UKC

Hello!

First time posting here so let me know if this is not the best area for the question..

So I started climbing almost 2 years ago, aged 20, and have been completely hooked since. Started training three times a week pretty much immediately and now 19 months down the road am starting to push through v6+ at the local gym plus a couple easy top ropes and leads outdoors..

The problem now is with my tendons! This is now the second time I've taken time off due to fairly severe pain in my elbow and forearm. I gather these sorts of injuries are fairly common and I've been doing various light eccentric excercises and icing them but so far there has been little improvement..

I gather that tendons generally take longer to strengthen up compared to muscle and maybe I just neeed patience but I'd be really grateful for any advice on what I can do to accelerate the process!

Anyway sorry for the long post

In reply to DireMaker:
The http://davemacleod.com/shop/makeorbreak.html book has lots of good info.

One piece of advice I was given for avoiding hand + forearm injuries is to avoid super-crimpy problems at the start of a session. Make sure you're fully warmed up before giving those tendons too much work.


Yeah, as I understand it that's because they don't have nearly as much bloodflow as muscles, and so don't get the same rapid repair after a work out that results in thicker, stronger muscle fibres.

Edit: just found http://www.rockandice.com/rock-climbing-training/training-while-injured which might be useful.

In reply to DireMaker:

Injury prevention is key. Warm up properly and don't forget to cool down. Train your antagonistic muscles, its very important and often overlooked. Press ups, dips and pull ups (palm facing in) finger extensions using an elastic band will help with this. Also there are a few dumbbell exercises that can help. I have suffered on and off with a similar issue for years and now have finally got rid of it by sticking to a personal warm up and cool down programme.
Tendons can take 6weeks plus to repair so you will have to rest. When a tendon is swollen it wont repair. If you continue to use damaged tendons they will only get worse.
In summary, Rest for a few weeks then do some light dumbbell work which you can find on line (search golfers and tennis elbow) and a small amount of press-ups maybe 5 sets of 5 daily. Then light climbing, jug ladders, traversing, endurance ect (don't forget to warm up and incorporate press-ups in your cool down) see how you feel after that and if every thing is ok then slowly build up the grades.

In reply to DireMaker:
I have suffered elbow problems on and off for ages. Dave MacLeod ' s Make or Break book has good advice, but if you can spare £100 get yourself an armaid especially if your injuries have been ongoing for a while. Google it. They work to massage and gently lengthen muscles of forearm taking some of the tension off tendons associated with tennis and golfer's elbow. All of the advice above is good, but used in conjunction with the armaid my elbow pain has become bearable again! They are American, but Glasgow climbing wall import them in. Expensive but I use mine regularly and it has definitely helped. Good luck.

Thanks so much for all the advice everyone, and sorry for my late reply - don't get on the internet a whole lot atm!

NoddyBoulder - thanks for the link to the book - will definitely order one come payday! I've recently bought another one called 'conditioning for climbers' (can't for the life of me remember the author) which is really good but doesn't seem to go into injuries so much.

Machine - cheers for the advice on antagonist training - never thought about using palm facing chin ups fornantagonist training before but now that you mention it it makes sense! Definitely need to sort out a more disciplined antagonist routine - thinking I can work in an antagonist routine on my 'rest days' seeing as I'm mostly working different muscles?

Lorentz - thanks for putting game on to these - never heard of them before but I've been wondering whether something like that existed.. £100 is an it if a stretch for at the moment - not sure I could resist the urge to spend it on quick draws, but will look into them in more depth.

I actually tried a couple training sessions this week after a little under 3 weeks rest with lots of eccentric wrist exercises and it seems to be ok - warmed up really thoroughly and avoided any routes involving super dynamic moves or hyper extensions. Going to sit down tonight and plan out my new training routine, incorporating the advice you guys have given on warm ups and antagonist training, and maybe accepting a few more rest days than I would like!

In reply to DireMaker:
There's a few articles on here about it if you search.

Don't do dips all the way down.
Don't do weighted pullups.

One move too many is probably the most detailed + comprehensive book out on climbing injuries.

Lateral Epicondylitis.... Tennis Elbow Exercise - Tyler Twist -
youtube.com/watch?v=A2QQaVfeI4U&

Medial Epicondylitis.... Golfers Elbow Exercise - Reverse Tyler Twist
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9P-QOaCoDWY&itct=CAkQpDAYCCITCOjSgNibsM8CFQ9h...

Read the comments for ths vids too.

youtube.com/watch?v=zB3TVb8a5mk&

http://thomasbondphysio.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/climbers-elbow-brachialis-te...

Eric Horst's Training for Climbing / nicros website has loads of useful info once you happen upon how to expand the menus there!
http://nicros.com/training-center-posts/training/training-articles/injury/

I think reverse wrist curls are supposed to help too, or rolling a broom handle with weight hanging on cord.

In reply to machine:

What do you mean by palms facing in pull ups?
In some fitness gyms there are hang bars with parallel grips, eg picture a dip frame at head height you can pull up on... Is that what you mean.? Or do you mean palms facing towards your front as in chin ups, rather than palms facing away as in normal pullups.
Note to OP... I don't think Machine is referring to any these other pull ups as good antagonistics really...( or are you?) They are variations of pull ups, and will still stress your elbows, perhaps slightly less though? .

In reply to Rock to Fakey:

Apologies again or the severely delayed response! I've actually just bought Dave Macleod's book 'Make or Break' as suggested by NoddyBoulder - looks really good. I took it with me to the physio (who fortunately is also a climber herself) yesterday who confirmed (as i'd by then suspected) that i've got Medial Epicondylitis / golfer's elbow in both arms. Also seem to have strained both brachioradialis muscles.

Interestingly she suggested that the science behind tendon rehab has actually moved on a little since the book was published; whereas the book recommends purely eccentric exercises, apparently the current thought is that it is better to start with isometric excercises before moving on to light concentric contractions and then eventually eccentric. I've put together a pretty thorough antagonist routine now to do on every non-climbing day, and for the time being I'll be focussing training on slab work, balance and technique - avoiding anything too overhanging or dynamic.

Thanks for all the advice from everyone! Loving this forum already