanks Tim,
I've created a gallery of the 3 options I've iterated through, including a new one with 45 angle up top.

I'm a little confused as to what is practical now, having done so many theoretical designs- but I want it to be interesting and fun above all else, even at the expense of sub-optimal technical training.

3 Options..
http://imgur.com/a/tJgFJ
Post edited at 13:48
 timjones 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

I can't find a handy photo of my setup so I'm afraid have to bore you with this video in order to show you my wall. Don't worry you don't have to watch it all

youtube.com/watch?v=rbOt6AN4-6Y&

Apologies for the embarassingly sloppy footwork this was taken about 25 minutes into a training session and my technique was starting to flag.
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to timjones:
I watched it all, and I'm the least qualified person to comment on the footwork! You got up and down, so that's a win . The wall looks great!

That actually looked like a lot of fun, and I can see how the vertical half sections help to start of the climb, before going significantly more acute... this is in contrast to other advice that a 30 degree slope top to bottom is the way to go.

Are there different training goals driving those different views?
Post edited at 15:15
 Stuart S 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

My personal preference is for option 1, from your three choices. You've got as big a 24 degree board as you can fit, and as Tim says, by varying the angle on what was the 15 degree board, you have created a bit more variety. It also means that if you're doing a circuit, you can have slopier holds on the low, less steep half for going one direction on, and more positive holds on the steeper top half for coming back the other way.

Make sure you post some photos of the finished construction!
Removed User 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:
I don't know if it's been answered yet but you need the t-nuts with the little barbs on to hold them in place. When drilling the holes for them be careful not to lean over the board and end up drilling the holes at a slight angle. When the holes are dead straight it's much easier to knock the t-nuts in and subsequently screw the holds in.
As has been mentioned make sure the baton spacing clears the holes. Once you start changing it round you'll be using whatever length bolt you have to hand.
Get a short young climber to set sit starts for you, my girls did mine and because they're set so low they're nails.

Finally I think it's only fair you put your full address on the forum so we can all try it out.
Post edited at 16:28
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Removed Usergilesf:
you haven't seen the rest of the gym! (well it's a tip because diy, but hoping it turns out well..)
Would you go for pronged over screw in then? I want to keep the install time down, and can't access the back of my wall once up.

Ok, so thankyou for everyone's input on this, and please do still chip in on the design.
I've just built a mock frame out of cardboard tubes to roughly mimmick the sketchup design. It looks pretty good in terms of sizing, and because of the multi angles, I think it will be fun to work around.

@StuartS Thanks for the encouraging feedback! I'll definitely post the pics when constructed, I'm hoping the frame will be next week, and then filling and painting, but need to check the wallet after today's mods!!

Here's where I've got to, with some more minor tweaks:
http://imgur.com/a/iQ3BC
Post edited at 16:38
Removed User 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:
The pronged ones will knock in from behind, ooer missus, and stay there. Once a hold has been screwed in to them they pull in even tighter.
The design you've got looks good to me. The return at either side of the steep section will be useful for practising heel hooks, fridge hugging and the likes.
If you can then extend the ceiling part so you can practise roof work.
If the holds you buy have more than one screw hole then at a pinch you can get away with just screwing them on if there isn't a bolt hole available.
Also, if I was doing mine again I'd try and get a crack in it somewhere.
Further to some comments above regarding material choice I've used OSB, often called sterling board, for some sections of mine.
Post edited at 16:59
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Removed Usergilesf:

Cheers

I was thinking I could achieve a crack with a volume a little later down the road, maybe on the vertical section high up.
Let me know if there's a simple way of integrating something like that into my design though.
trimspokenabe 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Stuart S:

Thanks, yes I'll definitely add those.

Have you used Holdz incidentally? I really like their volumes in plain white, and planned to buy a couple when I get my hold plan sorted (will be subject to a new thread for sure!)
 Stuart S 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Yeah, I've used Holdz a number of times over the last 20 years or so. I've not got any of their volumes but I do rate the holds I have bought off of them (particularly their sloperz range).
JerryB 27 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

I have a garage-sized free-standing bouldering cabin in the For Sale section if you're interested.
 Oli Hawk 29 Aug 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Hi I'm selling a huge job lot of holds which might be of use? There are 199 in total, all varieties of holds and 10 different colours for routing. I'd be happy to email photos if you like?

I took my wall down when I moved house and no longer have space to put them back up.

OliHawksworth@hotmail.co.uk

 stp 01 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

> Could you explain what you mean with 'having the steepest bit at the bottom would be preferable'. Do you mean having half height 30 degree angle that straightens out to a lower angle?

Ideally yes, if the car will still fit that way. There's something about convex walls that makes them better for training than concave ones, certainly on a small woody. The more vertical section then is just used for the hands, feet remain on the steep bit, and the problems can be hard from the very first move. But if car space is needed you'll have to do it the other way I suppose. Perhaps have an extended roof bit at the top?
Bellie 01 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Interesting thread. One I'll bookmark as I'm just in the early stages of planning mine. Plenty of space for me fortunately so I'm quite blessed!

One thought on your garage set up - and I'm not sure how feasible it is, but has anyone done a wall which you can alter the angle by hinging from the bottom, and using pulleys to lower the wall to various angles. Obviously it will need the right cables/ropes, but wondered whether its a yes or a no no?

 jkarran 02 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:


> I haven't got much choice on the vertical, as the up and over garage door extends over that area when open, up to about 1.80m, unless anyone has any other ideas? It's either vertical wall, or just not included in the climbing wall.

Personally I'd simplify it significantly and make it more versatile.

Flat boards with a short (8" or so, just enough to clear the mat) kicker. Keep it split into two or 3 panels and hinge each at the bottom. They're small panels so sturdy door hinges will suffice. Hang the panels from chain or knotted rope so they stow vertical then hang out at 20 degrees or so in use. As you get stronger they can get steeper yet you can warm up on it at a lower angle and work endurance too. This solution makes the panel under the door work too (though it may need an additional hinge line), as is a vertical panel is pretty useless and your 15deg panel not much better. I think 2x4 and marine ply is overkill but many disagree re. the 2x4.

On the other hand, if what you've drawn is what you really want then go for it and enjoy it.
jk
 natehd9 02 Sep 2016
In reply to Bellie:

Ratho has an entire comp/sport wall that is on chains and hinges so they can mess around with the angle, also seen a few build threads either on here or UKB of people doing them, look quite cool and pack away vertically!
 French Erick 02 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Whatever you do, make your life easy and minimise wood offcuts by planning whole sheets of ply. I personally use OSB. It's cheaper. Now a full sheet is 1220mm by 2440mm not 1200 by 2400 as most people assume. You can have a panel in your roof too.
I am just about to embark on my third home wall! I'm building the shed to the wall specs this time! Must easier that way. But a much bigger project...
Good luck and have fun. My Zen % increases a lot when I have my own wall at home...so much less frustration.
Bellie 02 Sep 2016
In reply to French Erick:

I'm just clearing/organising space in my barn now, so hopefully going to get moving on mine through the winter. I love overhangs so planning a bit of a roof too. Need to start it before the other half uses the space for hay and chickens!!

What max height would you guys go for... given that I'll be on my own so no spotting. Also any advice on places for crash mats would be grand.

 French Erick 02 Sep 2016
In reply to Bellie:

If I could I'd have a 30 degree board of 3m length with a 40cm kickboard. I'd then have a vertical panel of 60cm at the top for finishing holds. This would be 4 full panel wide to limit cuts and allowing for own homemade volumes. Leave 50cm space on both sides and you'll be able to fully utilise full width plus install holds on side. Simple design would also ensure it's not a mission to make and keeps costs down. For padding talk to friends and work colleagues and get their old beds and cover them in carpeting. This is obviously my dream set up... But a barn should accommodate it. Lighting from the other side with and old sofa and a shelf for a sound system and climbing literature. Et voilà!
 French Erick 02 Sep 2016
In reply to Bellie:

Obviously that's a commitment of 18sqm and a volume of 6mx3mx4m... Not insignificant! But you did mention a barn!
Bellie 02 Sep 2016
In reply to French Erick:

Looks like I better get my pen and paper out - or Sketch up. Plenty of holds required with that, so it might be a gradual thing, but I like the idea of the overhang.

Been out in the middle of nowhere I need a good project... not that doing up the place isn't a task in itself. But one needs to play.

Good thing is there are plenty of sawmills round here so cut timber is really cheap. Just the OSB to source at a good price.

trimspokenabe 03 Sep 2016
In reply to stp:
> But if car space is needed you'll have to do it the other way I suppose. Perhaps have an extended roof bit at the top?

Thanks stp, yes that's the intention. I've extended the roof section out more, and intend to strengthen the next roof beam along to allow that.

A few people have mentioned a hinged wall, which I've done a bit of research on subsequently. I think I'd sooner go for fixed and solid for safety, although I can see how it would be a good idea for a large single panel.

Here's the latest refinement:
- Added vertical section to the far right, maximising space that side (I have a heavy bag on a swing bracket)
- Extended ceiling section out another foot, to provide options for adding an overhang volume.
- T-Nuts at 6 inch spacing (3" border, 6" spacing on the 3ft wide panels)

http://imgur.com/a/kEjXZ
Post edited at 13:17
trimspokenabe 03 Sep 2016
In reply to jkarran:
Thanks Jkarran-

> Personally I'd simplify it significantly and make it more versatile.

> as is a vertical panel is pretty useless and your 15deg panel not much better. I think 2x4 and marine ply is overkill but many disagree re. the 2x4.
> On the other hand, if what you've drawn is what you really want then go for it and enjoy it.

Quite a few people have said that the vertical is a waste of time (I'm pretty limited on space hence the inclusion), however I think they'll be pretty useful. I intend to mount some large volume towards the top of those sections and am planning to set the wall up to give me a few fun traverse routes. Starting one side and working my way over to the other (and vice versa). Also wouldn't you just use those vertical bits hands only and manoeuvre to a foot hold on the traverse? - disclaimer- I have no clue

I should probably say that this wall is part of a larger gym setup for strength and conditioning training, hence I originally started this plan with the intention of chucking up a few holds direct onto brick for hanging off.... it kind of snowballed
Post edited at 13:23
trimspokenabe 03 Sep 2016
In reply to French Erick:

> Whatever you do, make your life easy and minimise wood offcuts by planning whole sheets of ply. I personally use OSB. It's cheaper. Now a full sheet is 1220mm by 2440mm not 1200 by 2400 as most people assume. You can have a panel in your roof too.
> I am just about to embark on my third home wall! I'm building the shed to the wall specs this time! Must easier that way. But a much bigger project...
> Good luck and have fun. My Zen % increases a lot when I have my own wall at home...so much less frustration.

Thanks- and good luck with your project!!!!

The marine ply is mainly because I get some condensation in the garage in winter, and the temp does fluctuate a fair bit.. just wanted to be safe for the extra £6 per board. I'm sure OSB would be fine but don't fancy taking a chance.

Any suggestions on volumes to add to the wall, to increase the difficulty on those minimal angle sections & ceiling high up? https://www.holdz.co.uk/collections/volumes

Andy Gamisou 03 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Hello. One recommendation I'd give is not to buy (many) new holds. If you find an existing climbing wall selling old holds then you'll (a) save a lot of money, (b) get holds that are 'worn in' and which you will be able to train on longer; I've personally found grippy new holds nice for the first bit of a training session, then crap as the skin on my fingers complain. Inevitably my skin proves the limiting factor, not the tendons (which I think is what you want to stress). Also maybe investigate making your own holds from wood - really nice for the skin. Most of my wall is made up of old Alien Rock holds, and bits of wood. For me it works well. I also have some resin holds bought new from a dedicated climbing wall supplier. I tend not to use them much.
trimspokenabe 04 Sep 2016
In reply to Willi Crater:
> Hello. One recommendation I'd give is not to buy (many) new holds. If you find an existing climbing wall selling old holds then you'll (a) save a lot of money, (b) get holds that are 'worn in' and which you will be able to train on longer;

Thanks Willi, that's a good idea and I'm going to keep my eye out. If anyone has a bunch of M10 holds to go, let me know and I'll see if they are what I'm looking for.
trimspokenabe 04 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:
MY CLIMBING WALL IN VR!

Not sure if anyone has done this on here before, but I modelled my proposed wall in UE4 so I could experience in VR using HTC Vive at actual scale. I'd definitely suggest this for anyone looking to build, if you can get access to a Vive- it makes so much more sense seeing it first hand!

Here's a clip to show you what I mean- any feedback appreciated, as build starts later this week.
(the scale looks a bit warped in the vid, it's just the recording)
https://vid.me/eAaC
Post edited at 10:07
 Fraser 04 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Good effort! That gives a decent impression of what the wall and enclosing space will feel like. One suggestion which I would make would be to chamfer the right angled returns to the main overhang to be closer to 45 degrees. I think the wall will be more challenging and ultimately more usable with that layout. It'll be slightly trickier to construct but I think the result would be worth the effort. Good job again on the VR modelling.
trimspokenabe 04 Sep 2016
In reply to Fraser:

Thanks Fraser!

I went with your idea of the chamfered returns, and created another option for the wall.
Bit simpler, and uses full panels of ply.

Any thoughts on this vs. the previous design?

http://imgur.com/a/xl49G
Bellie 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:
Liking the VR wall! great idea. I like the small roof section so you can add variety on traverses. I quite like the sides and angles in preference to the latest version, but the latest one does look neat/clean looking and as I'm not an expert on route setting, might work out just as well anyway.

I want to get into Sketch up, but I'm on OSX Mountain Lion and its not supported, so I need to upgrade to give it a whirl... unless anyone knows of something similar for a mac that is ok.

Post edited at 09:02
 jkarran 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

> Also wouldn't you just use those vertical bits hands only and manoeuvre to a foot hold on the traverse? - disclaimer- I have no clue

If you get into climbing the vertical section, small as it is will prove totally redundant with or without volumes. There's no reason not to hinge it is there? It's structurally similar and costs maybe £10 more in hardware.

I added a 15 degree section on my home wall to double its size (for the same reason as you, garage door rails in the way). The idea was to better simulate my local climbing. I never really used it, the steep bit was always much better.
jk

trimspokenabe 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Bellie:
> I want to get into Sketch up, but I'm on OSX Mountain Lion and its not supported, so I need to upgrade to give it a whirl... unless anyone knows of something similar for a mac that is ok.

You could always create a Parallels Windows virtual machine to run it in. I've done that previously.

Thanks for the feedback on the wall, it's difficult getting all of the compromises in and still retaining core functionality.
trimspokenabe 05 Sep 2016
In reply to jkarran:
> I added a 15 degree section on my home wall to double its size (for the same reason as you, garage door rails in the way). The idea was to better simulate my local climbing. I never really used it, the steep bit was always much better.

Thanks jk.
I'm mostly concerned about complexity and safety with the hinged wall. I don't like the idea of having to double check it's safe, when it's not just me that's using it. It would need to be vertical most of the time, and angled when the garage door is not in use.

I'm all for building in fixed steeper angles though, it's just cramming into the space that's the issue :/



Bellie 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Now installed and ready to go on my PC partition : ) I shouldn't really - other projects should be a priority for me here, but what the heck. I can design it to perfection and start it in the spring!

 jkarran 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:
Which aspect of safety specifically concerns you?

In reality it's no more complex than a simple triangulated overhanging board, it's just that one leg of the triangle is rope in tension rather than wood in tension, the rest of the build is essentially the same. If you hinge the boards so they can all move independently they remain light enough to handle easily and safely especially so at modest overhang angles where the hinges (rather than the person moving the board) bear most of the weight. You can add a simple counterweight behind the board or a or simple catch so it stays stowed or deployed until you unlock it to move it either way and with permanent fixed length ropes at the top it can't be dropped by accident. Your chippy could very easily add a door latch lock so you need a key to deploy it. Most of that is overkill for personal use but I can appreciate you wouldn't want your kids banging a 40kilo panel around even if it was well constrained.

To my mind it's no less safe than a 40kilo barbell left on a bench/stand or an unguarded lifting machine, potentially much safer with a little thought.

Edit: ps, have a look at FreeCAD, it's no harder to use than sketchup, easier once you actually want to do properly constrained drawings and it's much more powerful in standard form (both programs have lots of plugins to add features).
jk
Post edited at 13:54
 Phil4000 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

General question about home walls, a lot of people are advocating 30-45 degrees which is pretty steep. Bearing in mind my normal trad routes don't go near that; in terms of training specificity are you not better having it less steep but with smaller holds?
 jkarran 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Phil4000:

Less steep may be more specific from a technique point of view but as you get better and stronger you end up doing big moves off small holds which is fine occasionally but training like that is tough on the joints. Steeper boards can be longer for the same height and allow you to get strong on friendly holds. 45 is very steep, too steep for my taste!
jk
trimspokenabe 05 Sep 2016
In reply to jkarran:

What's the view on vertical sections at the bottom of the faces, say a third to half way up?
It allows for a steeper face in my situation, but at the expense of losing the slope on the bottom part.



 JIMBO 05 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

If your lower section is vertical for a significant height you will end up just putting your hips into the board and putting all your weight into the footholds. You may not push your fingers as much.
trimspokenabe 06 Sep 2016
In reply to JIMBO:

Thanks JIMBO, would around 2ft be ok to minimise that?
It would allow me to bring out the angle a few more degrees closer to 30.
 jkarran 06 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

> What's the view on vertical sections at the bottom of the faces, say a third to half way up?

The net effect can be reasonable allowing you to choose how steep moves are by setting the foot hold height but as you get better you'll squeeze more and more of your weigh into the concave face and over your feet. Even a small kicker board lets you do this, I had 2ft of vertical beneath my 25deg wall and once I was used to it could really exploit it to unload the arms. It's a particular type of climbing but steep flat boards are the way to go for a small training wall. If the issue is getting a car in then hinge the panels.
jk
trimspokenabe 06 Sep 2016
In reply to jkarran:

Thanks for the helpful advice

I've got to juggle a few different concerns on space, as the area is first and foremost a gym, with a matted area for training. This wall is to supplement the training options, rather than be a technical climbing tool.

That said, I do have a keen interest in developing this as a hobby, hence I'm taking the time to try and get a reasonable solution that goes beyond a bit of fun as part of a interval training circuit. I'll likely go for a decent kick board to boost the angle, but take the point on wanting to get steep flat boards.

Everyone on here has been incredibly helpful, and I appreciate it.
 Rob Laird 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Some useful info here. I'm also looking at building a small wall soon, but have a bit less space. What's the steepest angle people would recommend? Is it better to have a 30 degree board that's shorter, or 40-45 degrees and longer?

Rob
 Si dH 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Rob Laird:

Apologies if this is stating the obvious, but that depends how strong you are. Ypu want an angle that you can do moves on with smaller holds, not just jugs. Given your profile grades if they are correct, I would go for 30.
 Fraser 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Rob Laird:

Think I've read 40 degrees is optimal but don't quote me. There is good info on UKB if you search. My board is not very steep due to footprint limitations, and is about 17degs. That corresponds fairly closely to the typical angle of rock I climb on, so was ideal to train for a project I had at the time. If I had the space though, I'd definitely go steeper, probably no more than 30degs though.
trimspokenabe 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Fraser:
Thanks all,

Here's my latest design, I think it's simpler and offers more flexibility.
Slope is around 30 degrees.

I've added a pyramid volume to the face for looks and interest!

https://imgur.com/a/AFwCk
Post edited at 08:13
 JIMBO 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

Looks good and simple to construct.
Personally I would have a kick board of only 6 inches or so, make it steeper for longer and wider... I know you are restricted in space though. Having built several home walls the best was a constant 45 degree board. I've had everything from horizontal to vertical in the past.
 timjones 07 Sep 2016
In reply to Supernova:

> Thanks all,

> Here's my latest design, I think it's simpler and offers more flexibility.

> Slope is around 30 degrees.

> I've added a pyramid volume to the face for looks and interest!


Looking good

Volumes that can easily be moved offer a great deal of flexibility as they allow you to very easily adjust the angle that you are training on.
trimspokenabe 09 Sep 2016
In reply to timjones:

Construction has begun!
Thanks for everyone's help, I'll post pics when done.

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