/ Best non-tidal low-mid grade Pemborke venue?

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Deadeye - on 10 Sep 2017
We've buggered up our planning and have a Pembroke meet (St Davids) firmly booked for a weekend when high tide will be 1pm.

Where should we go? Grades VD-E1 I suppose.

Thanks
The Ivanator - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

Sounds perfect for Barrel Zawn.
Deadeye - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to The Ivanator:

Thanks - although that looks like DWS?

Any trad venues?
John R - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

Plenty good to go at at those grades around St Davids Head and the north coast crags (Coetan, Hebog, Trwyn Llwyd etc.). Caerfai accessible by easy abseil. With a bit of research there's plenty to go at on the south coast generally, even at high tide. It really needn't be a problem. Have fun! John.
Coel Hellier - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

Saddle Head is non-tidal with lots of lower-grade routes. It's on the South Pembroke section, though, so not ideal for St David's. The St David's area doesn't really do non-tidal, easy-grade crags, though on some of them you can get onto routes by appropriate abseiling.
Deadeye - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Coel Hellier:

Thanks - that was my conclusion. We'll head south.
spenser - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

You can access the ledge partway up Ethos (HVS 5a) and the routes around Beyond the Azimuth (E1 5b) at high tides without missing out anything noteworthy on the routes. You can do the 2 Diff/ VD routes at Caerfai with high starts, Caerfai Crack and Orogeny would also go without missing anything too crucial. St David's Head West has some none tidal options I think, just beware that it seems fairly vulnerable to swell on the south side of the head.
I haven't visited Ynys Lochtyn but if the crags on the island are none tidal it could be a good option, walk out in the morning, climb while cut off, walk back at low tide.
NigelHurst - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to Coel Hellier:

a second for saddle head, easy abseil in and well above high tide, good variety of routes
alan moore - on 10 Sep 2017
In reply to NigelHurst:

> a second for saddle head, easy abseil in

Even easier to walk in...?

mountain.martin - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to alan moore:

> Even easier to walk in...?

Not really, the walk/scramble from the top of the crag takes a while (5 - 10 mins?) And is a bit tedious if you are wanting to do 3 or 4 routes. Once you have set up an ab rope it is a lot quicker.
Martin Hore - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

Stennis Head is easily combined with Saddle Head, or take a day at each. Not much below VS at Stennis but if you can manage E1 Manzoku and Cool for Cats are brilliant. Hercules and Bludgeon at HVS are pretty fine too. You might find the E1s cut off for an hour or so at high tide (depends on sea state and whether springs or neaps) but Hercules is always accessible. No abseils for these three either. Bludgeon is also non-tidal by the traverse approach or abseil and you might be on your own there (whereas you probably won't be on the main face).

Then when the tide has dropped (or early in the morning) you can abseil into Myola.

Martin
spidermonkey09 - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to Martin Hore:

I'd be slightly alarmed if the E1's at Stennis got cut off by high tide- thats a long way up! Surely would require a big swell and a spring tide, and even then...?
Simon Caldwell - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to Martin Hore:

> Not much below VS at Stennis

Stennis Arete, Stennis Chimney, Myolo, all 3-star routes IMO, and filled up a leisurely day for us. If you need more then Maelstrom Chimney, Oversight, and North Corner all looked good.

To the OP:

All in the south, but after a recent week in the area with high tide ranging from mid morning to early afternoon:

Rusty Point has lots of quality low grade climbing, a lot of it semi-tidal but Fisherman's Point next door is more accessible. And you can start many of the routes from a hanging belay part way up if necessary.

And Giltar Slabs is superb.

Ramblin dave - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to John R:

> Plenty good to go at at those grades around St Davids Head and the north coast crags (Coetan, Hebog, Trwyn Llwyd etc.).

Yeah, this - I thought there was plenty of non-tidal stuff on the gabbro? It's also a lot less driving then heading down to Stennis / Saddle Head, and a lot quieter!
John R - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to Ramblin dave:

Yes, that was exactly what I was saying, especially as the OP suggested the St Davids booking was already firmly made. Both areas have plenty to offer, but if I was only there for the weekend I wouldn't want to stay in one area and climb in the other. And, as you suggest, the north coast crags are often brilliantly quiet, plus the bird bans are not in place for the rest of the year. But we all have our preferred venues, often based on early impressions, and I would accept it has taken me many years of visits to recognise my own preferences. Each to his or her own. John.
Dave Williams - on 11 Sep 2017
In reply to spenser:

> I haven't visited Ynys Lochtyn but if the crags on the island are none tidal it could be a good option, walk out in the morning, climb while cut off, walk back at low tide.

Hidden Wall on Ynys Lochtyn is non-tidal and has >30 climbs from D-E4 on immaculate hard sandstone (same as that on Carreg y Barcud, but generally blockier.) The extreme RHS of the wall - right of Dolphin - has numerous bouldering possibilities as well. All other cliffs on the island, or elsewhere in the area, are unfortunately tidal, but this doesn't matter as there's plenty to go at on Hidden Wall.

Access to Ynys Lochtyn is possible up to 2.5h either side of HT (neaps) by descending a steep path (or abseiling from an in situ BMC stake) and then crossing a short boulder beach to the island. As spenser rightly says, you can cross before HW, climb through the HW period and then leave on the receding tide once the beach is accessible once again. Being temporarily cut off on the island is guaranteed to provide considerable bemusement to walkers on the nearby headland! About a 45 mile, 70 min drive from St Davids, and definitely more adventurous/ memorable than the default 'drive to South Pembs/ Saddle Head' alternative. Probably well worth the extra effort for 1 weekend day.

I've climbed a lot in the St Davids area with HW in the early afternoon and have always, as others have already suggested, headed north onto the gabbro cliffs. Craig Coetan's already been mentioned. It's a good little crag but can suffer from seepage after prolonged wet weather. Nearby Mur Cenhinen is also non-tidal as are some other crags just to the north. Again better than the S. Pembs alternative IMHO, chiming with what others have already suggested.

HTH

Dave



Deadeye - on 12 Sep 2017
In reply to Dave Williams:

Thanks all.
The problem with "accessible other than 2.5 hours either side of HW" is that it puts a five hour hole slap in the middle of the day...
Dave Williams - on 12 Sep 2017
In reply to Deadeye:

I don't understand what you mean by a '5 hour hole'. I thought I'd made it clear that you'd be on the island, doing some climbing, during this 5h HW period.

So, it'd mean crossing over onto the island before 10.30am if it was HT at, say, 1pm. Then you'd be 'marooned' on the island for 5 hours or so, which is a big part of the "Locked in on Lochtyn" attraction. Ynys Lochtyn, as a tidal island climbing venue, is probably totally unique in England and Wales. There's enough HW accessible climbing to easily sustain a 5 hour session before one can cross back to the mainland.

I've done it a number of times if that's of any reassurance.

Deadeye - on 12 Sep 2017
In reply to Dave Williams:

HI

Sorry - I had misread. That's a good suggestion - thanks.

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