UKC

Hi all, 

I am generally just trying to get a fitter. At the moment I have been following some training plans from UpHillAthelte from Training for the New Alpinism. Specifically, I have done the 5-week base plan and currently trying to start the 8-week plan. The hope is to get fitter for long mountain days, I have no specific objective. This has core and general strength workouts included.

I'd also like to get better at trad and want to include training for that in my weekly routine as well. Realistically I think this year, all things considered, I'm going to be doing more trad climbing than heading to the Alps!

At the moment I am leading 6a/6b indoors and I can lead most VDiffs and the odd Sevres. I find that endurance seems to be my limiting factor, especially when leading Sevres. I was wondering if anyone can suggest any endurance exercises I can do at home whilst the walls are closed. I have access to some rocks ring I have screwed to a length of wood mounted across a corridor. I'm under the impression that I'm not really climbing at a high enough level to use a proper fingerboard. 

If it helps my goals for this year would probably be able to lead 6b+ indoors and comfortably lead Sevres. 

Sorry for the long post! 

TIA James 

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

If you can lead 6b then you don't need more endurance. If you're getting pumped, then:

- relax and deal with your breathing and your nerves
- focus on reading the rock 
- look more carefully for holds and rests
- get your weight on your feet
- place gear strategically, avoiding doing so from strenuous positions.

There are plenty of people leading HVS and even low Es who are far from athletic, and I'm regularly out climbed by people who spend less time training...

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

Yes pumped was the right word I don't know why I didn't use that in the original post! I guess the question is, is there something I can be doing at home while I wait for the wall to open/ go outdoors? 

My head for trad lead definitely plays a large part in that, and I guess the only way that will change is by more climbing... Also strategically placing gear is not something I am good at yet.

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

Actually there's no reason why anyone shouldn't use a fingerboard, even if they had never climbed before.

With appropriate loading and intensity fingerboarding is one of the safest forms of training and is actually perfect for preparing your tendons and muscles for the loads they will experience during climbing. 

Here's a great video guide with loads of detail :

youtube.com/watch?v=hJ_LhlF9YRs& 

A few thoughts to keep in mind when looking to improve on trad:

It's normal to be scared of scary situations. The best way to solve this is to expose yourself regularly to moderately scary situations to improve your overall tolerance and confidence. When I was leading a lot of bolder trad I trained this by doing a high volume of moderate soloing on the grit - long days on comfy terrain but where you needed to stay precise and mentally sharp throughout. 

Onsight isn't always the best way to improve. Don't be afraid to drop a rope down something and work it first - especially if it is a new grade for you, and especially especially if it is bold. It's best to avoid doing this on really good routes because those are nice to save for the onsight/ground up. Just don't get stuck in the mode of always top-roping everything because the best trad experience is for sure the onsight! Working a route is just one useful tool in your progression toolbox. 

Fall practice is essential to pushing your grade. Get used to only placing gear that you'd be willing to fall on, and then fall on it regularly. Many trad climbers don't trust their gear and this shows clearly when you see them climbing. Most of them have never taken a trad fall. You wouldn't drive a car without knowing if the brakes worked - so get familiar with your gear and get falling into it! Again, this is something that's best done away from classic routes for the simple reason that unnecessary wear on gear placements should be avoided. 

Hope this helps! 

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

I’d agree with the C Witter above and say there’s probably the most gains to be had from improving your tactics and psychological game.

That said who doesn’t like being fitter?!

I’d look at repeaters on the rock rings, 10 sets of 6 reps, 7:3 is probably about right. You want to be feeling lightly pumped at the end of session. Either use a big jug or take weight off to get the effort right.

Get the Crimpd app, it’s free and very good. 

Warm up well first

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

I think climbing more is a big part of it, but also actually acknowledging and trying to address the issue head on. It's easy to hide behind the idea that others are "stronger" or "just better", rather than deal with these subtle and less tangible things - which range from motivation to self-pressure to body position to partners to how you imagine and represent in your own mind the activity you're undertaking. There's a lot written on this in various places. To be honest, it's a big issue for me, too! Probably most climbers!

You may also benefit from revisiting gear placements and other basics (see: https://www.chrisensoll.com/chris-ensolls-blog/the-abc-of-trad-climbing). Rather than lobbing onto gear, I'd just place some at head height along the bottom of a crag and bounce test it. Make sure to wear a helmet and be careful of your eyes, in case any gear does pop.

I think Mischa's suggestion of top-roping some harder routes is a really good one. It's taken me 5 years to realise this; I started out with the idea that you should only climb those routes you dare to climb onsight. It created a very weird mentality and slowed my progress. Top rope some HVS routes and your confidence on Severes will shoot right up. Bouldering also helps you to get in a steady diet of harder moves. Have a few goal climbs in mind and enjoy the process.

Conversely, continue leading things that are very comfortable - e.g. VDiffs - and when you do, concentrate on doing things really well, finding rest positions from which to place gear, good rope work, making moves in the most efficient way, using your feet immaculately. Same goes for leading 6as inside (when we're finally allowed back in): don't just do the move, but do the move in complete control and as effortlessly as possible, moving from position of balance to position of balance.

In the meanwhile, it's good to have a project and what others have suggested makes sense. Don't expect to do 10 sets of 6 reps 7:3 on a 25mm edge straight away though - nevermind feeling only "lightly pumped" afterward. I think 8a Jez has forgotten what it feels like to be mortal. 4 sets of 4 reps may be more realistic to start with. Just see what feels doable and keep checking in and building it up. You won't be able to apply that stength, though, if you don't work on the mental side of trad climbing too.

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

If you're comfortably leading 6bs at the wall, I'd suggest it's not finger strength that's necessarily limiting you, but technique and head space. I could be way out here, but wall climbers tend to climb with their arms more than their feet, whereas I was taught early on to let the feet and legs do the heavy lifting outdoors. Couple that with over gripping from stress, and suddenly you're climbing at a much lower level than you're really capable of. 

No training programme or indoor climbing will prepare you for the situations and climbing you will find outdoors (my opinion). So get outdoors and get mileage, and like someone said, don't be afraid to chuck a top rope up now and again to feel things out.

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

Some really good advice here, but I'd reinforce the importance of rest.

After a few years climbing I went for a weekend of coaching and the most important piece of feedback I got was slow down and learn to rest.  At that point I'd start a route and just climb and climb until I either finished it or fell off.  That's fine for most routes up to 6A+ (especially indoors as they're relatively short) as there's not really too many moves that are really physically draining.

Once you get into the mid 6s however you need to introduce some tactics and break the route down into a series of smaller sequences, taking a rest and having a shake even before you're tired so that when you get to the cruxy bit further up you'll still have plenty of gas in your tank.

Think of it like this - if you had to do 10 press ups, you'd just knock them out in one set.  If you had to do 100, you'd break it down to 10 sets of 10.  So why don't we apply the same logic to climbing harder routes?

This isn't something that you can just change overnight - you have to train your body and mind to always be looking for the rest, measuring your level of pump and looking up above you to see if it looks difficult, finding good positions for a rest and, (this is important, especially outside) making that a genuine rest.  Just stopping, remaining really gripped and having a quick shake and cracking on isn't enough.  You need to stop, get in a comfortable position, get as much weight as you can on your feet, relax (no need to overgrip!), breathe, bring your heart rate down...  Have a look up and a think about what you need to do next.  To be able to do this really well takes practice but is so helpful once you've got used to it.  We spend so much time training our mind and body to climb, but it's just as important to train them to rest and relax on a route.

Seeing as I only climb sport I'm a big advocate for falling practice, I know it's not as common in trad as it is in sport, but I know having the confidence and willingness to fall on a route really helped me  with relaxing, breathing, and bringing the heart rate down.  If this is something you can bring to the trad arena (I know Hazel Findlay does a course in trad falling) it would certainly be beneficial.

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

Thanks to everyone for the advice it has been most helpful! 

I should point out that before the lockdown, I was getting pumped on easy indoor leads as well, but I guessed this was due to a lack of climbing. So I'd like to avoid that as well. 

At the moment, I can dead hang off the jugs for 30 seconds or so and when repeating that time reduces. I can also dead hang on the four/three finger pocket for a lot less time. No chance on two fingers. I have also been popping my legs on a chair and going up and down the holds/pockets to emulate pump. I just wondered if there was any advice people could give do maybe do something better? or point my towards a more structured plan for someone of my level (i.e. noob).

-> See that repeaters was suggested so I'm glad I'm doing that right!

In reply to Iamgregp:

I know people will have different ideas and opinions, but I think trad fall practice requires judgement and isn't really for beginners unless supported by someone more experienced who can create a safe set-up. In fact, one of the worst injuries I've had whilst climbing (a severely sprained ankle) was from some poorly planned "fall practice" on an indoor wall with someone else who was also a relative novice. Those kind of bad experiences are very counter-productive!

More generally, climbing Severe and VS, it's good to know your gear is competently placed and that it will keep you safe, but you don't need to be putting yourself in a position where falling off is a strong possibility. Instead, you need to be in a position where you are able to make moves in a controlled way, with a strong understanding of what the outcome will be. That sense of commitment in the face of falling being a possibility comes later, I think - maybe HVS or E1, certainly sport climbing.

In reply to C Witter:

That's a very good point.

Like you, and I suspect many more of us, I've seen people do "falls practice" at indoor walls in totally the wrong way and risk injury and make themselves more terrified of falling.

I took a course with a pro, and would advocate others doing the same, or at the very least learning how from somebody vastly more experienced.

Thanks, everyone again for your advice it has been most helpful. I'm glad to find out I am not a super weakling! . I think other than what I can do at home perhaps reading some stuff about my head and leading seems like it would be helpful and when we can get back to the wall trying to get my technique dialled in seems the way to go.  

In reply to Professor_Professorson:

As some further encouragement, the super-classic Left Wall (E2 5c) is said to be safe French 6b or 6b+, so your fitness is easily good enough progress up the trad grades. 

So, as others have said, it's time to work on other aspects of outdoor climbing as soon as you can. Having said that, I know I've lost a lot of fitness since January, so those repeaters won't hurt.