UKC

Thinking of trying one of these, just wondering if anyone has put one to the test yet.

In reply to jmerrick21:

Seems like an exact copy of the Sea to Summit mats. Even the inflation valve seems to be the same.

A thumbs down for Alpkit. No innovation drive with this one, just copy something that works and sell it for cheaper since R&D costs are lower. They have always been similar, but not that obvious...

In reply to PPP:

Have Alpkit ever been purely about innovation? I think making similar products to other people and selling them at lower prices has been a massive part of their business model all along. I think it's the main reason for their success, in fact. Don't see anything wrong with that personally. In fact, I think it's great.

In reply to jmerrick21:

Having a number of old Alpkit Numo mats in which the insulation failed, and having used the insulated Sea to Summit mat that looks quite similar to this one, I imagine it won't be very warm.

See http://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/review.php?id=8458 and http://lightfromthenorth.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/physics-you-can-sleep-on-de...

Probably great for summer trips when you want the absolute lightest, smallest option - but quite possibly unpleasantly chilly by this time of year.

In reply to Luke90:

Alpkit are really interesting company I reckon - there business model itself was very innovative when they started even, if some of the products weren't. I remember years back that they had some issue with the (IIRC) the Numo sleeping mats because they were made in the same factory as mats for a US brand were (can't remember their name now) and the US company was at least accusing them of patent infringement or something along those lines.

But Alpkit have done loads of innovative products I would say - they were I guess the first serious makers of bikepacking gear in Europe, and one of the first worldwide. Their own bouldering mats were also pretty revolutionary in that they were the first bouldering mats loads of climbers bought simply because they were so affordable in comparison to what else was on the market. Even the new bike range seems to have fitted well into a niche that wasn't being filled so well in the UK previously.

In reply to Luke90:

I mean, there are products that are similar to competitors as there's so much you can create. Their Kraku stove is great for what it is. It doesn't pretend to copy something else (indeed, it is made by Fire Maple). Same with many other things, like tent pegs, bags, clothing, etc.

Even Brukit was a failed attempt (IMHO - tried both Brukit and MSR Windboiler). You can't take a (fairly) unique design, copy that and sell it for less. Their stuff usually doesn't offer anything apart from a lower price.

It is all just my personal opinion. I care about innovation as I'm a gear geek. If something is undoubtedly better than any other design, I can justify a higher price. If someone, however, attempts to copy that design and sell it, they won't see my money.

This particular mat triggered me (ha!) just because there's nothing similar I've seen. Sea to Summit has been creating some very interesting stuff (foldable kettle anyone?), yet the usual UKC response is "IT IS SO EXPENSIVE!".

In reply to jmerrick21:

I Cloud works well enough for me.

In reply to jmerrick21:

Thanks for the response guys. I'm fine with cheep copies even if they are not pushing innovation.
I was thinking of combining with a thermarest z lite for a bit of protection and versatility. Should also solve the coldness issue?

In reply to jmerrick21:

I've used the controversially similar Sea to Summit mat with a Z-lite and thought it was an amazing combination. I cut the Z-lite short to save space.

In reply to Luke90:
Seems a good compromise to me, having a comfortable but fragile air mat with a insulated, tough mat underneath. At least if the air mat fails I'll not be on the ground.
Also combined they still costs less than thermarest xtherm, which was my initial thought.

In reply to PPP:


Nemo and Big Agnes use the same vertical baffles and with the same valve too, with a lot of this stuff it's not always clear who is the innovator. Even the foldable kettle is now produced by mainstream camping and cooking companies, was that a sea to summit innovation?

In reply to winhill:

Inflatable mats have been longer than I exsisted, so hard to tell who's the innovator! But if you look at the Sea To Summit sleeping mat selection and compare it against this Alpkit one, they look far too identical to my liking to say that it wasn't an exact copy!

The Sea to Summit mugs are great, but I highly doubt that it was an innovation. Innovation to the outdoor market? Possibly so.

Either way, that's why we have patents - as a customer, I can either pay for the goods or buy elsewhere.