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At the start of the indoor winter season I bought myself a 6 month pass for transition extreme in Aberdeen, meaning that I have unlimited use of the wall for 6 months. Last night I went to the wall and was told that as my annual membership of £30 runs out on the 9th of January I will have to renew this to continue using my 6 month pass. Are they allowed to do this? Their website says a pass cannot be purchased without a tx membership, which is fair enough but I had one when I purchased mine.
Next we get on to the cost of the place! £30 a year membership, is there a more expensive wall in the country?
http://www.transition-extreme.com/climbing-wall-prices
Speaking to staff members about route setting and the wall is budgeted at 18 hours per week for route setting. They have tried to get more hours as it clearly this is not enough as the turn over of new routes is very poor. The main steep wall has had no new lines on it since mid October at the earliest.
Unfortunately they have a monopoly as there are no other venues in Aberdeen so going somewhere else is not really an option.
Any advice on what to do, seems we have similar issues regarding route setting every winter and sending emails through to the centre changes little.
Thanks, from a frustrated climber!
Next we get on to the cost of the place! £30 a year membership, is there a more expensive wall in the country?
http://www.transition-extreme.com/climbing-wall-prices
Speaking to staff members about route setting and the wall is budgeted at 18 hours per week for route setting. They have tried to get more hours as it clearly this is not enough as the turn over of new routes is very poor. The main steep wall has had no new lines on it since mid October at the earliest.
Unfortunately they have a monopoly as there are no other venues in Aberdeen so going somewhere else is not really an option.
Any advice on what to do, seems we have similar issues regarding route setting every winter and sending emails through to the centre changes little.
Thanks, from a frustrated climber!
2
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
>"no new lines on it since mid October at the earliest"
I only been once but would agree their entry prices are expensive compared to central belt walls.
A three month cycle of setting sounds pretty good TBH and about right. Four months is past tedious. Ratho has struggled recently with it's setting schedule and even though the scale of the place allows a bit more leeway, some of the regulars were grumbling about routes reaching their first birthday...
>"no new lines on it since mid October at the earliest"
I only been once but would agree their entry prices are expensive compared to central belt walls.
A three month cycle of setting sounds pretty good TBH and about right. Four months is past tedious. Ratho has struggled recently with it's setting schedule and even though the scale of the place allows a bit more leeway, some of the regulars were grumbling about routes reaching their first birthday...
Post edited at 10:32
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In reply to Dangerous Dave:
£11 for standard entry with no membership fee does make it expensive, but you recoup your £30 membership in only 15 visits? and the Friday evenings 6-10pm are only £5, £1.25/hr!
I would agree the routes are changed quite slowly but in their favour the bouldering is reset once a month or more? and new circuit board has already been reset since it was installed late last year.
What about RGU?
Vote with you feet and climb at RGU instead, or inquire about getting on the routesetting team?
What about those of us that live half way between Aberdeen and Dundee, my fuel costs are nearly more than the entry fee to either wall.
> Next we get on to the cost of the place! £30 a year membership, is there a more expensive wall in the country?
£11 for standard entry with no membership fee does make it expensive, but you recoup your £30 membership in only 15 visits? and the Friday evenings 6-10pm are only £5, £1.25/hr!
> Speaking to staff members about route setting and the wall is budgeted at 18 hours per week for route setting. They have tried to get more hours as it clearly this is not enough as the turn over of new routes is very poor. The main steep wall has had no new lines on it since mid October at the earliest.
I would agree the routes are changed quite slowly but in their favour the bouldering is reset once a month or more? and new circuit board has already been reset since it was installed late last year.
> Unfortunately they have a monopoly as there are no other venues in Aberdeen so going somewhere else is not really an option.
What about RGU?
> Any advice on what to do, seems we have similar issues regarding route setting every winter and sending emails through to the centre changes little.
Vote with you feet and climb at RGU instead, or inquire about getting on the routesetting team?
What about those of us that live half way between Aberdeen and Dundee, my fuel costs are nearly more than the entry fee to either wall.
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In reply to Dangerous Dave:
It's a registered charity. Looking at their 2016 accounts it appears they received 200k from the council. Perhaps you should contact your local councillor. Someones making a very tidy salary out it.
It's a registered charity. Looking at their 2016 accounts it appears they received 200k from the council. Perhaps you should contact your local councillor. Someones making a very tidy salary out it.
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In reply to becauseitsthere:
Thanks,
That is an interesting point, rumour has it the CEO is on a very nice package.
With it being a charity does the council have a bit of a say in how it is run?
Thanks,
That is an interesting point, rumour has it the CEO is on a very nice package.
With it being a charity does the council have a bit of a say in how it is run?
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
The staff are superb and do great with what they have. The owner is a bandit. Its sad to charge almost £15 for climb and equipment hire in a city hit with the oil downturn when many already struggle to afford this. For being a charity aiming to "keep kids off the streets" this is a brilliant way to discourage anybody who cannot afford it.
The staff are superb and do great with what they have. The owner is a bandit. Its sad to charge almost £15 for climb and equipment hire in a city hit with the oil downturn when many already struggle to afford this. For being a charity aiming to "keep kids off the streets" this is a brilliant way to discourage anybody who cannot afford it.
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In reply to mrbird:
I agree on the staff, they try hard with what they are given. I don't know the CEO but I have heard.
I agree on the staff, they try hard with what they are given. I don't know the CEO but I have heard.
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
I doubt it. But for a donation of 200k from the council, going by their entry prices they could provide 25000 free entries for juniors. I somehow doubt something like that is happening. I sincerly hope the council is scrutinising how that money was spent.
Going back a few years many of the parents of comp climbers used to complain about the cost. Pretty much anywhere else in Scotland you got free climbing if you made the regional team.
Maybe that's changed.
> With it being a charity does the council have a bit of a say in how it is run?
I doubt it. But for a donation of 200k from the council, going by their entry prices they could provide 25000 free entries for juniors. I somehow doubt something like that is happening. I sincerly hope the council is scrutinising how that money was spent.
Going back a few years many of the parents of comp climbers used to complain about the cost. Pretty much anywhere else in Scotland you got free climbing if you made the regional team.
Maybe that's changed.
2
In reply to Jon Greengrass:
RGU is set with new routes even less often I think. The bouldering room again is more frequent but the routes at RGU are, apparently, not very varied and don't have a particularly good spread of grades. It's also really small and doesn't have any leading lines, if I remember correctly and do you not need to be a member of an RGU affiliated club to use the wall there?
3-4 months in the roped wall is alright I'd say, a month for bouldering problems is about standard. Anything beyond this and I'd be questioning where my money was going.
RGU is set with new routes even less often I think. The bouldering room again is more frequent but the routes at RGU are, apparently, not very varied and don't have a particularly good spread of grades. It's also really small and doesn't have any leading lines, if I remember correctly and do you not need to be a member of an RGU affiliated club to use the wall there?
3-4 months in the roped wall is alright I'd say, a month for bouldering problems is about standard. Anything beyond this and I'd be questioning where my money was going.
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
More on Transition downthread here:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?n=676505
More on Transition downthread here:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?n=676505
In reply to Nathan Adam:
Aye, problem with RGU is that it's so small, and changed so infrequently that if you climb more than once a week you'll be out of routes well before the wall is re-set. I don't think you need to be a member of affiliated club (we never were), just do a safety assessment prior to being allowed to use the wall. Problem was always that there was only a couple of slots a week for the assessments so could take weeks to get assessed!
Cheers,
Stu
Aye, problem with RGU is that it's so small, and changed so infrequently that if you climb more than once a week you'll be out of routes well before the wall is re-set. I don't think you need to be a member of affiliated club (we never were), just do a safety assessment prior to being allowed to use the wall. Problem was always that there was only a couple of slots a week for the assessments so could take weeks to get assessed!
Cheers,
Stu
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In reply to nniff:
>"Annual report and accounts here:"
Try here...
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC280405/filing-history/MzE5MDQy...
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC280405/filing-history
Looks like the CEO costs £70k.
(Page 16 of the report/page 18 of the pdf)
>"Annual report and accounts here:"
Try here...
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC280405/filing-history/MzE5MDQy...
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC280405/filing-history
Looks like the CEO costs £70k.
(Page 16 of the report/page 18 of the pdf)
Post edited at 16:17
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In reply to Jon Greengrass:
There is a new Academy/leisure centre in Brechin that has a small wall. Yet to get to it myself but I think it’s pretty cheap and has some lead routes as well as tr ones.
Might be worth a punt now and then and it’s in that general area between Dundee and Aberdeen.
> What about those of us that live half way between Aberdeen and Dundee, my fuel costs are nearly more than the entry fee to either wall.
There is a new Academy/leisure centre in Brechin that has a small wall. Yet to get to it myself but I think it’s pretty cheap and has some lead routes as well as tr ones.
Might be worth a punt now and then and it’s in that general area between Dundee and Aberdeen.
In reply to alx:
It can be but I would put this more down to lack alternatives as opposed to quality.
70k for CEO sounds like a hell of a lot!
It can be but I would put this more down to lack alternatives as opposed to quality.
70k for CEO sounds like a hell of a lot!
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
>"70k for CEO sounds like a hell of a lot!"
I'm guessing 15k of that is employer's national insurance and pension contributions leaving around 55k salary.
A wee bit more than I'd imagined the manager of a small sports centre would be on but hardly silly money...
>"70k for CEO sounds like a hell of a lot!"
I'm guessing 15k of that is employer's national insurance and pension contributions leaving around 55k salary.
A wee bit more than I'd imagined the manager of a small sports centre would be on but hardly silly money...
2
In reply to JLS:
Not bad for him. Most Aberdonians and oil workers UK wide have had wages cut, redundancy/ threat of redundancy since 2014. And the construction and services sectors suffered due to this also. So everybody has suffered either directly or indirectly. Then this bloke gets 200k grant from the council, raises Tx prices and gives himself a rise. To run a charity? To what claims to help children transition from kids to adults? In a city where these kids parents are struggling to find work? Crook.
What pisses me off is the disregard for those who struggle to fork out the 15ish and the fiver bus fare from outlying areas just to try something. Ive had mates honestly tell me theyd love to but cant afford to keep at it.
Not bad for him. Most Aberdonians and oil workers UK wide have had wages cut, redundancy/ threat of redundancy since 2014. And the construction and services sectors suffered due to this also. So everybody has suffered either directly or indirectly. Then this bloke gets 200k grant from the council, raises Tx prices and gives himself a rise. To run a charity? To what claims to help children transition from kids to adults? In a city where these kids parents are struggling to find work? Crook.
What pisses me off is the disregard for those who struggle to fork out the 15ish and the fiver bus fare from outlying areas just to try something. Ive had mates honestly tell me theyd love to but cant afford to keep at it.
Post edited at 00:43
In reply to mrbird:
Equal suffering required all round eh? Your post is plain scurrilous. Poverty is way more a government or council issue, than that of a multi-activity centre manager (although most managers I've known bent rules to help regulars who were struggling and nearly always did a lot for the local climbing community).
http://www.transition-extreme.com/climbing-wall-prices
These are the entry prices (again), including £5 off peak entry, standard concessions, and kids under 5 free....almost victorian in its cruelty.
PS just how much of the grant income went into building the skatepark as on the website thats where all the thanks are?
Equal suffering required all round eh? Your post is plain scurrilous. Poverty is way more a government or council issue, than that of a multi-activity centre manager (although most managers I've known bent rules to help regulars who were struggling and nearly always did a lot for the local climbing community).
http://www.transition-extreme.com/climbing-wall-prices
These are the entry prices (again), including £5 off peak entry, standard concessions, and kids under 5 free....almost victorian in its cruelty.
PS just how much of the grant income went into building the skatepark as on the website thats where all the thanks are?
Post edited at 09:49
In reply to JLS:
Aye, it’s also interesting when you look at their employment cost figures; £564k for 60 heads. less the CEO gives £494k total employment costs for 59 people... so that averages <7k each salary... so a lot of part timers and quite a differential to the CEO if those figures are right...
> >"70k for CEO sounds like a hell of a lot!"
> I'm guessing 15k of that is employer's national insurance and pension contributions leaving around 55k salary.
Aye, it’s also interesting when you look at their employment cost figures; £564k for 60 heads. less the CEO gives £494k total employment costs for 59 people... so that averages <7k each salary... so a lot of part timers and quite a differential to the CEO if those figures are right...
In reply to mrbird:
Even if you were to reduce the CEOs package by 10-15k, on the face of it, the council would still be subsidising the entry fees to the tune of 190k p.a. Unless, within the accounts, there are more subtle ways it which the management are mis-using the council funding, perhaps you should be congratulating them for engineering such a generous subsidy for your climbing...
Even if you were to reduce the CEOs package by 10-15k, on the face of it, the council would still be subsidising the entry fees to the tune of 190k p.a. Unless, within the accounts, there are more subtle ways it which the management are mis-using the council funding, perhaps you should be congratulating them for engineering such a generous subsidy for your climbing...
In reply to mal_meech:
>"quite a differential"
Without pro rata-ing up the part-time hours worked, you are comparing apples with oranges. Obviously, the salary of someone who only does 4hrs on a Wednesday isn't going to compare well against a full time CEO.
>"quite a differential"
Without pro rata-ing up the part-time hours worked, you are comparing apples with oranges. Obviously, the salary of someone who only does 4hrs on a Wednesday isn't going to compare well against a full time CEO.
In reply to JLS:
The 200k was a one off payment in 2016, there is no payment shown for 2017 in the accounts.
There does seem to be a ~£100k+ annual shortfall of receipts vs costs though...
The 200k was a one off payment in 2016, there is no payment shown for 2017 in the accounts.
There does seem to be a ~£100k+ annual shortfall of receipts vs costs though...
In reply to mal_meech:
I didn't realise the 200k was a one off. The place might be closing down this year then. Expensive entry fees solved.
I didn't realise the 200k was a one off. The place might be closing down this year then. Expensive entry fees solved.
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In reply to Offwidth:
Tranny has been open for over 10years, and has had a skate park for all of that time. The grant money only appears in 2016.
It sometimes seems the skate park is the managment main focus for the kids groups / charity events. The average ages between the two sides of the centre are quite different...
> PS just how much of the grant income went into building the skatepark as on the website thats where all the thanks are?
Tranny has been open for over 10years, and has had a skate park for all of that time. The grant money only appears in 2016.
It sometimes seems the skate park is the managment main focus for the kids groups / charity events. The average ages between the two sides of the centre are quite different...
1
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