/ Black Diamond Cyborg crampon front point replacements

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JXM - on 11 Nov 2016
Through my local retailer I have been informed that BD does not have any replacement front points for the Cyborgs in stock and they don’t know when they will become available again. Krukonogi only has the 20€/pc version in stock which would mean that 4 pieces would cost more than half a set of say a new set of Grivel G20.

Please help me make an informed decision. Should I get the expensive replacement front points from Krukonogi or should I take the opportunity to get new crampons, in that case which? If I do decide to convert to monos, then how is the fit of the G20 on LS Nepal EVO size 45?

I primarily climb euro ice with the occasional chance of mixed. Decisions, decisions.
Michael Gordon - on 11 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:

On Needlesports they say 'available to order' so it may be worth double checking with them? (I'd also be interested in what they say)
CurlyStevo - on 11 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:
YMMV but for most ice I prefer duals. If the ice is rotten or soft they are less likely to shear through it. Same goes in neve.
Post edited at 12:11
JXM - on 13 Nov 2016
In reply to Michael Gordon: Unfortunately Needlesport don't have them either and they got the same message from BD that BD don't know when the Cyborg front points will be available again. Apparently it was the same situation last winter. Needlesport suggest to look into crampons from other manufacturers if the problem with the unavailable front points carry on for much longer...

mrbird on 14 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:

Stumbled across this site a while ago as I am in the same situation. Anybody know about this lot?

Michael Gordon - on 14 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:

Bwox - on 14 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:

> how is the fit of the G20 on LS Nepal EVO size 45?

I can't say for sure about the Nepals specifically, I'm afraid, but the G20s fit fine on my size 44 Scarpa Phantom Ultras, and I think there's still a bit of room so a boot a size bigger should be okay.

I really like the G20s - it's a bit of a shame you can't replace the points, but they've done me a good few years now and still have some life left in them.

The point about duel tips offering more stability is valid, but I can't say I've ever regretted changing to monos - so far, soft or crappy ice I've come across hasn't particularly presented a problem that I can recall.
Lone Rider - on 18 Nov 2016
In reply to JXM:

I have Black Diamond Cyborg front points unused for sale still in their packages. £16 including posting per point or £60 the set of four.
Davie.G - on 12 Jan 2017
In reply to Michael Gordon:

I just ordered a pair of points from needlesport and even though it says on they're website that they have in stock, or no indication to say they don't have any in stock. They do not have any and are waiting for an order from BD. I called the shop and they could not confirm as when they will be getting any so I had to get a refund for which they had already taken the money from my account. What an inconvenience. Davie G
cb294 - on 12 Jan 2017
In reply to mrbird:

I haven´t used their crampon points, but a Russian colleague (who is a much better ice and mixed climber than I am and has done extensive new routing in the Pamirs) swears by their gear in general. Supposedly their stuff also used a lot by world cup competition ice climbers.

HeMa on 12 Jan 2017
In reply to cb294:

> Supposedly their stuff also used a lot by world cup competition ice climbers.

Not supposedly, but an actual fact... Ice World Cup kind of comps are rather big in Russia, and Krukonogi is a big player (but not the only one).

In my opinion, the stuff is great for hard mixed (continental style) and comps. Or the armor steel ones for (big) mountain routes. For ice, they're ok but not much better than the originals (maybe more robust, though...).

Here's a novel thought... get 2 new points (from Kruko) and then use 2 of your older as the outside front-points... to create a kind of hybrid mono/dual point (akin to the Snaggletooth or G21).
cb294 - on 12 Jan 2017
In reply to HeMa:

Thanks for the confirmation! I just did not know for sure, as I do not follow the competition stuff closely. I have some Krukonogi Monster replacement picks which look great, but are unfortunately still unused (no local ice the last couple of winters...)

In reply to Davie.G:

Actually, it does show whether we have stock or not on the website and we haven't had any of these for a while, so I am sorry you were inconvenienced but it's not as if we were lying to get your money - it actually would have said 0 stock and we'll order these in for you.

For what it's worth we have been trying to get information from Black Diamond about these for months. After being told numerous times by BD Europe that they didn't know when they would be available I eventually emailed BD USA saying I thought it was disgraceful that not only did they not have any in the winter season but they couldn't tell us when they would become available. I got an email back saying my email would be forwarded on to the right department, since then (about 4 weeks ago), nothing. One of the other staff clicked a thing on the BD website to get informed when they were back in stock - great excitement two days ago when they emailed to say they were. However, this is only in the USA, BD Europe still don't have any and can't tell us when they'll arrive (in fact they didn't know they were available in the US. I would think we have asked BD about these once a week for at least the past two months. Sadly they seem to have become a bit too corporate for their own good.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as suggesting new crampons just yet. The season is young and I'm sure most of you could sharpen the stubs up sufficiently for a few routes. If they are in the USA now, hopefully they have made enough of them that there'll be some spare to send our way!
In reply to JXM:

Just to let you know that we have finally had a reply from BD Europe saying that they expect to get 152 individual front points in two weeks time. Needless to say they won't go far spread out across the whole of Europe and it's still far from perfect.

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