UKC

A new thread is posted each week on Sunday for anyone to jot down their previous week's activity. UKC fit club is a rich community with posters sharing their goals, noting successes and failures and offering support to those struggling to maintain motivation. Anyone interested in starting is very welcome to join, but to get the most of UKC fit club you should aim to post each week, every week, however little or much you have done. By making such a regular public record of your activities and by restating your goals every week this new habit will hopefully improve your training habits and drive you towards achieving your goals whatever the level of your chosen activity.

The following training article by Alex Barrows gives an excellent breakdown on training the four main "energy systems" specific to climbing:- http://alexbarrowsclimbing.blogspot.co.uk/2014/02/training-for-sport-climbi...     also this - https://www.instagram.com/p/CEGfCg7DbkK/?igshid=4a1o55jwpus2

For those wanting to find out more about training for climbing a number of physical training articles are linked here:- http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=274502

And for those looking for more theoretical background, there's a useful subject index of published research studies on the Beta Angel project. Not sure how actively maintained if is though. https://beta-angel.com/research/research-inventory/

Last weeks post - https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/walls+training/ukc_fit_club_week_724-7307... 

Leicestershire Psyche Vid: best soundtrack of the series so far? youtube.com/watch?v=SybDzkXQlK8&

STG: weekly Fit Club stats without typos (as still not achieved last week)

AJM - well done on the sharkathon. Sounds like the last day just scraped it.

alexm198 - good luck with the race waiting list. And with sticking to the plan instead of giving in to the temptation to go fast. The big thaw-freeze cycle in the coming week might be good for those Wetterstein mixed routes on your MTG list?

Ally Smith - a benchmark named after a 19th century novel? One of Ben's then presumably - and therefore an impressive achievement. Good Shropshire esoterica tick too.

BarneyLoosemore - I'm intrigued to follow somebody's progress on a structured plan; it strikes me that that's two consecutive weeks you've mentioned either back-loading the week or skipping stuff at the end. Let's see how it goes after the deload week.

biscuit - sounds like a wise deload week, and your benchmarks & goals made interesting reading.

Liam P - "what is it with pebble huggers and dodgy techno!?" I fear it's not just the pebble wrestlers. Having joined fairly recently, you may be unfamiliar with the UKC Fit Club 2018 ARC playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1xFlbNTflMqEbiBXLiMY0R?si=FPFRVMAJRdKPDYG...

Ross Barker - "only 2x10 band pull-aparts because it snapped on set 3" oops. I'm sure making the conscious effort to work things other than just fingers will turn out to be a wise decision.

Si dH - good week indeed. "Definitely a lot of room for gains from repeaters" - I'm going to have to squarely face up to that sooner or later too.

Somerset swede basher - rock! Hurrah. And sounds like Saturday was a return to form after the mid week dip.

the sheep - good news on the throat test

Tom Green - " A pretty good week this week" certainly sounds like it. If you go on like this you'll come out of lockdown plenty strong enough for your MTG's

Tyler - little & often and getting close to last year's best sounds encouraging

AlanLittle - so that turned into a bit of an involuntary deload week - it might be a better idea to actually plan those. Could be hard to stick to in the face of lockdown tedium though.

Cheers Alan. You could package that and sell it as a ‘Now That’s What They Call Leicestershire Psych’ mixtape!

Had a decent week. Managed some one arm push-ups, finally got a (messy) L-Sit, almost there with Handstand push-ups, and got back on the Hangboard Moving Hangs.

I’m still really weak at the moving hangs and pump out really quickly. One to work on but I’ve only been training a 2 week endurance phase. I might increase this - although it may be worth waiting until we know when the lockdown will end...

Monday: Mrs had her 20 week scan. Another 20 weeks to get fit and realise some goals before life gets a little different!

Tuesday: 3x1 Offset Pulls 40/10mm (2fingers), 4x20 Offset Push-ups, 3x20 weighted crunches (12kg), 3x5mins Pike Stretch, 3x7s tuck L-sits (one leg straight)

Wednesday: Hangboard Moving Hangs 3on/3off/1.5on/3off/1on feet on a Stool & 30mm+ jugs, 3x 2.5, 0.5, 0.5 handstand pushup (head 4” off the floor), Hero stretch 3x5mins, 3x5 reverse pushups (didn’t feel any benefit from these so went back to regular back bridge)

Thursday: 3x 2, 1, 1 Offset Pulls 40/10mm (2fingers), 3x 1, 1, 1 one-arm pushups, Pike Stretch 3x5mins, 3x5s L-Sits, 3x15 Leg Raise

Friday: 5.28km in 1 hour (43lbs)

Saturday: Hangboard Moving Hangs 3on/5off/2on/5off/1.5on feet on Stool 30mm+ jugs, Hero stretch 3x5min, 3x5s Bridge (still can’t lock arms out), 3x 2.5, 2.5, 1.5 handstand pushup (head 4” from floor)

Sunday: Rest

Current weight 183.6lbs. 

Lockdown Goals

15mm edge with BW+25%

Moving Hangs - 10on 10off endurance hangs feet on stool.

One arm pull-up

handstand pushup

back bridge (Done)

L Sit (Done)

One arm Push-ups (Done)

70lbs for 3 hours

Pike and Reclining Hero

182lbs

Have a good week!

Thanks Alan. Yes, it was! This week has been a bit of a struggle too. Our lockdown lifestyle isn’t wholly sustainable - we stay on top of things, but by way of an example our tidying and cleaning is to get back to “tolerable” rather than “deep cleaned”. But most weeks it feels like it’s sustainable enough to last until an easing. This week hasn’t been one of those! Been feeling very tired, been needing too much coffee to function, feeling stretched quite thin. Many others have it worse - I can’t fathom how my work colleagues who are equally as busy as me but have to contend with home schooling are coping, let alone those folk on the front line in hospitals and other places - so it’s more a statement than a complaint, but nevertheless this week has been a struggle.

Trying to view the end result with a glass half full mindset, I did some decent weighted pull-ups, a half decent pushing session and 2 reasonable to decent fingerboard sessions. That’s not actually too bad.

Monday - achey muscles and busy at work, when I finished work at last I decided after 32 days (loosely!) “on” that I could justify a night off.

Tuesday - another busy day, but I snuck some planche attempts, some pushups, some lsits and some tuck front lever holds in after finally finishing. Actually a fairly decent workout in the end

Wednesday - achey. I feel like evening training has the disadvantage of being distanced from food intake which I assume is not good as far as recovery goes. A very hectic day at work but the first key deadline completed which is good. Decided to chill with tv in the evening.

Thursday - feeling absolutely wiped first thing. Not sure what’s up with this week but it’s not good. Dragged myself to the fingerboard before work. A surprisingly good session on the slopers, although I’m still unsure how much of this is just knack (I.e. whether they’re something you can really train systematically on a fingerboard). Did some hangs on the 10mm edges but these felt quite pingy for some reason so the session was no great shakes. Also went for about a half hour stroll with microAJM in her rucksack.

Friday - weighted pull-ups @92.5kg. Feeling a bit achey even to start. 5, 5, 5, 5, 5. If I’m honest, a bit scrappy still. Maybe a fully rested go would feel a bit better, not sure. Maybe I’m just through the easy recruitment/easing in gains and hitting the bit where gains will be slower.

Saturday - nearly 7km of walking with microAJM in the rucksack over 2 trips - one to the shops and a brisker one wading/walking round the park with miniAJM on his bike.

Sunday - a better nights sleep and a better day. Another 3.5km or something with microAJM in the rucksack in the morning and another 2km with both kids in the afternoon. In the middle a fingerboard session. Tried half crimp, slopers and front 2 pockets (I did a little on mid 2 but not really a focus). Was nice to confirm an absolute weight for the front 2 hangs which had previously been an “unknown bodyweight plus” benchmark. Decent on the sloper again, a little better on the half crimp than earlier in the week.

Yeah, getting grim isn't it? I've largely avoided the home schooling stress too, my 17yo is fairly self sufficient on that score - although getting worried about the effect on his future of the school he's missing. I can do my job reasonably effectively from home - and some of what I do is related to telecommunications network reliability so I actually feel useful too. 

Nevertheless - every day the same as every other day and no sign of an end to it is getting hard.

STG: Weight back below 85kg - eat when hungry not when bored. Start Couch To 5k.
MTG: Go climbing after lockdown? Get vaccinated before I get infected. 
LTG: Be a confident, well rounded low to mid 7's sport climber by 2021. For measurable definition see Fit Club 658

M: 20 minutes stretching - start of Flexible February! Plus a few long light tendon density hangs.
T: Repeaters, weighted pull-ups & assisted one-arm scap pull-ups, l-sits,  calf raises
W: 
T: Max hangs, weighted pull-ups & assisted one-arm scap pull-ups, l-sits
F: 45 minutes bike ride, half an hour stretching

S: Hillwalking with my son, Estergebirge. Still plenty of snow lying above about a thousand metres, but in a soft thawing state making for very strenuous going.
    Meanwhile, in the north German flatlands, a huge cold snap and the biggest blizzard in years. A tragic waste of perfectly good snow!

S:  Stiff legs! Did the silly "9c test", which turns out to be not so silly: a total score of 15 points puts me at low 7b+. Which might indeed be realistic if I could actually (a) go climbing and (b) find the right one to project. 

Max hang: 133% 4 points. 
Max pull-up: 126% 3 points
Hanging l-sit 20 seconds: 6 points (overperformed)
Max duration bodyweight hang: 65 seconds 2 points (underperformed)

The max hang is a PB *and* was a lattice-standard 7 seconds whereas this test is actually supposed to be 5 seconds. Don't think that would have made enough difference to get me to 140% and another point though.

Let's face it, lockdown isn't going to end next week. 
 

Thanks Alan. It's always interesting to see what others are up to. That's half the joy of this thread. The other half is asking for and getting advice, or being set examples. These examples are not always good, but can serve as a great reminder that we're all just normal people trying our best in a very hard time. When they are good it's not boasting, it just shows you what you can achieve when you're organised AND the stars align. Prior to 2020 i'd spent 4 years desperately trying to maintain what i had physically. I was so busy even that felt like a massive fight. At one point i was a single parent to two kids with special needs, had a full time job and was studying 'full time'. I am now in a great place as far as training and time are concerned. So i am making the most of it. These things go in cycles.

So for those stuck in a horrible place atm it won't be for ever. Keep doing what you can because it keeps you sane and it will count when this all blows over.

Got the garage all sorted now but we’re still waiting for a delivery of holds to finish it off. Bit frustrating, but we had our first proper Sunday morning session on it today. It seems to fit the bill nicely. We can get circuits on it (14 move circuit with good/bad feet options and doubling up to 28 moves etc) and moves that are too hard to do at the moment so all good.

M – Varied grips max hangs (CRIMPd) – good to change it up. Had DOMS for 3 days.

T – Work – box splits mobility

W – Work – box splits mobility

T – Strength A – 1 arm locks, ring plank iso's, hamstring walk outs, pistol squats – made my left knee hurt so sacked them off , skipped core (i am terrible at doing core) and went on the board – circuits.

F – Circuits on the board again. Working out combo’s of circuits for An Cap and Aero Pow work. Upper and lower body mobility

S – Pinch max hangs. Strength B – 1 arm locks, ring dips, copenhagens, overhead squat, hard style plank.

Board again – setting more than climbing

S – Morning board session that we have already decided will be a regular thing. Coffee, tunes, warm garage, what's not to like.

Setting problems from easy to projects. Loved it!

This next week I need to plan my sessions a bit smarter. I’ve been a bit giddy and distracted with the board, which is totally fine but I need to watch the increase in load the board will bring.

My plan for power (prior to lockdown) was to start some controlled campussing. That can’t happen so I may do power pulls instead. I can go hard Sat, Sun and Mon as I always have Tues and Wed off and the board stuff certainly covers power. But I may do some movement work – balance/coordination challenges, bounding, drop jumps, reactive work etc. I am just not athletic anymore. I am pulling as hard as i ever did but i still make groaning noises when i get out of a chair.

My plan is:

M – Max pinches. Board – circuits or problems depending on fatigue.

T – Rest – box splits mobility work

W – Rest – box splits mobility work

T – Max Varied Hangs. Strength A. Board - power

F – Rest – full body mobility work

S – Str B. Power pulls. Movement. Circuits.

S – Board - power

Hi Alan, yes the freeze-thaw does look promising. The main obstacle to those routes is the current curfew. Difficult to envisage how to climb 1200m of mixed when you can't leave the apartment until 5am and you have to be locked away again by 9pm! For the Zugspitze it might just be doable (the route is mainly quite low difficulty), but the Schneefernerkopf would probably involve a bivi on the face. 

Week 10:

OK week. I was definitely successful in not succumbing to the temptation to go fast: I think it's easier to resist pushing yourself when you know you still have many runs to grind out later in the week. Now that I'm hitting the bigger mileages I think I need to be taking sleep and recovery more seriously, as there increasingly little margin for burning the candle at both ends. Missed both core sessions with no good excuse; only did 1 shin prehab. Need to be more discipline with these! If you feel you really want the rest days to be rest, then you'll need to suck it up and do the core work on a running day.

M Rest.

T 11.50km Z1.

W 8.29km Z1.

T 10.90km with 15 mins speedwork. 5x sprint repeats up a nearby hill. Shin prehab.

F Rest.

S 26.45km Z1. Not too bad, felt fairly chilled although my knees started seizing up around kilometre 20. Stopped and stretched them out a bit and they calmed down. Possibly from Thursday? Peanut butter cookies were a good food option, probably more than the granola. 

S 6.88km Z1. Shin prehab. Had been thinking about going climbing but hugely warm. 

Last week's goals:

• 64.3km running [Tick]
• 2 core routine [-]
• 3 shin prehab [2/3]
• 1 day climbing if circumstances permit [-]

Goals:

STG (This Week)

• 68km running
• 2 core routine (do them!)
• 3 shin prehab
• Isidor-Hacker-Gedenkweg on the Aggenstein?

MTG (End of June 2021)

• Finish the Zugspitz Ultratrail
• Himmel und Hölle on the Zugspitze Nordwand
• Optimism on the Schneefernerkopf Westwand
• The 1938 Route (ED2) if the borders are open and partners can travel

LTG (End of 2021)

• Himalaya Expedition (or plan B)

Thanks Alan. Next repeaters session due tomorrow...

M: did an AJM and didn't get around to training until very late (830pm start for me - I can't imagine starting an hour later!) Managed to have a reasonable short board session working on a project and then did 3x5 pull-ups with bodyweight +23kg.

T: Hip mobility routine then a crimpd app 'floor core' routine. I found this surprisingly hard, obviously haven't worked my abs for a long time (the only core work I've really been doing is some TRX work and just recently the L-sits.)

W: 6 * 30 second scap pull-up exercises on an incut edge. With bodyweight + 12.5kg. I felt tired so dialled the weight down a bit. DOMS in my abs.

T: rest. Still got DOMS in my abs - what's that all about!?

F: I had a board 10 session in the plan but decided to take an extra day rest as my fingers had felt like they needed it earlier in the week.

S: board 10 session, ie five easier problems and five harder ones with no more than 3-4 attempts at each. Could still feel my abs aching at times, although much more mildly now. Didn't feel as strong as on the last one of these sessions I did, but did manage to retroflash a 7A that I haven't done for a few months and remember feeling quite hard (ie it took me a couple of sessions to put up), so that was good. Did two other 7As, failed on one 7A and a 7A+. Finished off with three sets of scap pull-ups at bodyweight on the incut edge.

S: hip mobility routine and 3*10 second L-sits.

Not a bad week, I got all sessions done albeit with one extra rest day. I didn't feel as strong as last week and am wondering whether two board sessions in every 8 day cycle would be better replaced by one board session and one extra session of scap pull-ups or normal weighted pull-ups instead. I will probably stick with the plan this coming week, then after that have a deload week and decide what next based on how I feel at the end of this coming week.

Si

What's 70lbs for 3 hrs? 

Good point, hadn't thought of that. Maybe go on the train so the Polizei don't see your car parked overnight? And be careful not to stray across the border on the summit.

Yeah. Psychologically I’m finding lockdown #3 the toughest. Working from home is fine for me - but grim winter weather and the inability to go anywhere make me feel rather cooped up, and also I feel a bit like being limited to shorter trips out of the house also hinders our ability to actually get things done at home (it’s nearly impossible to get anything done when they are both there!), which in itself makes the whole thing feel more trying because it exacerbates the feeling of just treading water.

Thanks Alan

M: Home S&C. Pull-ups, press-ups, bicep curls, squats, shoulder press. 
T: Slow run to test calf recover. Thought it was ok but 3km in it flared up. Possibly some yoga

W: Probably some yoga

T: Outhouse, new PBs on red and orange

F: Nothing

S: Nothing

S: Outhouse, not as good as Thur. 2x yoga

Pretty good week except for calf relapse, will try again tomorrow. Been pretty consistent with shoulder presses most days. Settled on a 20 min yoga session on YouTube which I like but my mentality is still that it’s a chore which I’d like to change as it’s really not!

I was going to not focus on weight loss but weighed myself on two consecutive days and I’m heavier than ever so probably ought to think about it. 
 

Sharkathon made me do it. Usually I’d have gone straight to bed!

Sorry, copied and pasted it from my notes without editing it!

I’ve been doing a weekly weighted walk. Was maxing out at carrying 60lbs of kit for 7/8km in 90mins so looking to up the weight, distance and duration.

The only bad thing is it’s pretty flat in my local area so I get next to zero vertical gain.

Ooph! that sounds tough. 

You're pretty strong in pushing movements!

If you are keen it's still very possible to train and climb with a baby, you just need to accept your time or energy will sometimes be limited more than you like and sometimes you only find that out on the day. At first you'll spend lots of time being really tired and eating to stay awake late at night doing parenting (well, I did) but it'll get better.

The biggest mistake I made at the stage you are at is that I lost motivation and didn't train or look after my diet much for the last few months leading up to my son being born, which meant the hump I had to overcome to get back to my previous level at a later date was much bigger than it would have been if I had still been in really good shape the day before he was born.

I just need to find a route with a series of consecutive mantles on it! Pull strength is slowly catching up but forearm endurance is my major weakness.

Very jealous of the garage wall. What does the power pull routine entail?

Hi clubland. Thanks Alan for more quality statting. Also a special thanks for unearthing that playlist... I’d forgotten we did that! Absolute bangers!!
 

After last week’s good times, this week couldn’t have been much crappier...

Week 5:

M: C

T: O

W: V

T: I

F: D

S: 1

S: 9

Week 6:

Recover and ease back in to prehab and maybe a bit of light training.

STG (End Q1):

Max Hang total 79kg

Weighted Pull-up total 83kg

Jug circuit 5-on, 3-off

Board Problem 'GTH'

Curfew (6b+)

Run average 25km/week and Edale Skyline

MTG (End Q2):

Max Hang total 84kg

Weighted Pull-up total 88kg

Jug circuit 10-on, 10-off

Board Problem 'Le Grimpeur' (Tick!)

Eliminator (V4)

Grid Iron (6c)

Black Wall (E1 5b)

Run average 35km/week and Cheshire Gritstone Trail

LTG (End Q3):

Yates' Layaway (f6B+) 

Jack the Smuggler (7a)

Black Wall Direct (E2 5c)

Cairngorm Classic Rock IAD, El Cap nose-day (880m climbing) and Welsh 3000s

2021 Goals:

35 E-points

Run 30km vert and 1000km 

Oh bugger. Best wishes for your recovery 

That’s good to know.

Did you notice any effect on your mental fitness? I consider myself a safe climber and have backed off countless routes if conditions weren’t right. However, my wishlist seems to grow each year and I’m wondering if a mini-me will realign my psych levels. Pre-lockdown I was training weekly for a big wall but I’m not sure how baby-back-home+exposure will affect my head game. Suppose the same applies for any hobby with an associated risk (parachuting, motorcross racing, cave diving etc)

I can't give you a good answer as I've done no significant trad climbing since 3-4 years before he was born. Some of the other guys on here are a bit better placed. It definitely changes your perspective on things though!

Thanks Alan. I think I’ve got away quite lightly in the grand scheme of things, although I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t slightly  stressed about the possibility of more long term effects. 
It’s actually felt pretty similar to being at altitude -the headaches, nausea and shortness of breath! I’m hoping it means I’m going to be well acclimatised by the time it’s over!

One of my few trad ventures of recent years consisted of going up to the hard(ish) bit on California Arete, thinking „this is no place for someone with parental responsibilities“, and going back down again. Twice.

Cheers Alan, yeah it was really nice to be out. 

Mon. Burbage session. Did In the Flick of Time Stand-start (f7B) and Definitive 5.12 (f6C). Did the moves on the harder exit too but ran out of beans to put it together from the start. Keen to take a look at the sit start to flick of time next time. 

Tues. 12km run. 

Wed. Rest.

Thurs. 6x Max hangs +30kg. 5x5 pull ups +12kg (still really struggle by the last set). 3x 10mins on 10mins off in the attic. Bit of a disaster when I tried to traverse round the velux window using the edge of the board. It's a really sharp edge and I tweaked something in both the middle fingers on my left hand. They will be fine but are going to need a rest. 3x10 press ups.

Fri. 42km with 700m ascent on the roadbike. 

Sat. Rest, 4mile walk with the kids. 

Sun. Skipped repeaters this week so the bruised fingers can recover. Variety of crimpd app workouts: on the min pulls, compression and tension. 

Best wishes for a quick recovery and minimal long-term effects! I found my general fitness (not that I do anything more than lug a few pads up a hill...) was quite poor post-contraction. Even the approach at Ramshaw got me out of breath!

Not intending to make you worry, and don't feel bad about doing little, it's a shit time if you have any symptoms, just because others have it worse doesn't make your pain any less valid.

Congratulations!

Just in terms of things to think about - strength training is remarkably time efficient, and usually the long term limiting factor. Some things - aerobic training on a foot on campus style setup - are also really good bang per buck. I managed quite a lot of quality training when my son was little - there's not much else to do and they sleep a lot - in a couple of hours a week. 

In terms of head game - hard for me to say. In my early 20s I was quite bold and weak - I used to push my grade on bold slabs. Eventually I discovered base fitness training and steeper better protected routes. So I suppose my transition was probably before having children rather than after. I'm rubbish at soloing and it's been a while since I've properly fallen on trad but I think the latter is something that I could get back into the practice of if I wanted to. But I'm also not really inspired by big runouts or reliance on single crucial pieces of gear that much any more, so I definitely pick my battles. I've managed to get back to the same trad level as before, if that means anything...

Thanks Alan, yes, here's hoping to a strong mind, fingers and body post-lockdown!

I feel like I really cocked my scheduling this week and ended up doing less stretching and antagonist work than intended, but not too bad a week by the end of it. Also forgot to do any core, but secretly I don't mind because core work is grim.

Last Week:

M - Forgot everything, whoops! Rest

T - 3x10 pushups, 3x10 incline pushups (last rep of last set was hard! Should get me strong). 4x35s density hangs -9kg, 3 min rest, actually completed 4th set this time! Another session of that to make sure it's not a fluke and I will decrease to -7kg but 30s. Box split and hamstring stretches to finish.

W - Rest

T - Box split and hamstring stretches

F - Many sets of 5 pull-ups progressing to +10kg, didn't feel up to doing all 5 sets at that weight. 5x10s max hangs +12kg. Felt a ring finger A2 tweak when finishing set 5, while resting for set 6 I concluded that 5 sets is near enough done and I'd rather not do a 6th to get injured. Reverse wrist curls to finish.

S - Rest

S - 3x5 pull-ups +10kg. Couldn't be bothered to do the extra 2 sets, this seems to be a pattern so next time I'll commit to all 5. 4x35s density hangs -9kg. Set 4 failed on 30s, possibly still tired from Friday, or maybe just general variance. Not fussed either way, got well worked. Reverse wrist curls to finish.

Next Week:

M - Antagonists, stretching

T - Rest

W - Max hangs +14kg, 5x5s, core, stretching

T - Antagonists

F - Density hangs, stretching

S - Core, 5x5s

S - Antagonists, stretching

Goals:

Don't get injured

Suavito (on hold)

Tierdrop (on hold)

Rigpa (going rather well for something hard)

Thanks mate -appreciate that. I guess I just need to take it as it comes and not worry about the uncontrollables!

Has anyone else noticed the recurring theme this week? (and lots of other weeks!)

I'm glad it's not just me who finds core work too damn boring to do! But equally when I DO do it I notice pretty decent gains (across climbing, running, fewer bad backs, etc) so I know it is worth sucking up the tedium of it!

Maybe we need a 'core club' or a FitClub core goal starting up?! Or maybe we just need to emulate the couple of members who seems to love the core?!

I suppose the first question is “what is ‘core’ training good for?”

i guess I’ve yet to be convinced that high volume sit ups, crunches etc are that transferable for most climbing, which certainly from my perspective is why I rarely bother even pretending I’m going to do them.

- Most of the time you want to keep your feet on in the first place, which is not driven through the abs?

- unless you’re training for something with fairly aerobic core requirements (long stacking offwidths where you have to use core to move the hands up?), why such high reps?

im being a bit devils advocate, in that there is obviously some degree of relevance, but thought I’d throw the question out there!

Glad to hear that you feel you have not had it bad, all the best for a speedy recovery and hopefully back up to full fitness in no time!

Good week - little 'un has been sleeping better.

Need to fit in some aero-cap soon or I'll be very unbalanced come sport season.

Week 5

M – Board warm-up; 7x 6B+ then 3x 6C+ and 3x 7A, all flashed. Should have heeded the warning signs that my core/legs were not firing right when I had foot slips on the easy problems. Couldn’t decide if it was due to:

Late/post dinner session

Rowing/biking the day before (1st time in 5 weeks doing anything much with my legs)

Anyhow, attempts at 7B/+ problems were atrocious, so decided to do some hangs instead. Fingers feeling strong!

Max-hangs: 1-arm minus 10kg. Felt really steady.

Decided to test the 6mm edges – smashed out 4 pull-ups with ease, so went straight in at BW+10kg for the Crimpd “Small Edge” session, a PB by +5kg! (Only the very last hang felt like I had to try hard)

T – Unexpected short window – grabbed opportunity for board session. Normal warm-up (core working again!) then Crimpd 6x6 an-cap with 7A+/B problems. Felt good. Might need to include some more fingery options instead of shoulder things for future sessions. 4x12 wrist extensors with 7kg.

W – Day off work. Dry (ish) and mild (ish) so time for first ride of 2021: 70min, 28km flat. Tired legs later!

T – Sweet FA.

F – Short board session squeezed in while dinner was in the oven; warmed-up, flashed a 7B+ benchmark (oooooush!) then dinner was ready. 3hrs later when sproggle was asleep; 1-arm max-hangs (BW-9kg L, BW-12kg R - finger split) and max-pinch lifts @18.5kg

S – Another late one; started session at 2120. Warm-up, tickled a couple of projects (same as Monday – after dinner shit body tension in scrunched up position with full belly) then An-cap triples using fingery yellow 7A+ problems.  Skin a bit trashed.

S – 80min 32km ride inc Alderly edge hill-climb.

Yes! This is the kind of justification for sacking core off that I'm after! Keep it coming!

More seriously, there are some specific things that motivated me to start doing more core work, but I don't know whether they were right... 

Firstly I was fed up of getting a sore back after long climbs with a bag (alpine or scottish winter) and even after longer runs.

Secondly I got on Melvyn Bragg (f7B) and realised it was a struggle getting out of the invert with my weak core!

Thirdly, I felt like it would help with steeper dry-tooling (part of my everlasting campaign to get up Jaz!) although core probably isn't my limiting factor for this.

I feel like doing consistent core workouts for a reasonable period of time helped with 1 (though 2 and 3 not so much!)

I guess it's worth talking about what core workouts actually consist of? I suspect endless situps aren't necessarily that useful, but a selection of more rounded exercises (not neglecting leg raise type movements) may be? 

Cheers Alan, love the little video of the Croft boulder. It my next door village and daftly havnt visited the crag for years. Would be tricky at the mo as the area has been repeatedly flooded so conditions under foot would be a tad squelchy!

Been a mixed up week, a bit of a niggle in my knee following the previous weeks running so I dusted off the bike for some low impact cardio. I made it out Tuesday and Friday lunchtime for a couple of lovely short rides, both around the 20km distance. I needed to be onsite to sort out some lab issues the rest of the week which cut down on the opportunity to get out.

Saturday was my wife's turn to take on her run club fast 5k challenge. She wanted to get sub 30 minutes and asked me to pace her (usually a pre cursor to raised voices    ) however she smashed her goal and put in a 28.30

Sunday, another gentle run, 6.5km on a very cold morning.

Core endurance has its place but my thinking has shifted away from this to core strength. When you're climbing on in a wide position and need to take a foot or a hand off you need to stop your bum sagging and pulling you off. A lot of what we do in climbing with our core is anti, not positive. We fight against gravity. I reckon we can all pull our knees up to our chest or reach up high and across ourselves.

Have a google for anti rotational core exercises and think high intensity static holds. You should feel like you're doing a heavy deadlift - cheeks bulging, eyes closed, red face.

In fact don't forget that everytime you climb you're working your climbing specific core and heavy compound exercises like deadlifts are great core exercises too.

But this is also different from getting a robust back that doesn't get sore from a big walk in with a full rack.

Agree with a lot of those points - yes absolutely it's relevant what a "core" session consists of, and definitely invert offwidths strike me as a reasonable use case!

Biscuit there was a Lattice video a while back focusing on harder core exercises so more strength based, which I looked at, thought "that looks interesting, I should try that" before promptly trying it once and never doing it again. Should maybe revisit it!

And yes if I had the weights I would try deadlifts probably. I know Steven Low was recommending reverse hyperextensions (presumably weighted?) as good relevant stuff - that's something which has been vaguely on my list for a while...

Thanks. The good news is my ‘full fitness’ won’t take much getting back to! ;-D 

Cheers Alan, yeah you're right to pick up on the consecutive weeks of backloading/missed sessions! In the context of the block, niggle & my training history I don't think it's too bad though - either way, my next block has more of an emphasis on intensity rather than volume which should be better.

M - rest, stretches

T - 5k Z1/Z2 - felt good. Stretches

W - 10 on 10 off aero-cap/ARC (fwiw, 1 hour of feet on floor board lapping out in the cold is not fun!) followed by some aero-pow

T - Floor core, weighted pull ups (5x6 115% BW)

F - Shoulder stability/prehab

S - Wrist curls, then 30s density hangs x 6, which are replacing max-hangs for the foreseeable future due to the niggle + for structural purposes. A light 4k run in the eve

S - Some push-up variations, followed by one-legged front-lever holds. Still a while away from full FL, but can hold these with decent form for 10s+ which is nice

Cheers.

I suppose lockdown training has been good preparation for getting a home routine sorted. I think I’m just going through the transition to steep, safe and pumpy. My endurance is still dire but like you said, it’s pretty easy to get a good training response from feet-on campusing.

Agree with all the core training comments! It bores me to death. Tried to spice it up with L-Sits and Back Bridges but they’re even getting tiresome. I went through a period of doing sets of ‘windscreen wipers’ which were effective and fun to train but I don’t have the space for them at the minute.

Fitclub Core Circuit with an associated soundtrack!?

I know you know your stuff, but 4 board sessions in a week is a lot, especially late when tired. Don't do what I did last year and get too enthusiastic with it leading to finger injury...

Re: core training - I agree that core endurance isn't necessary in a similar way to fingers/forearms. However I do think session stamina (for want of a better term) is important. It's very rare I find a problem I simply can't do because my core is too weak, but it's not uncommon to find it gets harder very quickly as my core gets more tired. I think core-y problems on steep ground often tire out your core and shoulders faster than they do fingers. Same would go for very overhanging routes.

The other issue is that there are lots of different types of core strength. For a couple of years I've been doing a series of exercises on the TRX fairly regularly that work shoulders and core strength of the type I think Biscuit describes, ie holding a stable position - reverse flies, IYWs in particular. Years ago I was brilliant at crunches because as a teenager/early 20s I wanted a six pack, now it turns out that in that sort of exercise I have become quite weak; TRX work has done very little to maintain it. I think it's quite important to be more rounded as an athlete rather than getting imbalanced, particularly in the core.  The Lattice floor core routine works the front of the core much more (the Superman exercise providing a bit of crossover to what I do on the TRX) - and my main reason for doing it was to get more rounded again. If I was to choose a single core routine to do to be as climbing specific as possible, that definitely wouldn't be it.

I've not done much core so I'll just be absorbing all the information and opinions shared, but I will add that I've always had the view that climbing on steep terrain should be enough core workout for most climbers (assuming reliable/regular access to said terrain, of course). What are your thoughts on this?

Agree about the whole thing of finding it harder to "stay tight" as the chain tires over a session. Because it's a whole chain thing (i.e. it's about the link between fingers and feet) it's probably tough to isolate the exact point of failure without video or something but yeah some exercises that focus on tension across the body feel relevant in that context and then something more specific if you can isolate the weak link.

Agree 100%. I have been on the receiving end of many arguments that lumping together everything that isn't either a part of your arms/legs or perhaps a direct driver of them (i.e shoulders) into one amorphous blob of "core" isn't very helpful because it is very generic and also masks a lot of potentially helpful distinctions in terms of what you might want to train (anterior/posterior and open/closed chain being obvious variables that spring to mind, plus I think it can sometimes cause us to forget the sort of strength Vs endurance dimension that you might apply to training other muscles - the old 50 sit-ups thing that was my entry to this discussion).

I think the problem with that is you sort of waste training time. If I'm climbing hard stuff on steep ground (if it isn't hard you won't be working your core much, as it'll be easy to pull through anyway) then I can only do two-three sessions per week without risking injury. I could easily do extra core sessions on a different day though.

The other issue is specificity. The type of core strength you need on a steep wall or board (tension, wide shoulders, toeing down etc) is quite different from that needed for a grit or font prow (high heels, compression etc.) Unless you have your own mega wall it will be hard to find enough opportunity to train all of this regularly, especially in lockdown.

I need some of this in my life - hoping the psyche tune mix Alan reminded us of in the stats will come in handy to stave off boredom

Well spotted: In my defence, those sessions have all been sub 90min and mostly ~60min so there isn't a huge total volume compared to what I might do in a similar week last year where a big cave session could easily have a solid 3hrs at comparable intensity a a board session. 

Interestingly, it seems like I've been able to cope with the board sessions having dropped lots of other training stimulus in the recent weeks and it was adding back in biking last week that left me most tired and achy. 

Skin is going to be the limiting factor this week so no where near that volume / intensity planned.

Just remembered about this. 
 

I do 5x5 pull ups with all the intent and purpose being put into the pull. So i really stop and set prior to each one and imagine trying to shoot up through the roof.

I also do it stood in a light theraband. Lots of physiological reasons why but also because I will noticeably tail off before the end if I don’t. 

There are some who measure the velocity with expensive machines and some who have read the research that shows people are well able to tell when their velocity has significantly dropped. 

I would probably agree with the consensus that high volume core work isn't necessarily super useful from a climbing perspective, but anecdotally I've found doing max strength-focused core work to be really beneficial. 

One caveat though is I don't really do any sport/bouldering, but having a solid core is pretty essential on ice when you're swinging one point wildly while trying to keep the other three plugged in. Same goes for tenuous mixed when body tension is the difference between staying on and winging off, and maybe the same goes for sport-style mixed but I've always been too weak for that.

I think one of the reasons I am lacking motivation for core at the moment is all the gyms are shut and in a home-workout setting I don't have the means to do a max-strength core workout, so it's lots of situps or nothing. Since these (a) take substantially longer than a few sets of 10 with a 25kg plate and (b) don't seem to be as useful, it's a bit easier to sack them off!

Once you're in the zone it's not so bad! Also means you're doubly psyched for limit sessions, at least in my case hah

In fairness, there are some BW core exercises that are pretty close to "max-strength" in nature (for me at least) - plank walkouts, L-sits, controlled V-ups (esp with a little added weight). I guess this depends on your existing level of core strength though!

Yeah you're absolutely right, but please stop taking my excuses away!

I tried editing my response yesterday for typos and a bit more clarity but it timed out.

The key component I took from this was the "especially late when tired" - that's the crucial bit I need to watch out for, so thanks for the catch :-D

(and with that in mind skipped yesterdays late night board session and poured a second glass of wine)

While we’re on the subject.....

“ 3hrs at comparable intensity a a board session. “

You don’t rest more when projecting or working problems outside than when training? I often don’t either but then I am lazy with an unfortunate smart phone addiction!

Two-fold;

1) I try and rest between problems indoors rather than smash, smash, smash. This often involves spamming a fellow moonboard user in Wiltshire.

2) I get carried away outdoors and don't rest enough unless I'm in proper project mode. This often involves completely ignoring my phone for hours on end, losing all track of time and rightfully receiving an earful upon arriving home late...

again...