UKC

Ken Wilson's classic climbing book, Hard Rock, came out in 1974 and it now approaches the publication of its fourth edition. In this new edition, editor Ian Parnell has ensured Hard Rock continues to honour Ken's original concept, in particular keeping the route, not the climber, centre stage.

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In reply to UKC News:

He missed out the nightmare sloping mantle at the top.

In reply to simes303:

So did I!

In reply to simes303:

Must admit I did too the first time. It's such an obvious line that I did not look at the guide. I just followed the flake bottom to top. Seemed the logical way. I got a bit of barracking for it but the mantel (which I have done since) seemed a pointless eliminate

In reply to Wiley Coyote2:

I agree that it can easily be dismissed as pointless, but in reality it provides much entertainment - for both leader and onlookers!

In reply to UKC News:

Wot - no mantle? Heresy! Go back and do it again.

At least he used the same three runners I always used - a cam instead of a hex but I guess that's progress.

Have always loved Jim's essay - beautifully read (by Helen Mort?)

Mick

In reply to UKC News:

Great video, hopefully one day I'll climb it! 

In reply to Etta:

Yeah the mantle is eliminate nonsense, historic or not. You can save it for Monday Blue.

In reply to The Pylon King:

Is it? It’s a long time since I did it but I thought the mantel was straight up and the easy way a scuttle off to the side.

jcm

In reply to UKC News:

If I watch this will it ruin my onsight? I am torn

In reply to Suncream:

It will ruin the onsight. Don’t do it. 

In reply to The Pylon King:

Agreed, I find it unlikely that the first ascent did the mantel rather than finishing left. 

In reply to deacondeacon:

I have all Ernie Phillip's pictures (about 9) of Joe making the first ascent, showing that he finished directly with the mantel - and with not a stitch of protection. When Joe did if for me years later for my Peak book, he again did the final mantelshelf directly. He was very, very good at mantelshelves.

I was very surprised by that left-hand finish, I must say. There's a slightly right-hand finish that's much less of a cheat, because it follows the flow/right-hand trend of the route, that simply uses a small r-hand foothold on the right-hand arete that makes the final mantel slightly easier and less pure. Seemed the natural way to do it, the only time I ever did it.

In reply to deacondeacon:

I've just dug out the image of Joe on the first ascent of R Unconquerable that I was talking about - the previously unpublished one that I used in my Peak book. I'm rather chuffed, on viewing it again, to see that Joe on the first ascent used exactly the right foothold I referred to above

http://www.gordonstainforthbelper.co.uk/images/JoeBrown1stAscRUnconquerable...

In reply to UKC News:

Also did a film of it 3 years ago.

youtube.com/watch?v=ZNy6jwpSyqA&

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Happy to be corrected good stuff. 

In reply to ipfreely:

In your film, the guy places his second last runner (a cam) in sideways, seemingly not even looking at the placement at all. That is exactly what I'd ask people not to do on this route. It's trashed enough already. People can watch videos such as this, with people sprawling over the top and think, "Well I can just cam it to f*ck, it's OK."  But if we keep on consuming the route, it will become less and less worth consuming.

I feel it would be better if all aspirants for Right Unconquerable led Left Unconquerable first. That will tell them, in no uncertain terms, whether they're ready. Left Unconquerable isn't as trashed - and is arguably harder to trash.

The flake on Right Unconquerable has a fragile beauty. That's why we love it. Please, let's preserve it.

Mick

In reply to UKC News:

Great stuff. Never plucked up the courage myself, or was willing to wreck my arms and finish my Stanage-day. Sure I've missed out there.

For me, there are no better words in the world.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Yeah, but Joe was obviously just showboating (and obviously demonstrating his mantel shelving prowess). Definitely not the line of least resistance. A variation finish.

In reply to Mick Ward:

Valid point re the cam, having climbed it a few times that day for the filming, the placing was probably a little lazy, but no harm was done.
 

In reply to ipfreely:

Can understand it with doing the route repeatedly for filming. The problem is that, however unwittingly, it sets a bad example. One poorly placed cam not fallen on, no physical harm done. Hundreds of poorly placed cams, many weighted: big chance of physical harm - which has already happened with this route.

There's a film of somone attempting Tippler Direct, firing in cams and just dropping onto them, willy nilly, as though it's a sport route, the cams are bolts and all's OK. How long before this route gets trashed? And these are just two examples.

Mick  

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

I was about to post that a good tip is to get your feet up high, and that is exactly what Joe is doing in the photo you posted Gordon.

In reply to Mick Ward:

Go examine some of the breaks on classics at Birchen if you want to see the future of grit due to poor ethics of dogging on cams on routes too hard for the climber. Birchen is softer rock but the breaks on Stanage classics are starting to go and once the softer matrix is exposed the erosion will be much faster. If people want to push grades they should stay away from classics with a reputation for spitting climbers off. It's not OK to treat such classic grit climbs as sports routes ii we want to preserve some character of these routes for the future.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

I used that foothold onsight... it makes all the difference. I never understood the fuss about the infamous mantel until I went back and tried it again without that foothold.  I also got a hands off semi-rest on the arete just below the mantel which I needed as I found the the bit around the famous broken bit of the flake quite pumpy (as I'd had to splay high and right on smears). Jon climbs that lower crux beautifully in the video, including demonstrating the way to cam protect it to cut the risk of further damage: keep the cam away from the outside edge and extend it.

In reply to UKC News:

I think I may have told this story before but for those who missed it: 

I learned to climb on Stanage back in the 60's and I did R.Unconquerable many times. On a return visit, accompanied by my son many years later after moving to the South of England, I decided to solo it for old times sake at the end of a long day of excellent climbing. I got to the mantleshelf and could not do it.  I tried moving to the left with similar results.  Eventually I called for my son to run round and set up a top rope for me and drop down a big loop as I did not have a harness on.  The crag was busy and a crowd had gathered to watch me.  My son made a big song and dance about my getting stuck (on purpose I might add) which drew an even bigger crowd.  Needless to say with the top rope in place I was up in seconds to rounds of applause. He never lets me forget it.

Al

In reply to Mick Ward:

Education, education, education. Not enough of it, unfortunately, regarding cams on grit.

In reply to Offwidth:

So you wandered off route for a cheat rest?

In reply to UKC News:

Slightly disappointed there aren’t more posts about not enough gear, too much gear, wrong gear, unsafe gear, or gear behind the flake.

I used to know where I was with this forum...

In reply to The Pylon King:

Maybe by half a metre, if that...I'm content that some live their pure lives but I accept my compromises. I took a lie-down rest on Stanage Flying Buttress and a weird body wedge on Surform...maybe this awaits..... Purgatory (VS 4c)

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Not surprised he was very very good at mantleshelves... he was seemingly very very good at every move!

In reply to UKC News:

A lovely and evocative piece of writing, sensitively read. Takes me back to the days of early discovery and infatuation...still feel it now on occasion. Reminded me of part of a Van Morrison lyric from his beautiful song. On Hyndford Street.  “feeling wondrous and all lit up inside”