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Single Biggest Training Improvement

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 Jackspratt 20 Sep 2021

I'm intrigued to know what everyone's single biggest training enhancement has been, it could be an exercise, something specific, a mindset but it must have had the biggest impact. I'm keen to hear from any level of climber!

 ebdon 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Being bored shitless in lockdown, which made me actually build a structured training regime (around the crimpd app) and get on the fingerboard. 

I doubt I will ever actually do this again as its so time consuming, painful and boring and I'd much rather be in the pub!

So basically loads and loads of finger boarding.

 Exile 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

I built a very basic foot on four rung campus board at the start of the first lockdown. I did max hangs first day, 2min on 2min off x 6 on the board second day, run on third day, rest on fourth day and repeat. When we could climb I was suddenly equalling previous PBs (7b) on local short sharp sports routes at age 48. (For reference I think my hardest route the year before was 6c+.)

 john arran 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Mine was when I first went to college and I started climbing with a training machine called Dave Turner. It wasn't the training methods per se (those were all pretty rudimentary at the time), but the sheer energy he put into it; that rubbed off on me and definitely helped me to progress beyond where my 'comfort zone' preference for technical and bold routes had got me thus far.

1
 Robert Durran 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

The opening of Ratho.

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 Iamgregp 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Getting a structured training plan from a professional coach. Whilst I didn’t see a huge improvement in my grade, I saw a slight one despite repeated lockdowns and becoming a parent for the first time. I’ll take that.

 C Witter 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Interesting topic!

Beginning fingerboarding + core, push and pull ups during the lockdown had the very noticeable effect of getting me up some local boulder problems that had previous felt impossible. It also added a bit of confidence to my trad climbing. Most of all, it kept me sane and probably helped me maintain my strength during the extended lay offs of the lockdowns.

Historically, I think outdoor bouldering had a big effect on improving my trad.

But, my biggest improvements recently have come from "just getting on it". This has included identifying a few trad projects a bit above my paygrade, for the last two years, top roping them, working them out, learning what I'm missing (confidence, body position, avoiding overgripping, efficient sequence reading when things get hard, etc.) and then leading them. Before I was an "onsight or nothing" kind of person, and perhaps it was holding me back. Also, I didn't utterly work them into the ground and was picking routes hard enough that I still ended up taking some good (safe) falls on lead - which was also probably good for the head. This mentality of getting on things has also been connected with climbing with certain people who've helped me push myself.

 GDes 20 Sep 2021

Good topic.

After years of fairly dedicated training on fingerboard and indoor walls, a mate built a 50 degree Woody in a barn near us. I felt a couple of grades stronger in about 6 months. 

 plyometrics 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Training with a weight belt on at the temple of power that was Broughton. Those we’re the days.

 alx 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Finally figuring out all training was stroking the ego until you get your sleep, stress levels and diet sorted.

 bouldery bits 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Eating less food.

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 ericinbristol 20 Sep 2021
In reply to ebdon:

Learning how to redpoint. Doing sport climbs like a trad climber I thought F6b was my limit. I learned how to redpoint and I've got up F7c+, got close on F8a and on sighted F7a

Post edited at 20:51
 afx22 20 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Focusing on Max Hangs.  Knowing that not only can I pull on smaller holds but also that because of that, the small holds that used to be my limit are so much easier.  I can now recover on stuff that surprises me.

In reply to Jackspratt:

During lockdown a lot of traversing and climbing even more than usual .......well thought out training plans are obviously good but climbing with lots of nice people always works for me.

 tlouth7 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

My biggest trad improvement came from climbing with a partner who was arguably better than me, and who was keen to try stuff at both our perceived limits.

Indoors I got better for a period ahead of a specific climbing trip by shifting my attitude at the wall from "I'm here to have fun" to "I'm here to have fun, but I will make sure I do lots of volume at the end so I leave pretty knackered each week".

 C Witter 21 Sep 2021
In reply to tlouth7:

> Indoors I got better for a period ahead of a specific climbing trip by shifting my attitude at the wall from "I'm here to have fun" to "I'm here to have fun, but I will make sure I do lots of volume at the end so I leave pretty knackered each week".

I wonder if an even better approach might be not to do a really long knackering session, but to do an extra session and keep them both focused on good quality? E.g. one on trying boulder problems near your limit (strength) and one doing leads on the longest vertical/just over vertical wall you've got going (endurance)? Or, if you're heading on a trip to Spain, etc., maybe flip into one endurance leading session and one "hard" leading session per week. Of course... life often gets in the way of carefully made plans!

I'm always tempted to knacker myself, when I'm having fun, but have overheard Neil Gresham himself inveighing against people who knacker themselves out as "training" rather than having focused sessions that leave you something in the tank for the next day/next session.

 mark s 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

When I first started climbing it was over a year before I went indoors.

I joined a private wall in buxton called the hayloft.

No set training or anything. Just climbing on small holds. Never been a big fan of indoors and will always prioritise outdoor climbing over anything else 

 Robert Durran 21 Sep 2021
In reply to ericinbristol:

> Learning how to redpoint. Doing sport climbs like a trad climber I thought F6b was my limit. I learned how to redpoint and I've got up F7c+, got close on F8a and on sighted F7a

Sounds like you now need to learn to onsight

Post edited at 12:24
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Andy Gamisou 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Having emergency bowel surgery, losing about 6kg in weight during the recovery (down from 70 to 64), and (against all odds) not putting any back on in the subsequent 2 years.  Might not be feasible for everyone.

 Robert Durran 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

I think my biggest improvement came from doing 4x4's or similar on boulder problems. The extra strength endurance seemed to give me an extra grade onsighting sport. Unfortunately it also seems a good way to get injured, so I have had to use it quite sparingly.

2
 seankenny 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Fall training and doing very low intensity aerocap sessions have both been very useful for me. Both on top of a diet of regular indoor bouldering.

 tlouth7 21 Sep 2021
In reply to C Witter:

> I wonder if an even better approach might be not to do a really long knackering session, but to do an extra session and keep them both focused on good quality?

No doubt, but the reality of my life is that I am never going to do more than one indoor climbing session per week. And the reality of my motivation is that I am not going to do hangboarding or similar.

1
In reply to Jackspratt:

For me it was a long time ago: the opening of Altringham Wall. I realise it was nowhere near as good as the legendary Broughton and nowadays would not be popular but it was the biggest step forward for me and improved my crimp strength massively. At about the same time I moved within easy travel of Pex, Frodsham, The Breck and Helsby but I don't count those as training enhancements and Altringham helped to maintain the process through the winter months. 

 seankenny 21 Sep 2021
In reply to GDes:

> Good topic.

> After years of fairly dedicated training on fingerboard and indoor walls, a mate built a 50 degree Woody in a barn near us. I felt a couple of grades stronger in about 6 months. 


Do you think this would be good for climbers at all sorts of levels, or did you only find it useful because you were already fairly handy?

1
OP Jackspratt 21 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Great stuff, thanks everyone. It's interesting to note what works for others far too many complex training programmes out there, often it's the simplest things that have the biggest impact, I've been meaning to factor in 50 degree sessions, out of interest how to people structure these?

 C Witter 22 Sep 2021
In reply to tlouth7:

> No doubt, but the reality of my life is that I am never going to do more than one indoor climbing session per week. And the reality of my motivation is that I am not going to do hangboarding or similar.


I think that's entirely legitimate! The main motivation and goal for me is always enjoyment - and it's one of the few essentials of climbing

cb294 22 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Dropping 10kg of weight. Other than that, ropes.

CB

1
 Exile 22 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Probably obvious but if its 40 / 45 / 50 degrees is less of an issue than hold selection for your level. I can only do a few problems on a mates board as the hold are all pretty nails for me, but have a lot more success on a similar board at the climbing wall because there is more I can do so I can progress incrementally more easily.

In terms of training - google limit bouldering. 

In reply to cb294:

> Dropping 10kg of weight. Other than that, ropes.

> CB

This^^
in my case it was an unintended bonus of giving up alcohol and going vegan. Also stopped the tweaky finger injuries I used to pick up.

For training, the biggest gains are made from identifying weaknesses and working on them. A symmetrical board sorted my significant l-r imbalance. Those weaknesses don’t get addressed by just climbing.

 timparkin 22 Sep 2021
In reply to seankenny:

> Do you think this would be good for climbers at all sorts of levels, or did you only find it useful because you were already fairly handy?

I'm 53, only been climbing for three years and was managing 6b vertical at my limit at our local wall (Ice Factor) and probably 6a overhanging. We built a climbing wall in a shed in the garden and it was just completed the Christmas before Covid/Lockdown. It has a 25 degree moonboard, a straight vertical section and a 15 degree section plus fingerboard. The increase in strength from trying things on the moonboard was really noticeable when the Ice Factor opened back up and now, two years on I'm climbing 6c onsight occasionally and even managed a 6c overhanging climb. Fingerstrength is going up slowly but general upper body strength has been the biggest difference. Getting enough protein in was also a noticeable bump in performance (straight after a session). I definitely noticed hypertrophy where before there wasn't much going on. Not amazing gains but anybody who says these things are only for advanced climbers is wrong in my opinion. It's no replacement for mileage but it does help in targeting strength (and perhaps endurance but that is probably best trained separately).

 Fishmate 22 Sep 2021
In reply to Exile:

> Probably obvious but if its 40 / 45 / 50 degrees is less of an issue than hold selection for your level.

With this type of work, the hold selection is crucial. Pulling jugs on steep boards will be more of a physical stimulus rather than addressing your fingers. Jugs will improve your physical condition but until you are required to squeeze with the fingers as opposed to hang you won't address the real purpose of a steep board which will train both fingers and body (i.e. ability to create tension off of small footholds, etc).

Jugs will be good for improving power and strength endurance and prepping body for use of small holds, but pulling on jugs as oppsed to edges, ain't the same exercise.

 GDes 22 Sep 2021
In reply to seankenny:

I wouldn't particularly describe myself as handy, but I suppose I'd been pretty dedicated to climbing harder for at least 15 years. I'd always focused on endurance routes and they were definitely my strength. My goals had basically turned into steep, fingery bouldery routes. So it's probably a terrible idea for loads of people! But worked for me. 

 is2 23 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

I am very old and have trained for many years. Much of my effort now is running fast to stay still but ... two things provided gains for me this year:

1: having a structured training plan with a coach.

2: buying an Entralpi force plate ( entralpi.com ) to more precisely target and measure my “hang board” training. I used this to replace weighted hangs both on a bar and a 15mm edge working static strength. Between Dec and May I had a 30% increase in maximum static finger strength on both half crimp and open grips and rebuilt my ability to lock off on one arm. I am impressed with this technology and it’s good to see more devices becoming available e.g. tindeq, climbro, and now the beastmaker motherboard.

The hang board training was part of my training plan so it’s hard to tease out relative effects but I’ve climbed pretty well this year keeping close to my previous 5 years for sport and improving on boulders.

In reply to Jackspratt:

I hate "training" i.e. following a series of regimented movements to increase strength, suppleness and technique in order to improve my climbing.  Whilst readily acknowledging the benefits I do find it boring. My best results have come about when I have been able to climb regularly and often.  I'm retired so a month in the sun is ideal. More than a month and I'm ready for home.

Al

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 kwoods 23 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Seem to have been a few unrelated boosts.

One from a few years ago; I had done onsight E2 I think. I did a season of winter climbing (and associated rubbish gear), came back to solid rock gear and onsighted E4.

Sport climbing (especially climbing through a pump and taking falls) has a brilliant effect on my trad climbing (in a way that bouldering, which I do all the time, doesn't). Avoiding sport seems to mean eroding confidence on trad. And implies that taking falls on sport translates to stacks of confidence above trad gear (it seems to be the actual sensation of losing contact, falling and penduluming that is uncomfortable, rather than the integrity of the placement alone)

Recently, building a 45 board in lockdown, then using it through autumn/winter last year; went from my personal best bouldering being 7C after a siege, to getting 7C in a session and a couple tries next session.

Interesting game.

 Exile 23 Sep 2021
In reply to Fishmate:

I completely agree. To clarify I'm not suggesting making it easier by using jugs, I'm suggeating that having a spread of holds for your level so you can improve and develop incrementally is the important thing. 

Post edited at 15:54
 Wally 23 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

I would class myself as an experienced climber (+20yrs) with above average footwork capability. Life with young family meant not much climbing in the past 5 yrs. However, for me it was doing core exercises (10-15min) 4/5 times a week that had me quickly back up to my o/s limit which I'm really happy with. Hopefully I can continue the gains.

 Simon King 24 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Thanks for this post. Really interesting comments.  As an 'older' climber (60) still trying to improve I have also found regular max hangs and repeaters over lockdown have had a significant impact. I've also got a small endurance circuit on my board where I do 20 mins clockwise, 20 mins anticlockwise. It's obviously got a couple of bigger holds that I can recover on. Another thing is almost daily press ups and pull ups; just a few sets of 20 an 10 seem to have helped generally and I can't remember the last time I was injured... All the above and some regular sport climbing has helped improve my OS trad by an E grade, especially hanging on to place gear, recover and work out where to go next! Will repeat this again over winter and expect another E grade in response. Also never forget the benefit of eating sensibly and dropping a couple of pounds. It's the easiest way of getting stronger!

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 JIMBO 24 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

training with other people always makes me train harder...

 jkarran 24 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

> I'm intrigued to know what everyone's single biggest training enhancement has been, it could be an exercise, something specific, a mindset but it must have had the biggest impact. I'm keen to hear from any level of climber!

Stretching for flexibility if you want an intervention that increased my ability significantly.

Redpointing if you want a change that significantly altered what I was getting ticked.

Getting fat for a change that took me the other way

jk

Post edited at 10:19
 timjones 24 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Interval training on a home bouldering wall allowed me to set problems that challenged my weaknesses and adjust them as I improved.

 mondite 24 Sep 2021
In reply to kwoods:

> Seem to have been a few unrelated boosts.

Which is to be expected since will completely depend on what your weaknesses are and background eg if you decided to start doing serious fingerboarding after climbing for the first time the week before chances are its going to end in tears.

As someone who climbed for a while and then did bare minimum for a while whilst other things were a priority and then rinsed and repeat key things which stood out are climbing a couple of times a week and (after this lockdown) deciding sod it and losing a decent number of kilos.

If I dont pay more attention to the kayaking/mountain biking then I think to begin with upping the general sessions to 3/4 times a week would give a boost and then start concentrating on specific training routines.

Then there is the mostly mental stuff you seem to have mostly benefited from.

 Jon Stewart 24 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Doing laps on routes, i.e. 4x4 routes sessions, got me fit for Pembroke/ other sea cliff stamina routes. This type of wall fitness is great for those types of routes, but doesn't help so much on more technical styles.

 jack_44 25 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

Got to be mindset and wanting to climb harder. That and reflection on why I can't get up something, instead of making excuses!

 downsouth 25 Sep 2021
In reply to bouldery bits:

Interested in this.  Can you share a bit more detail on your story. Thanks. 

 UKB Shark 25 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

I’ve been at it for 38 years and sorry to report there’s not been one single enhancement that had a big overall impact - ie the proverbial magic bullet. It’s been a story of plateaus, incremental gains and occasional setbacks.

In recent years I’ve worked at improving my limestone bouldering ability and finger strength with good results but in the process found I’d lost the natural endurance levels I used to take for granted so this year I’ve been working focussing more on regaining that.

Snakes and ladders. 

OP Jackspratt 25 Sep 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

just wanted to say thank you for everyone's response to this, there's a lot to be learned especially as most of us aren't reaching for complex training programmes. it's encouraging to know people are smashing their goals and pb's without overhauling their lives

 Davy Gunn 20 Oct 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

50 years climbing, mostly trad, recent few years exclusively sport. Crimpd app and structured plan has been good. Now don't do junk work mostly just high weight repeaters or max hangs with a few weighted pulls in between, some core and flexibility work as well. Even at going on 65  I found big improvements although now plateaud out and suffering from old injuries a bit. Trad head pretty much gone but loving the sport. I would say the biggest game changer is over a long period is finger boarding, pinch block, posterior chain training but mainly adding weight to progressively overload over months to avoid injury.  

 RX-78 20 Oct 2021
In reply to Wally:

Curious what your core routine comprised of, I hate doing core but know i should!

 carr0t 21 Oct 2021
In reply to Jackspratt:

First big breakthrough for me has been through fall practice. Sorting the head out instantly bumped me up 3-4 grades on sport and 2 grades on trad. 

Second big breakthrough has been through board climbing. Strength levels have gone through the roof, which feels pretty incredible. Nothing quite like a good rest on holds that you could barely hang onto previously.

 C Witter 22 Oct 2021
In reply to Wally:

Hi A! That must be you; I recognise the story too well. Hope you've managed to get in some nice routes since our snatched evening ascent of Bilberry Buttress. Look me up if you're ever near Huddersfield and fancy a climb.

 Cobra_Head 23 Oct 2021
In reply to Gaston Rubberpants:

> I hate "training" i.e. following a series of regimented movements to increase strength, suppleness and technique in order to improve my climbing....

Ditto, I can't even be arsed to "warm up/down". Climb more has been my way to improve.

Oh! and a good belayer.


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