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First service for a scooter crazy price!

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 jules699 10 Mar 2017
So just been quoted £160 for first service for a Honda PCX 125 scooter. From Honda dealer. Wtf!? More than a car. Advice anyone please?
Removed User 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

More than a car! What kinda car are you driving? I need one of those.
1
OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to Removed User:

Pug 208. And my mate who has a new Mercedes says his is cheaper too.
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 balmybaldwin 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

a first service for a modern car basically means a change of oil, top up other fluids, a visual inspection, some software updates, and a car wash - about an hour's work

your little 125 scooter will probably require more than that at a first service as scooters are still rather unrefined, plus access is harder meaning the job takes more time

Why not learn to do it yourself?
Lusk 10 Mar 2017
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Vehicle Service, probably one of the most expensive rubber stamps know to man.
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OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Oh. Hmm. Unrefined? Don't have inclination to do myself. It's a blokes world, no offence!
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 balmybaldwin 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

I only mean they aren't as full of computers and designed for super long service periods and strict emissions control like modern cars...therefore they are mechanically relatively simple.... and little hands would help!
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OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to balmybaldwin:

So they should be cheaper to service?
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 Mooncat 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

It's an oil change and a nut and bolt check, take it to a qualified independent to save a few quid.
1
OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to Mooncat:

Cheers mate
MarkJH 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

As others have said: it's time.

Bikes are not hard to service, but access is difficult and can require a fair bit of disassembly. It is fairly normal for bikes to cost more than cars I think.

Looking at your scooter owners manual online, it seems that the manufacturer requires a valve clearance check after 600 miles which can be a bit of a pain to do. You could probably get away without it, but a Honda dealer would have to do it, and it would have to be done to keep the warranty.
 Mooncat 10 Mar 2017
In reply to MarkJH:

No, Triumph lost a court case over exactly this, any qualified mechanic can do any service so long as the service schedule is adhered to.
However, every time I buy a new bike I always make sure they agree to do the first service free or at the worst pay for parts and fluids.
MarkJH 10 Mar 2017
In reply to Mooncat:
> No, Triumph lost a court case over exactly this, any qualified mechanic can do any service so long as the service schedule is adhered to. However, every time I buy a new bike I always make sure they agree to do the first service free or at the worst pay for parts and fluids.

Yes, sorry; that wasn't clear. I meant that the maintenance schedule would have to be kept to; not that it would have to be a Honda dealer.

My point was that a Honda dealer would (i imagine) be required to keep to the schedule, where an independent might be happy to just do oil and filters etc.
Post edited at 23:06
OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to MarkJH:

Ok. Might have to bite the bullet then?
MarkJH 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

> Ok. Might have to bite the bullet then?

Perhaps, but as Mooncat says, there isn't any reason why you can't go elsewhere and see what they would charge (but making sure that you specify the work rather than just relying on them doing 'a service').
OP jules699 10 Mar 2017
In reply to MarkJH:

Yep. Will try that. Dont want to quit biking just yet due to cost.
 martinturner 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

Your mate lies... I've just paid £350 for a service on a year old Mercedes.
£160 doesn't seem unreasonable for a main dealer service to be honest, bike or not.
 Mooncat 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

youtube.com/watch?v=4B5fEOb6uck&

F*cking scooters, half an hour taking the bodywork to bits for a slightly fiddly 10 minute job. Chuck it in the canal and get a 125 motorbike.
1
 Timmd 10 Mar 2017
In reply to jules699:

> Oh. Hmm. Unrefined? Don't have inclination to do myself. It's a blokes world, no offence!

Climbing was a bloke's world once.
 gethin_allen 11 Mar 2017
In reply to Removed User:

> More than a car! What kinda car are you driving? I need one of those.

For a car the Honda standard dealers service is £155, or it was a few months back when mine was done
 humptydumpty 11 Mar 2017
In reply to Lusk:

Is servicing cars is a waste of time/money?
1
 Dax H 11 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:

A valve clearance check is a lot more work than a basic car service.
 Dax H 11 Mar 2017
In reply to Mooncat:

> No, Triumph lost a court case over exactly this, any qualified mechanic can do any service so long as the service schedule is adhered to. However.

There is a little more to it than that.
If you get it serviced away from the main dealer you need to ensure that the independent does and documents each step of the service as listed by the manufacturer and only uses genuine manufacturers parts including any oil or fluids they may change.

If 6 months down the line your engine siezed up and you try claim a warranty that will be out of the window of any non genuine parts or oil were used and you might end up stuck between the dealer saying x was missed from the service or not done correctly and the independent saying it was, both refusing to budge and you stuck piggy in the middle with no bike.
 gethin_allen 11 Mar 2017
In reply to Dax H:

> A valve clearance check is a lot more work than a basic car service.

They throw that in there to get people to go to the dealership. They recommend a valve clearance check at all minor services and when I asked them what this involved, because I thought it was a bit severe for a general service, they just said they listen to the engine, and not even using any special equipment. I struggle to see what they could hear by ear that would determine valve clearance.
The Honda service is a bit of a con, the basic service doesn't even involve a new air filter or a spark plug check /change. And with me they missed bulbs that were out, didn't fill the washers, and over filled the oil to the point that it was an inch over the max on the dipstick. They also itemized the bill to include a new drain plug washer when they actually sucked the old oil out of the dipstick hole because they didn't want to remove the under tray.
 Dax H 11 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:

I have been to dealers and independent places like that.
For me it's all about finding a place I trust.
I use an independent mobile guy on my Triumph bike and he practically stripped it to component parts on the 20k service.
Also he only used genuine branded triumph parts and oil from a sealed container.
 gethin_allen 11 Mar 2017
In reply to Dax H:

I won't bother taking the car for an official service next year. At 6 years old I doubt I'm preserving the resale value by much and they want £300 ish for a major service which I can do for about £70 in parts and oil.
And I'll probably do a better job of it.
Jim C 11 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:
All of that may well be true( for some main dealers) but true or not , that does not take away from DaxH point that :-
"If 6 months down the line your engine siezed up and you try claim a warranty that will be out of the window of any non genuine parts or oil were used and you might end up stuck between the dealer saying x was missed from the service or not done correctly and the independent saying it was, both refusing to budge and you stuck piggy in the middle with no bike. "

My daughter's insurance tried to tell her that her car insurance would go up , because she had ' modified' the car .
She had put a logo and contact number of her company on the doors !

The dealers make the rules, so DaxH is right ,don't give them an excuse to walk away for the sake of a few extra quid, if there is an expensive problem that appears in the warranty period.
Post edited at 21:37
 jimjimjim 11 Mar 2017
In reply to balmybaldwin:

> Why not learn to do it yourself?

Probably needs to be an authorised garage to keep the warranty sweet.

 Dax H 12 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:

I only dealer service whilst it's under warranty then I either do it myself or send it to a trusted garage if I don't have time.

My current motorcycle is a 17k bike with a 2 year warranty, it would save me approximately £200 per year to take it to an independent using genuine parts rather than the main dealer.
I won't jeopardise a warranty on a machine of that value for £200 per year.
Once that "don't worry we will fix it" ticket runs out in March 2019 it will be a different story.
 gethin_allen 12 Mar 2017
In reply to Jim C:

What parts are going to be required for a basic service? Oil, and an oil filter. That's the lot. Both have standards set for performance and so if you use parts that conform to these standards you can't go wrong. If you use the wrong grade oil you're an idiot.
To dodge a warranty claim the manufacturer would have to prove that your actions or inaction was directly related to the problem.
The car company can't force you to go to a dealer to maintain warranties etc. it's against the law.

As far as your daughter's insurance goes, I don't see what this has to do with vehicle servicing but, she will have accepted the T+Cs when she took out the policy and having a sign written vehicle probably changes the risk, for example, crash for cash fraudsters target sign written vehicle because they are normally well insured.
Jim C 12 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:

I'm not sure if you are deliberately not understanding the point made by DaxH

I worked for an OEM, we gave warranties, WE set the rules for the warranties, if the equipment failed, and we as the OEM had not serviced the equipment ourselves, we were then in a strong position to challenge a free warranty repair. Before taking on any repair we would require that the customer jump through hoops to demonstrate , to our satisfaction , that our exact servicing specifications had been followed, whilst under the warranty period, therefore Dax H is correct buyers are better to pay a little more for in- warranty services , to ensure that any expensive failure, is clearly the manufacturers responsibility to fix free of charge, quickly and without quibble.

The mention of the insurance, demonstrates the kind of frivolous get - out - clauses that large organisations will rely on to get out of their responsibilities.
A modified car, would not be covered for insurance, so she was paying for a policy that they would not have paid out for, as she had 'modified' the car and not told them.
1
 gethin_allen 12 Mar 2017
In reply to Jim C:

So did your daughter answer yes or no to the question 'is the car modified?'

This is a simple case of the person didn't tell the truth.

Considering how the issue of dealer servicing vs independent servicing has been through the courts and scrutinised exhaustively before it being judged that requiring dealers to service a vehicle to maintain a warranty is anti competition and illegal it would be a rather foolish manufacturer to chase this again if the vehicle has been serviced by an independent garage with parts that meet all the relevant standards.
OEM parts are another issue as in some cases the aftermarket parts are far superior and far cheaper.
 Mooncat 12 Mar 2017
In reply to Dax H:

I'm arguing against my own point here but I bought an Aprilia a couple of years ago which was supposed to have a valve clearance check at the first service. It clearly didn't and due to a valve piston interface needed a new engine less than 1000 miles later. Ive no doubt I'd have had it sorted eventually if the service was by an independent but because it was a dealer service it was much more straightforward than it could have been.
 Dax H 12 Mar 2017
In reply to Mooncat:

It was an Aprilia, the dealer was probably shocked it lasted 1000 miles on its first engine.

 Dax H 12 Mar 2017
In reply to gethin_allen:

Some dealers are great, others will argue the toss on warranty even if they have serviced it.
It's the whole risk vs reward thing.
The little bit more I pay to a garage I trust far out weighs the potential hassle and stress when things can and do go wrong.

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