UKC

Without wanting any beta on the route, how does heart of darkness compare with Dream?

I've done Dream and led the traverse pitch, which didn't feel too exposed. Just wondering if this route is any more serious? Or something I should take on!

I am ok at HVS, although not solid. It looks like a good route to get on.

In reply to GStone:

Don't think this is beta, just general advice. Don't do Heart of Darkness in the morning/before the sun's been on it. I made exactly this mistake (wasn't thinking) and found the traverse sodden and unbelievably greasy, absolutely covered in slime. What should have been a ten minute solo (luckily I wasn't!) turned into a prolonged struggle. Had to wait on the stance (in the corner) for about an hour for the edges of the breaks to dry, before taking my second across. Think we only had three or four runners (didn't have big cams).

Many years since I did Dream so can't remember much about it. Seemed OK/a nice route.

Re Heart of Darkness, dry rock and lots of big cams would be my advice. It's a great route.

Mick

In reply to GStone:



HoD can get quite pumpy, although not technically harder than Dream and no more exposed. Take plenty of the right gear and there's tons of protection.

Take prussics or a shunt and prewarn your second what your plan is in the unlikely event of taking a swing because you can't see or hear each other on the traverse and escape would be quite a palaver.

It's a memorable route.

In reply to GStone:
Hi Gstone. I seconded Heart of darkness in the first month of starting climbing. I was blissfully unaware of the dangers a traverse can be so just got on with the climbing and it was easy enough. My mate who had been climbing a year longer than me had an epic on the first pitch. I couldn't understand why he was struggling so much. But being 3rd man he knew if he fell a swing in to nowhere was the reward. I've not been back to lead it but can't wait. It's got a big feeling about it. I've also lead dream since and thought that was a touch harder climbing wise but not as airy. A competent party on heart is a must. Have fun.
Luke.

In reply to luke glaister:


You probably should have clipped his rope to the gear instead of taking the gear on your rope out. You clearly wouldn't have known this at the time.
C

In reply to GStone:
I would save Heart of Darkness until you can do the New Morning finish, makes for an outstanding route! Heart of Darkness/New Morning (E1 5b). Excellent, slightly strenuous, exposed traverse on the first pitch with an excellent strenuous crack to finish up to the top.

To answer your question, I think HoD is harder than Dream as it is more strenuous with slightly harder climbing and the gear isn't quite as good.

In reply to FreshSlate:

I did. The leader had me back roping and leave all the gear for him. I could of explained it better.lol. It was when he got to a piece and take it out. He could see the next one and the potential fall and swing that got him gripped. He got through it by placing gear on second. Climbing past it and place more then recover last piece. To minimise the swing/fall. I was taking pics and living the dream on the leadge thinking how amazing climbing is. Hahahah.
Luke.

In reply to luke glaister:

Geez, I know what you mean now anyway.

In reply to GStone:

Thanks guys, so it could be more pumpy as it looks slightly overhanging, and there's nowhere on dream where it gets pumpy.

I might wait to do the combo E1 finish but I am very tempted just to go for Heart of Darkness.

I am going there next weekend if the weather allows (looking unlikely at the moment!)

In reply to GStone:

I thought the traverse was easy and well protected with big hexes and cams, if you have enough, but it would be intimidating for a 2nd who isn't used to leading and could be scared by the thought of a swing into space.

Would be a lot more intimidating if there was a big sea, and a lot harder if the break was wet.

I thought the new morning finish was tough, but I'm rubbish at crack climbing. I can imagine that anyone used to grit cracks it would be straightforward at the grade.

In reply to GStone:
I'm a weed. So White horses felt like effortless, juggy slab wandering and Heart of Darkness a serious, pumpy adventure where your had to keep going and space your protection in order to gain the first rest.
Also, the sea is a distant murmur on Dream but a roaring, heel snapping monster of HoD; not that this effects anything other than your mind...

In reply to GStone:

The pumpiness others describe may be a height thing. I'm 5' and followed a 6' leader who generously provided gear on the first half of the traverse and then none at all until he got to the far corner. I found the traverse perfectly comfortable apart from feeling increasingly disinclined to fall off after I had removed the last piece of gear. On reaching the belay he explained that his extra height meant he had to do the traverse in a crouching, cramped up manner and became too pumped to continue gear fiddling.

We had planned to do the usual Diedre Sud finish but it was busy so I think we did the third pitch of Razorbill which was a good 4c finger crack.

In reply to GStone:

Get the 2nd to belay right on the arete then you can maintain communication,

Chris

In reply to Ann S:

Well I'm only 5'8 so hopefully that comes in my favour!

In reply to GStone:

First off, I'm 6' and led the cave pitch of HoD a few weeks ago. I got plenty of gear all the way so I'm calling BS on anyone claiming to be unable to place pro due to their height.

As others have said, the second pitch of New Morning makes an excellent and contrasting finish to HoD. It's one of the most memorable climbs I've ever done and was a great finish to our week in Pembrokeshire.

It's many years since I did DoWH. HoD felt harder, but it may just be me getting older! Hopefully I'll get to find out before the end of the year as my son's itching to do it.

Another climb of a similar style and standard is of course, Riders on the Storm (HVS 5a). Worth doing if you're in the area.

In reply to GStone:

Adventure seacliff HVS in Wales, the real big daddy of the traverses is of course Exposure Explosion (HVS 5a) ...don't miss it!

In reply to Le Chevalier Mal Fet:

Another climb of a similar style and standard is of course, Riders on the Storm (HVS 5a). Worth doing if you're in the area.

Triple Overhang Buttress is another option for Pembroke exposed HVS's: -

Triple Overhang Buttress

In reply to GStone:


With a steady second you should be fine. Enjoy it!

In reply to FactorXXX:

On next years bucket list along with Sunny Corner (HVS 5a)

In reply to Le Chevalier Mal Fet:

If you like a full traverse, HOD, Riders on the storm and the triple overhang routes are all great.

Sunny corner is also great but is an up, traverse across and then up again. This gave terrible rope drag and rather ruined the final up bit for me after the great traverse. Could probably be lessened with better rope work.