UKC

Iv decided im going to sell my current cams and buy new ones .

the reason being , i bought my cams second hand on ebay and they area mixture brands and sizes .

they are a mixture of dmm 4cu's , wild contry friends ( the old single axel one ) and a few other brands .

I have one black diamond c4 ( red ) to me this feels like the best cam in terms of placing and build quality .

Its the only twin axel i own and i feel the twin axle must be the best kind of cam? it places really fast and feels so solid when it goes in .

How do other brands who make twin axles compair to the BD cams? I see dmm have the dragon 2 .

I was considering the new dragon 2 in the larger sizes and maybe the BD c4s in the small sizes .

If you could go and start again what would you pick and what would you base your picks on?

In reply to discosucks:
I'll start...

a set of totem basics from the smallest to Camalot size 0.5
a set of hybrid totem basics from the smallest to Camalot size 0.5
a set of camalot c4s from 0.5 to 4
camalot ultralights from 0.5 to 4
wc friends 5 & 6

In reply to discosucks:

I sort of did this with buying my son a set

Dragon cams. Twin axle. Made in the uk. Useful extending sling. I think we got 0-5. But with funds 00-6 would make sense

In reply to discosucks:

I would start by buying all the available sizes of Totems, then start looking at the best outside that range.

In reply to discosucks:

All would be totems - their holding power in slick rock (like UK limestone) is second to none.

They have other benefits such as being extremely flexible, being light and having the ability to load on two lobes, but the above reason makes them functionally far better than any other cam for UK climbing, in my opinion.

In reply to discosucks:

Im i right in thinking the twin axel is why the BD cam seems to have better sitting power?

Iv noticed that rock empire are doing a twin axel cam that looks to based on the bd cams . full set for 250 euros!

In reply to discosucks:

I love the Dragon cams, plus they're made down the road, I use them in size 0 upwards.

For the smaller sizes, the Totems seem very hard to beat.

In reply to discosucks:

BD C4

In detail


BD C4 0.3 to 0.75 but ( if money no object) go BD ultralight C4 for 1-3 (the bigger units)

In reply to discosucks:

Fixe Alien Lites extendable sling = Black,Blue,Green,Yellow
WC New Friends = Purple,Green,Red,Yellow,Blue

Add these to make For Double set.
BD C3= All Sizes
BD x4= Purple, Green
WC New Friends = Red,Yellow.

In reply to discosucks:

Full range of Totems, then C4s and X4s for the ranges that Totem cams don't cover, plus a C3 000.

The twin axle on cams like the C4s doesn't increase holding power - that principally comes from the camming angle - but it does increase the camming range.

In reply to discosucks:

I'm sure you realise you don't actually *need* cams to climb. If you want to replace them just because you want a matching set, fair do's, but it won't make you a better climber.

To answer the OP, quality and price. BD Camalots are my preference.

In reply to discosucks:

Dragon 2's. Full set, except maybe the biggest silver one.

Then consider Totems, Camalots or alternatively Ballnuts to cover smaller cracks.

In reply to discosucks:

Full set of Totem cams, black to orange, blue and grey camalot ultralights above. Either BD C3 or X4 for super small. Totem cams are just awesome in my book.

In reply to discosucks:

i like having odd cams. They all go in slightly differently and sometimes you find that one just seems to sit a bit better than another.

In reply to discosucks:

A few years ago I did exactly what you are doing and replaced a miss matched set of friends. It was a complete wasteof money. I don't climb any better for it, I don't find placing gear any easier. Keep your old cams and spend the cash on a climbing trip

In reply to discosucks:


No, the twin cam design makes for larger expansion range, not improving holding power. The holding power is a function of the cam angel and the cam alloy. The cam angel determines the force exerted towards the rock and thereby applying friction. Friction is also determined by the alloy; the softer the more holding power.

In reply to carr0t:


That's true... but mainly a factor on small cams, ie. smaller than wide fingers (~BD C4 0.5 size). And hybrid cams resolve much of it (in the smaller sizes).

In reply to andy.smythe:

well its a combination of not knowing the cams I own history I bought them 2nd and 3rd hand and the fact someone of them are starting to show there age with wear .

I never implied they would make me a better climber , I just feel I like using a particular cam style over the others and wanted to know other peoples opinions

In reply to discosucks:

In that case buy dragons

In reply to discosucks:

I use dragons size 1-5 and totem basics below that (yellow, green and blue) and a black fixe alien I got from Alpkit. They're the only set I've ever had but have worked brilliant for me.

In reply to discosucks:

Not really a super helpful response but Ultralight Camelots are unbelievably light. Like, it's stupid. So probably those plus Totems.

In reply to discosucks:

As others have said, totems are a step up in terms of technology. I would recommend totems in the smaller sizes. It's worth trying those before you go buying the smaller camelots otherwise you might find yourself buying twice!

In reply to dr_botnik:

I wasn't even really aware of them till now. They look really neat.

I like how the lobes don't have anodising .

In reply to discosucks:

I've done exactly that recently, replacing a mismatched rack of 4CUs in two different colour schemes, and the choice was easy: Totems in the small sizes up to red, and Dragons thereafter. The orange Totem wasn't available when I bought the gold Dragon, but I think I'd still rather have the Dragon in that size than the Totem. The larger Totems an be frustratingly flexible.

The Totems are by far the best design of cam I've ever used.

In reply to discosucks:

Totems in all the available sizes, then either C4s or the neww Friends outside of that. As much as I love DMM, C4s and the new Friends are far nicer to use.