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Advice for sea angler

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Adam83 01 Jul 2017
Hello all, I've just signed up here as I am looking for a bit of advice. I know nothing about rock climbing other than the blindingly obvious: I did it once on a school trip about 20 years ago (I did enjoy it) but that's it!

I do a lot of sea fishing from rock marks in the north west of Scotland and have found a few spots where it would be sensible for me to have a rope to help me get down to the shore-line and back up again - also for a couple of these spots it would be sensible for me to have a rope attached to me while fishing, in the unlikely event of falling in. A life jacket/flotation suit will keep me afloat, but will not help me get back up the rocks if I got swept away in a strong tidal current. I do have plenty spots that are a doddle to get to, and very safe - but it's just these couple of new ones I've found that may produce much better fishing, but of course as sods law dictates, they are just slightly pushing the wrong way on my comfort zone for access, and remoteness.

So, a few bits of info just to give a general idea of what I currently do/don't do:

Always check weather forecast and state of the sea - don't go in bad weather or if the swell is dangerous
Always tell somebody where I'm going and when I'll be back
Always spend time assessing routes down to shoreline before actually doing it - look before leap
Never walk/scramble down to areas that look remotely dodgy
Never go down to a spot that would be difficult to get back up if it starts raining and rocks get wet/slippy

I am an extremely experienced shore angler and if it doesn't seem quite right, or if something is out of my comfort zone, I don't do it. If I were to use a rope it would be more as a fail safe eg. I would be able to safely get down the rocks and back without the rope, but would feel more comfortable having it there. I'm not looking to start getting myself down vertical or very steep slopes. It would literally just be for a helping hand.

So what I'm looking for is:

A way to make an anchor point if there isn't a suitable natural object to tie rope around. Is there something I can get that I could hammer in between cracks in the rock to anchor a rope?

Advice on what sort of rope to get?

Advice on attaching the rope to myself. Can I attach a rope to the metal D ring on a life jacket via a carabiner?

Thanks

Adam


 philhilo 01 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:

Hi Adam, I used to do a lot of sea angling with my dad and on my own, so understand your urges and dilemma. Also been climbing for 40 years + so fair bit of experience here too.
To do what you want I.e be able to set up a safely anchored top rope and use it for descent I.e abseil, realistically requires a reasonable amount of experience equating to a couple of courses. Securing the rope requires skills and equipment - and pitons that you hammer in are not the way forward, then you need a harness - the d rings on your lifejacket are not suitable. Then getting back out with your kit on your own will be another whole new ball game of advanced techniques .
To do it all safely I think you would be looking at £500 of kit, £500-1000 in courses and a year or two of experience. You might do it with less - but not safely, and on a sea cliff on your own that's not a place to be. Sorry to put a dampener on things but that's how I see it. Have a good one.
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Adam83 01 Jul 2017
In reply to philhilo:

Thanks very much for the input. Just to be crystal clear I would have absolutely no intention of accessing somewhere where climbing equipment would be necessary, what I am looking for is a rope that I can potentially use to help sturdy myself while walking down the rocks. For example, there are some paths down to steep beaches where there are railings/rope to hold on to as you walk up/down the steep sand to the beach, more for elderly or less able people. that's the kind of thing I'm getting at. Although as you say, securing a rope at the top would be something I would need to learn how to do properly. But at the moment I don't know how to do that unless there is some sort of existing structure...

In terms of the need to attach a rope to myself whilst fishing as a precaution, I would obviously need to get the right sort of harness, but I don't know what to get. Also, it presents the same problem of requiring a secure anchoring point at the other end of it. I'm just wondering if there is a way to do it so that in the unlikely event of falling into the sea, I would be safely attached to solid ground...

I know that some of the serious anglers on the north east coast of England abseil down to fishing spots as this is the only way to access much of the best fishing. I'm lucky here as there is a lot of deep water readily accessible on foot (albeit a hike to get there). As I say, I only fish places where I can easily get down and back up from without needing rope, but I've found a couple of new bits where I can do this, but it would probably be sensible to have a rope to grab on to if I felt I needed to.

Deadeye 01 Jul 2017
In reply to philhilo:


> To do it all safely I think you would be looking at £500 of kit, £500-1000 in courses and a year or two of experience.

Tosh. If he's sensible and finds a knowledgeable person to show him how, some second hand kit and no courses would be fine.
 Morty 01 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:
What about if you offer some sort of reciprocal arrangement? You offer to take a novice fisherman out and teach them a few new skills. In return, a competent climber takes you out and teaches you the ropes. I'm sure you would have a few bites. If you lived near me I'd love the opportunity. Maybe you could repost in the lifts and partners section.
Post edited at 17:53
cp123 01 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:
> So what I'm looking for is:

> A way to make an anchor point if there isn't a suitable natural object to tie rope around. Is there something I can get that I could hammer in between cracks in the rock to anchor a rope?

You could get yourself a set of nuts (https://www.needlesports.com/2911/products/wild-country-classic-rock-set.as... that you jam in cracks in the rock. Attach this to your rope via a locking carabiner and you are good to go. Be careful of course that the nut is properly seated in the crack so it won't come out and ideally you would have more than one with the rope attached in a way that if one does come out the others will hold.

Also depending on the ground a large stake that can be hammered into the turf can provide a very good anchor.


> Advice on what sort of rope to get?

I would say some static rope like this (https://www.needlesports.com/1865/products/beal-semi-static-abseil-rope-10-... should be fine, long enough for your usage. You can get thinner ropes but they become hard to grip - either way you may want to tie knots in it every 2 feet to make it easier to hold.

> Advice on attaching the rope to myself. Can I attach a rope to the metal D ring on a life jacket via a carabiner?

If the D ring and its attachment looks study enough then yes. Get a carabiner with a screw gate because sods law would dictate if you fell in a non locking one would unclip. That would mean if you did fall in you would have to hand over hand up the rope to get back to the rocks.

As with all these things getting it wrong can be serious so use your judgement, play it safe and test things before trusting your life with it.
Post edited at 18:47
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 marsbar 01 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:
Please be aware that many flotation devices will deliberately be designed with weak D rings that are designed to break in an attempt to prevent drowning if they catch on something underwater.

On the same lines you should never be attached to a rope in or around water without a good sharp knife you can get hold of easily if you are underwater and tangled up.

My concern is that you may be making one risk lower and another one higher by adding a rope in this situation. Add this to a false sense of being safer and therefore going to more dangerous places and I think it doesn't sound sensible to me. You may be better off avoiding places where there is a serious risk of getting swept in. Unless you are prepared to wear a drysuit (probably not practical) your survival time in cold water isnt great eother.

I think getting a harness and a rope to get down and up again isn't a bad idea, but I think fishing while attached might be.
Post edited at 20:27
 Billhook 01 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:

There are many steep access points around our NE coast used by fisherman like you.

They generally use 12mm or more ordinary polypropolene rope - the blue stuff you see around - in places it is sometimes doubled up, and quite often knotted every so often. so it can be gripped easier. I've never seen them use stretchy climbing rope.

As for belays here the ground is generally shale rock with bands of sandstone. The most noticable belays are either stout metal stakes or short lengths of scaffold pole well hammered into the softer ground. (I've never seen any one use fancy climber's nuts, and so on.

If you want more info I'm sure one of the shore/sea anger's forums will give you sound advice.
Adam83 02 Jul 2017
In reply to marsbar:
Aye, I know what you mean... My first thought was the risk of tripping over on the rope while fishing, regardless of anything else! I have a flotation suit and a life jacket, but apart from anything else it would probably be a pain in the arse to fish while attached to a rope. I would never fish anywhere where there would be any real risk of being swept in rope attached or not.

However, it might be worth thinking about something I could attach to myself temporarily for safety while getting nearer to the water for landing fish...

All of the above are things I think about before fishing - is it safe to get down and back, where is the tide mark, is there a safe place to land the fish etc. You've really got to study the area well before you fish it...

But yes, it may present more problems than it solves!
Adam83 02 Jul 2017
In reply to Adam83:

Thanks for all the input everyone, much appreciated and very helpful!

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