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Advice required on poles please

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 John Workman 24 Dec 2021

I'm looking for a pair of 'poles' to suit my requirements - as follows

Main use - mountain walking / approach to climbs in Scotland - summer and winter.

Other main use - ski mountaineering in Scotland.

So I'd like them to be fully collapsible [as in Z poles], strong, lightweight and suitable for use in freezing conditions.

I've just managed to break a pair of carbon fibre /and aluminium Z poles on an approach walk. I stumbled and one of them bent at the lowest joint.

I'm thinking Black Diamond but which ones.

Any advice appreciated

 jethro kiernan 24 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I’ve got the alpine z poles 

I do like them, managed to break one but BD changed the section I broke no questions 

 HeMa 24 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

Alu will be more durable than CF.

we have two pairs, both work just fine. One is a tad more fancy, BD something. The other is something That seems more robust, Gibron Mont Blanc (or earlier model, more like 311 Micro today). Cheap, durable and works like a champ.

 PaulW 24 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

Having broken lots I now prefer poles with a lever lock on the adjustment rather than the rotating compression fit.

 Siward 24 Dec 2021
In reply to PaulW:

Black Diamond expedition poles may fit the bill. Strong, low profile flicklock and reliable.

https://www.braemarmountainsports.com/ski-equipment/ski-poles/black-diamond...

Seem to have gone up in price though. I got a pair of the older ones for £60 in a sale. 

 TobyA 24 Dec 2021
 StuDoig 24 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I'd avoid carbon fiber - just too prone to breakage esp imo.   alpkit or similar Budget z poles are dirt cheap but build quality is a lot lower IMO than BD poles - lots more slack in the sections and the alloy seems a lot more prone to oxidising / seizing and you can't split into sections like lever lock types obviously.  I've always got on with BD poles so they would be my go to!

Cheers,

Stu

 neuromancer 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I'd go with multiple sets.

Black crows oxus or batons d'alain for skiing. 

BD Alpine Carbon (not the flZ) for the rest, or distances if you run. 

The mistake is buying adjustable poles - that's where they always break. Nobody needs adjustable poles, just get the right size and have an extended grip.

 HeMa 25 Dec 2021
In reply to neuromancer:

 > Nobody needs adjustable poles, just get the right size and have an extended grip.

And yer wrong. Try sticking a full lenght pole in your rucksack and then proceed to Climb a winter route. Z-folds are the answer.

But for skiing or ski-touring, your right. Get a good pole, and add some gaffer tape neatly as a lower grip, nearly ’cause you can then use it to FIX stuff.

If you are heart set on adjustable poles (multiuse), then Flicklock/Leverlock is the only viable option. AIM for thick aluminium and two-piece maxs… and be prepared to get a spare pair to replace the bent lower section. IMHO BD Traverse or what ever the cheapest was from BD is about the best option (Gipron might be cheaper, but not often around… invertor of Flicklock btw. ).

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 mcawle 25 Dec 2021
In reply to HeMa:

I think he meant adjustable as in being able to tweak the overall length +/- 10-20cm whereas I think you’re talking about whether they are collapsible?

Anyway Merry Christmas to all

 DaveHK 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

If you need one set for skiing and collapsing to go in a rucksack then BD Expedition have worked for me for years for that kind of use. However, 2 sets would be better, something solid for skiing and a light set for climbing. 

 beardy mike 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

Skiing poles are a totally different beast to trekking poles IMO. I now, after having used a two piece carbon Leki pair for years and having had them stolen from outside a hut, have bought a one piece pole for touring. Poles get fallen on, jammed between rocks, abused, and need to be strong as you can manage. Just plain alu poles are the job, with an extended grip. 

For trekking, z-poles in aluminium hare good. The Alpkit z poles at 30quid a pair are in my experience total junk and self collapse. I took them back and got a pair of carbon collapsible ones instead, these are better, but the quality is pretty poor, with the flick lock closure becoming unglued pretty much on day 1. Not sure what else to recommend, but your requirements are unrealistic in as much as the activities are disparate in their nature, and its better to get two pairs, even if they are at the budget end of the scale...

 DaveHK 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

For walking and climbing I like my Mountain King Skyrunners https://mountainking.co.uk/store/product/skyrunner-pair 

Super light and pack down tiny. They can be repaired if they break unlike some other carbon poles. No way I'd ski with them though.

 olddirtydoggy 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

Glad this thread went up as I'm looking at my first pair due to knee damage.

My use isn't skiing but more scrambling and long mountain days. After reading all the comments I'm looking at the BD Distance FLZ. Z folds for compactabilty, aluminium durability and slight height adjustments for descents.

I'm guessing these are rated 3 season due to the fact they are Z folds rather than the sliding type so they could be a bit fiddly in deep snow. So many options on poles, dizzying.

 GEd_83 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I've had the Leki micro vario carbon poles (z style) since 2017, I had to reluctantly buy them for top dollar in Switerzland after forgetting to pack my black diamond poles, but they've been superb, summer, winter, alpine and for backpacking/wild camping. Light and compact enough that there's no excuse to not take them into the mountains, so I've ended up using them a lot more than my BD ones.

 Pina 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

To add to this, I've used the black diamond trekking poles for the last 10 years and they've held out pretty well.

They've excelled in Scotland for ski mountaineering and approaches. Only word of caution is to not store them packed down as dirt and oxide can leave them stuck and requires a bit of elbow grease to loosen them.

If you're looking at multi day alpine tours, you'll want a fixed length pole. I've seen a lot of the collapsible ones break and you're left in an awkward position. In Scotland where you're only out for a single day tour, the consequences are not as bad.

 Trangia 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I much prefer alloy compression rotating telescopic poles to either Z Poles or locking poles, but it's important to clean and dry them before storing them away. This is for walking poles.

Never used collapsible poles for skiing, but they need to be strong, so rigid poles for maximum strength, and have always used one piece for normal piste, off piste skiing where the necessity for being able to shorten them when not in use hasn't applied

1
 hoolabloom 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

Love my Black crows trios. Light and great design use them for walking and split boarding 

 Sean_J 25 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

I've skied a good few times with my BD carbon poles (3 section flicklock style, maybe 8+ years old, can't remember the specific model, alpine carbon I think with cork handles) and they've been brilliant, still like new- maybe i'm not heavy-handed on my poles when I ski though, I dunno. Or maybe newer models are shit build quality!

 HeMa 25 Dec 2021
In reply to Sean_J:

Some as just rough on gear, others less so.

I have a few mates that keep ripping bindings from their skis, I recall I’ve only ripped one dynafiddle toe piece…

 TobyA 25 Dec 2021
In reply to neuromancer:

> The mistake is buying adjustable poles - that's where they always break. Nobody needs adjustable poles, just get the right size and have an extended grip.

I've broken poles on the pole section, not the adjuster, so I thinks that's way too categorical.

 TobyA 25 Dec 2021
In reply to HeMa:

> If you are heart set on adjustable poles (multiuse), then Flicklock/Leverlock is the only viable option.

I've had flicklocks freeze shut in damp UK conditions. A total faff to get them open. My 2 piece Leki poles have their original twist expander the original are still going ok after 25 years! Dave's identical model ones make mine look like they're "VGC" (they're not at all) he's just used his so much for a similar length of time from Antarctica to Svalbard and most mountain areas in between!

I've seen plenty of cheap twist lock models fail but Leki seemed to have found a system that is reliable.

 HeMa 25 Dec 2021
In reply to TobyA:

> I've seen plenty of cheap twist lock models fail but Leki seemed to have found a system that is reliable.

I’ve broken a mid priced Leki twistlock… actually twice. Always got spare parts from retailers,  but they don’t help mid tour.

as for gear freezing shut, yeah that could certainly happen in UK. Not really all that often in say Alps or in the Nordics.

 beardy mike 25 Dec 2021
In reply to TobyA:

The Leki two piece poles I had were proper ski touring twistlocks and they were super reliable, literally never slipped... I was gutted they got nicked...

 SFM 25 Dec 2021
In reply to DaveHK:

Another shout for Mountain King poles. I have al ones that have lasted well despite being lightweight and low bulk. They do flex a lot so if you are more solidly put together then perhaps they’re a less good option. 

 Diddy 26 Dec 2021
In reply to John Workman:

 I used and still have BD, lever lock preferable. I now use PacerPoles the handle is better for the hands and transfers weight better in my opinion; full explanation on their website. i have walked many miles with them hear and in the European Alps

 Basemetal 26 Dec 2021
In reply to Diddy:

I also use PacerPoles, and I have to admit I carry them up climbs too (tho I only climb Grade IV/V). The handles are bulky, but they do fit in my pack when taken apart (not just telescoped closed). I also use the PPs as my XC ski poles -so far without any problems.

I think it was on the PacerPole website that I read the twist lock is significantly stronger for weight bearing than the lever lock and less likely to fail in use. It's also a lot less likely to become a victim of the boulder field, or just to snag anywhere. The key thing for twist locks is to store them separated and avoid internal corrosion -PP supply a net bag with poles that's great for storage. The other tip was to use, or carry, a bit of a rubber glove (or MTB inner tube) to get a serious grip on your pole to free it if frozen. I understand PP only produced a lever lock to meet market demand, despite considering it 'second best'.

I've had my PPs now for 7 years, walking, climbing and XC-skiing with them, now on their second tungsten tips, and no damage to report. I'm heavy on poles, and very impressed by them. Not the lightest, but a revelation in use and a Godsend in snowed over boulders!


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