UKC

https://www.redbull.com/gb-en/best-climbing-walls-in-britain?linkId=4217502...

"Sheffield's Climbing Works is a bouldering mecca. You may spot a few pro climbers hanging out here in winter, waiting to tackle the nearby Peak District in the summer months."

Oh dear. Can anyone think of other examples of writers pontificating about a sport when they don't even know what time of year the season is?

In reply to deepsoup:

"Bristol and Glasgow's Climbing Academy centres focus on bouldering, or free-climbing, rather than climbing with ropes. Free climbing means you stay close to the ground, working above crash mats and concentrate on honing your technique."

In reply to deepsoup:

The article should have been called "The UK top ten walls painted most realistically as if they have been vomited all over". Probably courtesy of Red Bull drinkers....... Glad I don't have to frequent any of them!

In reply to deepsoup:

The caption is wrong for the Arch as well, the picture shows Building One not the Biscuit.

In reply to deepsoup:

The Red Bull list is obviously sh*t but what are the actual 10 best climbing walls in Britain.

The first two are easy:
1. EICA Ratho
2. Manchester Depot

and I guess Kendal, Climbing Works, Awesome Walls Sheffield, Castle and TCA are going to be in the top ten but in what order and what else.....

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

and The Beacon!!!!

In reply to deepsoup:
Well done on flagging up this (really weird...!) article.

The more the climbing community can take the piss out Red Bull, Coke etc, the better. It's been brilliant recently to see Hazel Findlay writing about this in Summit, Dave MacLeod tweeting, and Nick Bullock calling a spade a spade in his blog: "It’s dishonest and lacks integrity to support something you don’t use or believe in yourself. There are other ways to pursue goals."

It feels like now might be a great time for climbers, climbing walls and outdoor groups to take a leaf out of the Drink Water snowboarders-against-energy-drinks idea and adopt a bit of a coordinated approach to expose these companies' claims that sugary drinks "vitalize body and mind etc" for what they are; cycnical marketing ploys to sell products that make people fatter, less happy and more at risk of heart disease.

In reply to Robert Durran:


perhaps best not to look at the "8 UK ice climbing spots you have to try" list!

In reply to Jim Hamilton:

Does stanage make the top 3?

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

I doubt many Londoners would put The Castle in the top 3 in London let alone top 10 in the country.... or did you mean a different Castle?

edit: just seen article, you clearly didn't mean a different Castle. oh dear...

In reply to DannyC:
Looks like SKY can be added to the list of mainstream companies adding climbing sponsorship to their portfolio
We'll done Molly Thomson Smith.

http://www.skysports.com/more-sports/news/29876/11042828/sky-sports-scholar...

SKY climbing kit coming soon?

In reply to deepsoup:

I can see why people hate on them so easily, but surely people can see the benefit of such large sponsorship by certain companies?

Yes they ride the wave of 'being sponsors to the cool alternative 'extreme' sports', but they also sponsor people to push the limits of their sport/discipline!

I don't think with most sports, there would be the progression there has been so rapidly, if it hadn't been for (in part) the inclusion of such brands.

In reply to martinturner:

I think you've missed the point......

The point is at what cost? Is the the perceived benefit worth that cost? Why is rapid progression a good thing?

In reply to becauseitsthere:

I really hope sky don't do to climbing what they've done to cycling.

In reply to Greasy Prusiks:


They've already doubled the drive time to Malham and Kilnsey, getting stuck behind multiple amateur peletons.

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:


I imagine it's hard to put in order since each climbing wall tends to be different and have a different kind of appeal.

I would definitely add the The Foundry to the list though. Still a fantastic all round venue particularly for more serious climbers trying to get strong and/or fit. Recent changes have made it even better.

In reply to deepsoup:

I don't know a single dedicated climber in Bristol that calls UCR "The Church"

In reply to deepsoup:

Haha 3/4 of Bristol walls in the UK top 10. What a load of tosh

In reply to deepsoup:

They got one thing right. The TCA cakes are decent.

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

I had to look up Ratho (obviously it's in Scotland )
I can see why you've got it at no 1, looks awesome. How cold in the winter?
Certainly the ClimbingWorks and the Foundry .
The old Beacon had a certain old skool charm and the new one is brilliant, plus a shout for the Boardroom.

In reply to galpinos:

Do you reap the benefits of more indoor walls? More progressive protection?
More money being plowed into the sport you love because of the average joe giving it ago, and putting more of his money into your sports pockets.

Yes they may get the terms wrong etc etc, but if someone wants to learn and get involved, then they will learn to ignore this over time.

If you want to keep a small community of people doing something you love doing, then that's your prerogative and good luck with it.

I want people to give the things I love a try, and hopefully they'll love it too! If this means putting up with abit of commercialism, then so be it.

In reply to StuMsg:

Ha ha. Yep, whoever wrote this is clearly well qualified to recommend the best walls in the country.

In reply to martinturner:

Shame they couldn't also 'sponsor' someone who actually knows the first thing about it to write about our sport/discipline.

In reply to Jim Hamilton:


LOL - I hoped you were joking. Facepalm.

In reply to kwoods:

In reply to Jim Hamilton:
> perhaps best not to look at the "8 UK ice climbing spots you have to try" list!

Well I learned something - who knew 5 out of 8 "must do's" would be indoors? Next time I'm in the Lakes, I'd like to try Great End in Kendal but it looks a bit expensive at £120/day so maybe I'll just stick with the #1 choice of Covent Garden.

In reply to deepsoup:

I'll just leave this here... http://www.natgeotraveller.co.uk/smart-travel/travel-talk/do-it-now-climbin...

In reply to Natalie Berry - UKC:

Thanks Nat. That's really helpful

In reply to NathanP:

perhaps you'll have a tricky time if it's full of commercial climbers

In reply to Jim Hamilton:

They seem to think great end is in Kendal on that list!

In reply to martinturner:


I'd concede the increase in participation and the better walls comment (my new local is the Depot and it's fantastic, it also seems to get a decent trade from new customers, gym exiles, people who just indoor boulder) but I'd say it has had little affect on "more progressive protection"


But what's the benefit of more money going into climbing?


I don't care if people get the terms wrong if there are doing/participating trying the sport, but this is about a multinational corporation appropriating a hobby I care about (and which probably affects my sense of self more than it should....) to sell more of their product without caring what effect they have on the pastime in the process.


I am happy (and keen) to share my passion about climbing with people. I'm not advocating some kind of closed club. However, I don't see how increasing participation by changing many aspects of climbing that I like is a good thing.


But part of what I enjoy about climbing is that it isn't, well wasn't, commercial. It was full of colourful, interesting, geeky, difficult oddball misfit characters, often those who found "traditional sport" was not for them, It isn't cool. It's not snowboarding or skating. If "putting up with a bit of commercialism" irrevocably changes the pastime I love, I don't think it's worth it.

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:


I'd describe it as pleasantly cool

Actually, it used to be totally freezing but since they fixed the roof and put in the new really bright lights its been quite bearable. Or maybe we just had a milder winter last year.


So, taking into account the various comments, how about:
1. EICA Ratho
2. Manchester Depot
3. Climbing Works
4. Kendal
5. Awesome Walls Sheffield
6. Beacon
7. TCA Bristol
8. Boardroom
9. Someplace in London which isn't the Castle
10. Foundry

In reply to martinturner:



Putting up with a "bit of Commercialism" is one thing. Selling out to an ignorant, cynical and exploitative monster such as Red Bull is quite another thing. I'm all for people climbing but I think all the Red Bullshit probably attracts people into climbing for thoroughly undesirable reasons and with unwelcome attitudes.

In reply to martinturner:

If you look at the top of the sport, thankfully only a very small percentage of climbers are sponsored by fizzy drink companies. Ondra, Findlay, Zangerl and Sharma all seem to be climbing pretty well without such contracts..!

I'm sure big Red Bull & Coke deals have the potential to help 'progress' the climbing of the individual sponsored climber - but so would backing from brands whose products actually help people succeed in climbing, rather than make them fat.

Sadly, sponsorship by sugary drink firms has a far bigger potential to increase the likelihood of the wider climbing community and general public getting unhappy and unhealthy by buying their unnecessary products. Otherwise these companies wouldn't be spending money in this way.

Sponsorship will always be complex, with ethical pros and cons to every brand. But drinking fizzy drinks is so evidently at odds with pulling yourself up plastic, rock and ice, that this issue seems like a good place for the climbing community to take a bit of a stand.

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

That's a pretty good list, although can't comment on Bristol, and have been in a few in London.
I guess it's down to personal pref for order.
For me the Foundry would be near the top because of the quality of route setting and would get it for The Wave bouldering wall alone.
Not sure about Awesome Walls though. Nice bunch of people running it, but the route setting is a bit hit and miss. Good for winter training 4x4s on long steep routes, but wouldn't take a special trip over there.

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:


Any list which tries to compare bouldering walls with lead walls is nonsensical. You need one for each. Obviously Ratho will be top of a lead wall list, but probably not in any top ten for bouldering.

In reply to DannyC:

I think I'm correct in saying Sharma now dons a RedBull cap?

In reply to Robert Durran:


Yeah, I'd agree with that, but top ten bouldering and top ten lead is getting a bit too many so let's try top 5 in each category. Still fairly questionable after the first couple of spots in each category since I've only been to about half these places.

Lead:
1. EICA Ratho
2. Kendal
3. Awesome Walls Sheffield
4. Beacon
5. Foundry

Bouldering:
1. Manchester Depot
2. Climbing Works
3. TCA Bristol
4. Boardroom
5. Someplace in London

In reply to Durbs:

Sadly, after a quick Google, I see you are correct. That is disappointing.

D.

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:




No worries Paul, we're just Googling to see where Sheffield is atm

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:

I agree, for such a big space there's too much vert, and the massive roof is fun for sure, but a bit of a novelty. I think it could be a lot better, as a training venue anyway. And the setting on the vert can involve constant high rock overs, which isn't much fun, or good training, except for rock overs!!!

For winter training, I don't think there's anything there to rival the main wall at Leeds Wall. The setting's really good, maybe a bit too comp style at times, but they are set for comps I believe. And the grades feel like massive sandbags to me, and most other adults I speak to. The kids seem to do okay though.

In reply to galpinos:
looks like I am going to have to change hobby again, and find another under the radar pastime to do, any recommendations? How about bossaball? looks fun..

In reply to deepsoup:

Contrary to your subject line, I think Red Bull totally 'get it.' It's about money, and they do very well. Facts (or the lack of them) don't come into it.

Publicised climbing competitions; climbing in the Olympics - that's all part of the same thing, isn't it? Coke are a major Olympic sponsor I think (or certainly were at Atlanta, for example.)

In reply to Rob Parsons:


I think everybody knows that.

The point is, there's more and more commercial interest in climbing, and unlike us lot and the BMC, they don't care about climbing. That's what the OP mean by 'get it', they aren't bothered to understand climbing because they're not interested in climbing. Just making money, like you say. Coke, Red Bull, the IoC etc...

That's what people are discussing. And what it means for the future.

In reply to 1poundSOCKS:



The BMC were heavily involved with the push to get climbing into the Olympics. How do you square that circle, with the implications you raise in your reply?

In reply to deepsoup:

It says the piece is written by Sian Lewis.

I wonder if that is the same Sian Lewis from Bristol who blogs at http://thegirloutdoors.co.uk/ ?

In which case it seems you can make a little go a very long way.

In reply to Rob Parsons:


I was giving a broad picture of things and there's obviously more nuance than I've given. And the BMC might well disagree with my views on the IoC. Not that I have very well researched opinion on the IoC anyway. I wouldn't pretend to understand everything in a pretty complex situation. It's part of the general discussion; commercial interest and the climbing community. How do they co-exist?

I was mainly explaining that I think you misunderstood the 'get it', i.e. I don't think it's saying that the OP thinks Red Bull aren't good a making money, I think that's pretty obvious that they are!!!

In reply to DannyC:



A re-post for those that have not read the whole thread.

Dear over-caffeinated sugary drink company, please get out of our game.

In reply to flaneur:


The over-caffeinated sugary drink companies will only get out of climbing if it's in their economic interests to do so.

Red Bull claim both David Lama (who can obviously climb a bit ...) and Shauna Coxsey (who's regularly mentioned here) as sponsored climbers/athletes. Coke sponsors the Olympics - which climbing (and, as a specific point, the BMC) is now officially associated with.

So: what is 'the game' (or, I guess, your game) that you want these companies out of?

(Btw in order to open the discussion, it might be good if someone were to make the text of Hazel Findlay's article freely available.)

In reply to Rob Parsons:


Of course. But if the over-caffeinated sugary drink companies sense there is push-back and bad publicity is damaging the brand then they will stop supporting climbing.

Hazel Findlay putting it better than I: https://www.thebmc.co.uk/sweet-dreams-why-do-big-brands-crave-climbers

In reply to Rob Parsons:

Additionally, there was an article on Evening Sends, about climbing and the Olympics, and how they need to attract a new younger audience to please the sponsors (Coke and McDonalds I think). And climbing is part of that strategy (according to the article).

And the related problem of childhood obesity in the US, and sugary drinks, and diabetes. I saw a documentary on Netflix about it, can't recall the name, sorry.

In reply to flaneur:

Thanks for the link.


What is the suggested program to achieve that end? (Here-today-gone-tomorrow threads on this Forum don't count!) What onus is put on anybody - other than those directly receiving sponsorship from the likes of Red Bull - to achieve that end? And who is going to draw up the list of Officially Acceptable Sponsors?

The actual fly in the ointment here is commercialization per se, isn't it?

In reply to 1poundSOCKS:

Ah, you noticed the emphasis on high rock overs at AW Sheffield too. It is possible to set grade 7s (or 5s and 6s) on vertical without this. It seems to be a common gripe with lots of people I talk to.

In reply to deepsoup:

Just to throw a spanner in the 'works' but they could be waiting to tackle the Limestone in the Summer months haha

In reply to Fishmate:

What's wrong with The Castle?

In reply to deepsoup: To be fair, the article didn't refer to the area as the Peaks, so they do have more idea than some on here.

In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

So what's your list for the best 5 speed climbing walls

In reply to Natalie Berry - UKC:

Oh Natalie, this in the Nat Geo on climbing is something to treasure; e.g.
"BEST FOR HISTORIC CLIMBS"
"Most people know that El Capitan isn’t just a Mac operating system but a 3,000ft-high monolith in Yosemite National Park. Learn to climb in its shadow with a school offering lessons for all levels ($143/£111) and guided climbs (from $163/£127). Closer to home, Ben Nevis has plenty of climbs for those making their first forays into outdoor climbing."

The writer is Samantha Lewis -http://www.samanthalewis.co.uk - and she knows little about climbing as is well demonstrated by this listicle of a piece.

In reply to galpinos:

This sums it up very well for me;"I don't care if people get the terms wrong if there are doing/participating trying the sport, but this is about a multinational corporation appropriating a hobby I care about (and which probably affects my sense of self more than it should....) to sell more of their product without caring what effect they have on the pastime in the process. "

Well said. Parasites.

In reply to mark catcher:

Ha ha, well there is that.
Only because they didn't abbreviate "Peak District" though - prejudice perhaps but somehow I just know the writer is a "Peaks" person really.

In reply to deepsoup:

Wow, climbing really is progressing, what a total load of wank.

In reply to deepsoup:

I've never been to a climbing wall.

Oh, sorry, wrong thread.

In reply to galpinos:



Spot on. Have a like (rare coin indeed from me)

Looking at those blogs it appears "journalism and travel writing" actually means, "googling while drinking tea and stroking the cat".

anyhow, they omitted the Henry Price.

#extremetraversing

In reply to deepsoup:

I'll just leave this little nugget here: vimeo.com/238377159

Awesome walls stockport is pretty good

In reply to Natalie Berry - UKC:


More opportunities for the Mountain Rescue teams to practice on

In reply to deepsoup:

Redbull - a future BMC recommended partner