UKC

Yosemite or Smith Rock State Park

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TomBerliner 14 Aug 2017
Hi,

I am doing a road trip of West Coast USA in September and am a relatively newish climber (climbing only 6A+/6B indoors).

I am passing through both Smith Rock State Park in Oregon and Yosemite. I am looking for any advice I can get on which one would be best if I can only devote a day to climbing either (various reasons of time, money and logistics). I'd be looking to book a climbing guide in either (Im not yet fully competent on lead climbing).

Any advice anyone could give would be very appreciated!

Tom
 ashtond6 14 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

Yosemite should be easier to get a guide and take you up something like nutcracker
 Offwidth 14 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:
Yosemite guides have a monopoly of sorts and are pretty pricy but very good. Smith Rock would be cheaper for a guide and have more sports climbing. Post on Mountain Project or Supertopo to get local help and offers. Many settle with climbing with an experienced partner they hooked up with online for free.
Post edited at 18:10
 seankenny 14 Aug 2017
In reply to ashtond6:

> Yosemite should be easier to get a guide and take you up something like nutcracker

If Tuolomne is still open that could be a better bet for a low-grade day out. Nicer climbing and a wonderful setting.
 Offwidth 14 Aug 2017
In reply to seankenny:

Campsite closes 25th Sept unless they get the first big autumn storm (with snow) earlier. Ive been about 12 times in Sept and only snowed off once.
 GDes 14 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

Smith could be pretty hot still in September. Mainly single pitch sport climbing (very good at that). Yosemite will be more of a multi pitch adventure.

Why not do both? As others have said, super topo is a great way to find someone to meet up with to climb. Very friendly website in my experience.
 rpc 14 Aug 2017
In reply to GDes:

Many others can offer you Yosemite advice but, in short, Yos. is "world class" while Smith is not (maybe if you're climbing 5.14 - which I wouldn't know).

However, for a 6a/b climber I'd recommend either Smith's multi-pitch routes (eg: Zebra Zion is a wonderful 5.10a, 4 pitch outing; Pioneer Route on Monkey face goes at 5.7 A0 and has some incredible positions for something so moderate; Skyridge is a 2.5 pitch 5.8 that's one of the most visible lines in the park; White Satin is a 3 pitch 5.9....etc) or Smith's Lower Gorge for single pitch crack/trad routes on perfect stone. The upside of Smith is that there's no camping related BS - just show up & grab a spot either at the state park campground (next to climbing) or a BLM campground a few miles away.
pasbury 15 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

Really only a day? If you can spare more time you will reap the rewards at Yosemite, it has a steep learning curve!
 plyometrics 15 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

One day?

Go to Yosemite and head straight for Camp 4.

Spend the day soaking up the atmosphere, views and bouldering.
TomBerliner 16 Aug 2017
In reply to rpc:

Im not going to be camping - just staying in Bend for one night - but sort-of camping in Yosemite.

If im not an experienced outdoor climber - is Yosemite perhaps just too difficult to climb?
pasbury 16 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:
> If im not an experienced outdoor climber - is Yosemite perhaps just too difficult to climb?

Unless your previous experience is on fine grained granite then it's not the easiest place to gain experience in one day. It is, however, bloody fantastic to go to anyway, - unless you think you'll get another opportunity to go again soon then don't miss it.
Post edited at 11:12
 Toerag 16 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:
> If im not an experienced outdoor climber - is Yosemite perhaps just too difficult to climb?

If you're climbing 6a then Yosemite 5.7/8 will be within your capability, especially with a guide. There are some cool routes at that grade you'd get a rewarding experience on. I'd go to Yosemite with your tourist head on - it's a spectacular place even if you're not a climber.
Post edited at 11:42
 rpc 16 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

there's a cool little area with a 4-pitch 5.9 route right outside of Bend. You could pull off the whole thing in 3 hrs from Bend (in other words, you can do both: Yosemite & central Oregon). Ping me if you want more details. Smith is about a 30min drive from Bend.
 beardy mike 16 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

Go to Tuolumne meadows and do Cathedral peak. You'll be puffing your lungs out of your arse on the walk in but the route is great and super classic. Much better than anything you'll do in Yosemite valley at that grade simply because you get to the top. Anything in the valley you'll still be staring up at the tops wondering why you can't be up there.
 alpinist63 17 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

it's a shame to only have 1 day climbing when in Yosemite..... so get most out of it: this route is world class: major summit, cool climbing ....
http://www.supertopo.com/rock-climbing/Yosemite-Valley-Half-Dome-Snake-Dike
 Offwidth 17 Aug 2017
In reply to beardy mike:
Nonsense... Royal Arches is also HS and a two minute walk-in and goes up 15 pitches to the valley edge and Snake Dyke is (a genuine lung puffing approach to a ) VS and a scramble and a major top. Every grade above VS gives new long possibilities to the top of major features. If your lungs were busting to Cathedral you walk too fast... its a pleasant gentle uphill stroll for just over an hour in a lovely forest. None of these are sensible for a one day visit in any case.
Post edited at 15:23
1
 beardy mike 17 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:
What is nonsense about it? Do you get to the top of the valley on Royal Arches? No. And Half dome is simply not practical for a day out - it's a massive walk in and out. Cathedral peak walk in starts at circa 2200m and gains a fair bit so if you come up from sealevel, yes, you will be out of puff, even if you're not hacking it. And you could easily do cathedral peak in a day - as you say yourself, it's an hour to walk in and out and has one pitch of 5.8, the rest being fairly trivial. Indeed I seem to remember you can bypass the 5.8 pitch at a lower grade if you want to. But then all of this is just opinions and I generally enjoyed the meadows more than the valley. I just thought in general the climbing is better quality and the views are utterly outstanding.
Post edited at 20:08
 MikeTS 17 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

I was in the same sit. Chose Yosemite. Just being there is a life enhancing experience.
 Offwidth 18 Aug 2017
In reply to beardy mike:

There is no 5.8 climbing on the two main variants of Cathedral the main line is 5.6. It's viable in a day no more than various other biggish targets are and for a day trip you will be rushing past mega scenery in a rather strange way...I dont get what sense Roayl Arches doesn't reach the rim unless you choose not to (like some rap back down Snake Dyke rather than going up to the summit). My advice would be just do a multiplitch in the valley and bask in its glory and save Tuolumne and the better 'moderate' climbing for when you have a week or more.
 timjones 18 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

> Nonsense... Royal Arches is also HS and a two minute walk-in and goes up 15 pitches to the valley edge and Snake Dyke is (a genuine lung puffing approach to a ) VS and a scramble and a major top. Every grade above VS gives new long possibilities to the top of major features. If your lungs were busting to Cathedral you walk too fast... its a pleasant gentle uphill stroll for just over an hour in a lovely forest. None of these are sensible for a one day visit in any case.

I'd say that if you are stopping in Yosemite
then Cathedral is one of the better objectives for a single day of.climbing.
 Cellinski 18 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

If you are fit enough, then go for Snake Dike at Half Dome. I have done >1000 multipitch routes all over the world and Snake Dike is way below my limit. But I still remember it as a very good day out. At Smith Rocks, my choice would be the Pioneer Route at Monkey Face. A bit short but somehow also very impressive and special. At Tuolomne Meadows, I found Cathedral Peak nice for the scenery, but the climb itself is not that outstanding. Another option at Tuolomne which has not been mentioned above would be Regular Route at Fairview Dome. The climb itself is not outstanding either, but it is still on a nice feature (dome) which is quite impressive to look at, it's relatively long and close to the road.
 timjones 18 Aug 2017
In reply to Cellinski:

The first 2 pitches of Regular Route are as slick as snot IIRC, possibly not the best start to a single day of climbing in Yosemite.
 beardy mike 19 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

My mistake, I remembered 5.8 when I did the 5.7 variant. Yes the valley is amazing but then so is looking down on the Matthes crest and the Sierra. Still not sure what qualifies a 5 pitch 5.6 with an hours walk in and out as a big day out. And being fair, I would say save the valley for when you have 3 weeks and can really explore! Hehe... opinions are like buses!
 Offwidth 19 Aug 2017
In reply to beardy mike:
You have to drive there on busy slow roads. Work out where you are going from the parking and where the route is on a first time visit. You have to deal with the altitude (that some can struggle with first day). Something on Glacier Point Apron or Manure Pile or similar just makes much more sense. The 5.7 variant that loops left is easy 5.6 PG as well, IMHO.

Something like The Grack Centre on Glacier Point Apron is super classic 5.6 route of about the same length (500' vs 700') with a 10 minute walk-in, quick rap descent and great views and with more alternatives if super busy and/or really good stuff to try next nearby if you are quick.
Post edited at 13:00
 Offwidth 19 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:
It's polished but slick as snot in Yosemite should really be a term used for the many glacial polished surfaces. Pitch 1 has well protected HVS 5b polished edges at the shortish crux and further up the route gets technically easier but stays HVS mainly for sustained nature for about 2 more pitches, it then slowly eases to the tricky VS roof pitch and then is a long HVD to the top. The 'walk off' is terror inducing for those unused to such....long winding diff slabs above a huge drop and hard to protect well. When we did it it, pitch 1 was partly iced and we dispatched it OK even though we could barely feel our fingers and only being HVS leaders. Its completly unsuitable for the OP but possibly OK for a quick party cruising at those grades who start early afternoon to avoid the morning queues.
Post edited at 13:13
 timjones 19 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

It's interesting how different people have different impressions of the same route. I thought the first pitch was polished and unpleasant, but it was wet throughout.

I don't think I would give any part of the route HVS and would say that the roof pitch was nowhere near VS, the walk off was simple IMO.

We dodged the queues by the simple trick of getting to the base at dawn
 Offwidth 19 Aug 2017
In reply to Cellinski:

Maybe you are too good to feel the quality. RR was to me up with the very best adventure lead climbs around the HVS grade I've done anywhere. Its maybe a disappointment as a 5.9 as the crux is a short bit of this grade in pitch one.
 Offwidth 19 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:
That first pitch is standard easier HVS 5b. Pitch 3 is 60m of sustained safe 4b with the odd 4c move... solid Pembroke HVS. I'm at at peak sensitivity on VS roofs and that roof is for sure solid VS with a tricky lock-off (leading with a biggish rack) to pull out. On Skye such featureless lower angle friction slabs with no gear at all would be Mod at least (eg Dubh ridge) with good belays but the technicality would obviously be very easy for the grade.


Reading this I may have done the 5.9 variant on the roof:

https://www.mountainproject.com/v/regular-route/105847227
Post edited at 13:49
 timjones 19 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

> That first pitch is standard easier HVS 5b. Pitch 3 is 60m of sustained safe 4b with the odd 4c move... solid Pembroke HVS. I'm at at peak sensitivity on VS roofs and that roof is for sure solid VS with a tricky lock-off (leading with a biggish rack) to pull out. On Skye such featureless lower angle friction slabs with no gear at all would be Mod at least (eg Dubh ridge) with good belays but the technicality would obviously be very easy for the grade.

> Reading this I may have done the 5.9 variant on the roof:


I think the problem with grade comparisons is that depending on how well you adapt climbing to Yosemite granite it is quite possible that you would be well advised to use the grade comparison charts as firelighting material
 Offwidth 19 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:

Two widely experienced UK climbers on grit and granite and one experienced grit climber all of whom had done a fair bit of guidebook work for the BMC all nicely warmed up in the trip and all leading around HVS on this style and we all thought standard HVS as did all the other brits we talked to. I think you're just not taking into account it might be you that's wrong. If you don't adapt and/or the crux is wet it feels harder not easier. I wasn't using grade comparison charts ... after grade checking for guidebooks for well over a decade UK Grade assignment happens on autopilot.
1
 timjones 19 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

> Two widely experienced UK climbers on grit and granite and one experienced grit climber all of whom had done a fair bit of guidebook work for the BMC all nicely warmed up in the trip and all leading around HVS on this style and we all thought standard HVS as did all the other brits we talked to. I think you're just not taking into account it might be you that's wrong. If you don't adapt and/or the crux is wet it feels harder not easier. I wasn't using grade comparison charts ... after grade checking for guidebooks for well over a decade UK Grade assignment happens on autopilot.

My point was that it could just as easily feel harder to a different person and that the level of polish was a reason to treat it with caution.

If the style suits you then you are likely to climb harder on a some rocktypes or in a some areas.

In Yosemite or on the granite down the Sierra Eastside I consistently feel a great deal more comortable at higher grades than I would on just about any crag I have ever visited in the UK.

Does that mean that I am wrong or that we need to think carefully about paying to much heed to other peopels gradings?
 Offwidth 20 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:
If a style suits you should grade a tad generously. The grade for you is not much use beyond you. The likley public grade is much more useful. I'm very sure Regular Route is HVS for most british HVS leaders even if it feels like its a polished VS to you.
Post edited at 13:37
 timjones 20 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

> If a style suits you shpuld grade a tad generously. The grade for you is not much use beyond you. The likley public grade is muchmore useful. I'm very sure Regular Route is HVS for most british HVS leaders even if it feels like its a polished VS to you.

Fortunately I don;t get to do any grading as my climbing time is too limited

I am merely passing comment on suitable routes and how I found them, which is abotu as much as any of us can do given that we don't know how the OP will adapt to the climbing in Yosemite.
 Offwidth 20 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:
If you don't trust your own grading, why argue with my grade opinion? To be perfectly clear I think its comfortably into HVS for Brits who adapt well and meet the route in good nick. I already said my friends felt the same, as did the other brits we met who did it and the huge consensus safe 5.9 when translated also says HVS. A wet or iced first pitch is pretty common problem and it might feel harder then (not E1 but maybe tough for the HVS grade).
Post edited at 13:45
 timjones 20 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:


The OP asked for opinions, why the hell do you have such an issue with someone else having a different opinion to your own?
 Offwidth 20 Aug 2017
In reply to timjones:

Because I love the place and think more brits should try it as its very worth visiting as long as you can capably lead HS multipitch and I don't like well intentioned but less than ideal advice for relative beginners from people who are maybe too much better to realise the faults in their arguments. I also dislike sandbagging, so your views that RR is VS when wet and the walk off is trivial are an issue I'm happy to challenge on an internet forum. Your input to UKC often involves arguments on things you care about, so maybe watch that greenhouse glass.

RR was always completely unsuitable for the OP but is a good choice for a visiting pair of fast extreme climbers starting late to avoid queues.
 timjones 20 Aug 2017
In reply to Offwidth:
I think you'll find that my comment on RR was very much that it wasn't suitable for the OP in a one day visit. I just had slightly different reasons for that thinking.

Post edited at 16:57
TomBerliner 22 Aug 2017
In reply to TomBerliner:

Wow - what a debate!

It does seem that Yosemite cant be missed - even if its problematic to just try and climb for one day there. Ive got good tips on where to go now from the messages here. I'll have a guide (my girlfriend who im travelling with sort-of hates climbing) so hopefully he can guage the limited time I have and where I should be targeting.

Now to find a guide....

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