you were obviously emotionally attached to the effort and work you put it in. I agree the wall was useful for introducing climbing to kids (though far from perfect), but I personally did find it to be the worst wall I have ever visited as the place was very drab. the ropes are 18mm thick which was a concern going over the overhanging wall, which is far from being unsurpassed! have you been to another wall recently? e.g. glasgow and alien are chocablock because they provide good climbing facilities in a good environment. however McCabe did state that it will still be missed! nonetheless it is pretty hard these days not to have a climbing wall which isn't a success! so perhaps you should keep the holds and panels and seek somewhere else within the locality which is desperate for a decent indoor climbing facility similar to the above two but central. there is a demand!

I'm not sure what you believe it should tell us. It seems fairly standard practise for commercial recreational facilities to be cheaper outside peak hours. Most health clubs, gyms and swimming pools operate that way. Alien Rock is busy and sometimes dare I say it overcrowded at peak periods. I don't think I ever saw more than half a dozen pairs of climbers outside of the beginner's area at Hadrian's Wall, despite the size of the place - and the fact that for many AR users eg those coming from the south side of Edinburgh, it's as easy to get to Falkirk as it is to Leith. What does that tell you? I do think the loss of Hadrian's Wall is a shame - I'd love to have a realistic alternative to AR, and I'm not convinced that Ratho is going to be that. However I also think that the lack of development of HW while it was operating was a shame. You have indicated that there were insurmountable reasons for that lack of investment, but it was still a shame, and I think it was one of the reasons it didn't get the traffic it might have done. And if, as Eric9Points suggests, the original proprietor set the place going on the wrong footing then that's even more of a shame. There's no doubt in my mind that the staff at HW are/were friendly, enthusiastic and committed to making the best of the place within the constraints you've outlined. Now that Ratho is actively recruiting, perhaps we can hope to see some of the HW staff taking those qualities there?

I don't think I said anything in the original post that was "verbal diarrhoea" or which justifies you describing me as an "edgit". I have taken dozens (Hundreds?) of kids to Hadrian's over the years since it opened to introduce them to climbing, and have always found Olga, Paul and Elaine pleasant and helpful. Rather than snarling at one another, central belt climbers should get their act together and become involved in building a new, and better wall. Cheers Ian

Olga, I've always thought the beginners' room was a really good facility, most particularly because it gave the opportunity to integrate the belaying and "multi-pitch" skills necessary in outdoor climbing into what novices were learning. On reflection the tone of my initial posting may have been too flippant. I apologise if it caused you personal offence: as I wrote in the post to Eddie, I have had nothing but encouragement and support from you and the other staff. I hope things pan out well for you. Cheers Ian