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What's the difference between white and red wine?

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 james wardle 27 Jan 2022

Hi, 

Help ! 

I've foolishly agreed to run a bar for a few hundred people at the weekend. 

Licensing, beer and spirits are all sorted.  But I know nothing about wine,  except there is red and white!  I'm a bit overwhelmed by the variety of stuff I could buy tomorrow, and everyone seems to like something different.

Can you suggest some wine that I could pick up in a supermarket or wholesalers tomorrow? That is well-liked and costs about £2.50 a glass?

Thanks

1
 Robert Durran 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

The colour.

1
 mondite 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Go for the strongest you can find and then no one will remember.

More seriously I would just go to a wholesaler/wine merchant and ask them to provide a mix for the budget.

 Jamie Wakeham 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

To go with food, or to drink on its own?

At this sort of price point, Sainsbury's can be ok.  TTD Primitivo isn't bad, nor the Languedoc white.  

1
 Siward 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

If not mondite's idea I think the best bang for the buck is a big supermarket own brand, whatever is on offer but amongst their taste the difference /finest or whatever equivalent range. 

Red maybe Argentine Malbec 

White New Zealand Marlborough Sauvignon Blanc can't go wrong. 

1
 Bottom Clinger 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

My advice would be go into your nearest Oddbins, describe your situation and budget and see what they can do. I’d go for two of each PLUS a Prosecco (if sparkly is part of your instruction). You get 6 wine glasses per bottle. So theoretically each bottle could come in at £15. That is quite expensive for a ‘bash’. A tenner would get you good plonk.  Oddbins (or equivalents) know what people like. 

OR: Aldi/Lidl spend £10 per bottle on white (Chardonnay and Pinot Grigio) and red (Rioja and Shiraz) and a fizz. 

I’ve just embellished what moondite said. 

Post edited at 22:37
 Dave the Rave 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Go to Aldi

50 bottles of a £4 red = £200

5 glasses per bottle at £2.50=£625

So, £425profit

50 bottles of Prosecco, similar profit.

25 dry white similar profit

25 medium white similar profit.

 ripper 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Aldi's Toro Loco is a reliably acceptable cheap red

In reply to james wardle:

Your biggest problem may be knowing how much to buy. Running out, or getting lumbered with lots of wine left over...

A wholesaler may allow sale or return. 

 mrphilipoldham 27 Jan 2022
In reply to ripper:

It is lovely stuff but I haven’t seen it for a while.. have I not been looking hard enough?

 65 27 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Majestic Wine Warehouse is your friend. And mine.

 Toerag 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Who are the people going? If they're all poor people what they want won't be the same as if they're all wealthy people.  Surely the venue will know who's supplied wine there before?

2
russellcampbell 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

What's the difference between red and white wine? It's all to do with the traditional method of crushing grapes by tramping on them. For red wine the trampers wear red socks. For white wine they wear white socks. And for rose wine they wear one red sock and one white sock.

 Robert Durran 28 Jan 2022
In reply to russellcampbell:

> What's the difference between red and white wine? It's all to do with the traditional method of crushing grapes by tramping on them. For red wine the trampers wear red socks. For white wine they wear white socks. And for rose wine they wear one red sock and one white sock.

But despite that, in blind tastings, most people apparently can't tell the difference between red and white wine. Apparently our perception of taste and smell is massively influenced by sight

cb294 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Whatever you buy, remember that the white stuff should be cooled (not quite fridge temps, maybe 8-10 C), while the red stuff must be served at or just below room temperature. Never mind the details, as always there are exceptions. Nothing announces ignoramus or American more clearly than cold red wine!

The guests at your covid party will thank me.....

CB

2
 Doug 28 Jan 2022
In reply to cb294:

> Nothing announces ignoramus or American more clearly than cold red wine!

Pinot noir is usually served at about 8 -10° in Alsace, I've also had 'cool' red wine in parts of Spain & Italy where it seemed normal

As with anything related to wine, its often complicated

cb294 28 Jan 2022
In reply to Doug:

Yes, and there are whites traditionally served closer to RT e.g. in South Germany, but for a party, if you do not exactly know what you are doing, the rule stands, especially in Winter.

 Fredt 28 Jan 2022
In reply to captain paranoia:

> Your biggest problem may be knowing how much to buy. Running out, or getting lumbered with lots of wine left 

Leftover wine…?

 Baron Weasel 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

If it's a charity event definitely go to aldi. Their own brand merlot and malbec at £3.69 and £3.99 are excellent. 

For white wine it's worth noting that they can be anything from quite sweet to bone dry and that white wine drinkers tend to be fussy. In my experience from working on a few bars around a 1/3rd will want sweet such as chardonnay and 2/3rds will want dry such as pinot grigio or sauvignon blanc.

2
 john arran 28 Jan 2022
In reply to Baron Weasel:

> a 1/3rd will want sweet such as chardonnay

If you're calling Chardonnay sweet, there's a whole lot of pain in store for you when you encounter most Rieslings.

 Pedro50 28 Jan 2022
In reply to john arran:

> If you're calling Chardonnay sweet, there's a whole lot of pain in store for you when you encounter most Rieslings.

Unless it's a Trockenbeerenauslese!

 LastBoyScout 28 Jan 2022
In reply to oaktree:

> for me its ~

I agree - that's nice.

As a general rule, you won't go far wrong with a South American red.

This is also very nice: https://www.waitrose.com/ecom/products/terre-di-faiano-primitivo-organico-p...

 Baron Weasel 28 Jan 2022
In reply to john arran:

> If you're calling Chardonnay sweet, there's a whole lot of pain in store for you when you encounter most Rieslings.

I've served thousands and thousands of people as a barman and not once have I been asked for a Reisling. 

 Ben More 28 Jan 2022
In reply to Pedro50:

Sweeeeeeet. 

cb294 28 Jan 2022
In reply to Baron Weasel:

Most likely this is because Rieslings (at least in France and Germany where they are mainly made) traditionally accompany food, e.g. roast Christmas goose and especially aspargus dishes in early summer.

Not really a bar wine, IMO!

CB

 Baron Weasel 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

I'm interested to know if anyone asks for Reisling over the weekend? 

 65 28 Jan 2022
In reply to Robert Durran:

> But despite that, in blind tastings, most people apparently can't tell the difference between red and white wine. Apparently our perception of taste and smell is massively influenced by sight

Hmm, that might hold true for non-winos but I’d be confident of passing that test. I’ve successfully identified red wines from different French regions in a blind tasting more than once.

Mind you, I was at a port tasting where a concoction of cheap port, stale red wine, flat coke and buckfast went around and most people, me included, liked it the best and thought it must have been the poshest one.

 Duncan Bourne 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Avoid anything that says "British wine" this is the dregs from other vineyards. (English wine is a different matter several good vineyards)

There was one Silver Bay? undrinkable.

Generally something naming a grape variety will be okay. no one will be expecting Grand Vin or some such

 Myfyr Tomos 28 Jan 2022
In reply to 65:

Remember to let the wine breathe.

And if it's not breathing, go straight to mouth to mouth.


 Flinticus 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Red wine = red lips and more difficult stains to remove. Plus worse hangover, given my limited research involving white wine.

In reply to Dave the Rave:

I need to open a shady pop-up bar

 arch 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

I'd go for a Chardonnay and a Pinot Grigio for the whites, and a Pinot Noir and Cotes du Rhone for the reds. A nice mix of light and heavy reds and a classic, with the new boy on the block, whites.

Where you get it from and how much you pay is up to you.

Post edited at 18:37
 Tom Valentine 28 Jan 2022
In reply to arch:

New boy on the block is Vermentino, as I predicted on here five years ago. Even the bad guys' wives are ordering it in TV dramas....

 aln 28 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Consider wine boxes. Cheaper per glass and often decent for quaffable stuff.

In reply to james wardle:

Just one point, I believe Robert stays in Scotland so with the minimum pricing the figures will be different. £4.70 is the least that can be charged for 70cl.

Post edited at 16:14
 Siward 29 Jan 2022
In reply to Myfyr Tomos:

Breathing in a bottle can take days, no surface area.

Stick it in a blender (so says Oz Clarke ) or into a big bowl and whisk! 

 Hat Dude 29 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Know your audience!

Generally who are the people that will attend & what type of event is it?

it's easy for people to make suggestions based on their own favourite wines but there's a reason why most bars will commonly offer a choice of Shiraz and Merlot/Cab Sav or perhaps Malbec for reds and Chardonnay or Sauvignon Blanc for whites. New World varieties seem the most common

cb294 29 Jan 2022
In reply to Tom Valentine:

The actual new boy on the block is Lugana (from the Lago di Garda area) and various Cuvees made with it.

My favourite white of last summer was a Cuvee called Pratto from Ca di Fratti in Sirmione.

CB

 freeheel47 30 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

Know your market- beer or wine? Wine or beer?

Don't buy too much.  Aldi and Lidl do have some excellent offerings.

At the bottom end-less than £4.00/bottle- Torro Loco from Aldi- amazing that it is drinkable at the price- I use it for cooking- but drink a bit as I do.

They both have some decent South American reds

Lidl's St Emilion at about £10.00/bottle is excellent.

At about £12.00/bottle from both- Champagne- so you could sell that at £2.50 a glass and still make a profit- that would sell.

 summo 30 Jan 2022
In reply to james wardle:

roll out the better / expensive stuff first, cheap stuff later, leave the expensive bottles on show. Ask for sale or return, otherwise you’ll be left with stock.

 summo 30 Jan 2022
In reply to Siward:

> Breathing in a bottle can take days, no surface area.

> Stick it in a blender (so says Oz Clarke ) or into a big bowl and whisk! 

It'll get plenty air when you decant the cheap stuff into better labelled old bottles! 

 yorkshireman 30 Jan 2022
In reply to 65:

> Hmm, that might hold true for non-winos but I’d be confident of passing that test. 

No, the experiments have been run on professionals and it's well known in behavioural science circles. What you're expecting to taste can easily override the actual experience if given the right cues. 

I used to work for Coca Cola and the innovation team developing new flavours used to do all their tests in something like a photography dark room so all liquids looked the same and didn't influence their opinions. 

 65 30 Jan 2022
In reply to yorkshireman:

Wow!


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