UKC

The first image below shows a marked footpath passing the Cairn and the descent route from Atkinson Pike / Blencathra down to below Skiddaw House. This is from the OS Online mapping resource at GPS Training. 

In the second image, the cairn is there, but no footpath. This is from the OS Maps 2023 1:25k SD Card for GPS systems.

Although a bog fest in places, the cairn is there in reality and the track is fairly well visible through the moorland. It's been there long enough to change the heather growth etc..

Has anyone got a map pre-2023 with this footpath on? 
Its more of a curiosity thing... But if it is on another older OS map.. I may bother to try and contact OS and see whats happened, ensure its on the latest etc. 



 

The path is still shown on the VectorMap Local (https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/products/os-vectormap-local)

The path isn't on my 2016 OS OL5 1:25k, nor is it on my 2016 Harvey's XT 1:40k.

However it is marked on my 2019 Harvey's Bob Graham 1:40k Map.

Make of that what you will!

The path isn't marked on both my 1998 OS Outdoor Leisure map and 1981 OS Landranger map.

It's also not on the 2015 Harvey 1:40,000 Lake District map 

It's on the latest OMN Anquet OS updated maps. 

Interesting, it’s not on the Outdooractive OS Maps.

It is on the OS map currently on the OS's own website. 
(You might expect that to be the most up to date version, but I noticed when a new PROW north of Sheffield finally made it onto the map that it was actually lagging behind the OS map on Viewranger for quite a while - this was after Outdoor Active's takeover I think, but obviously a wee bit before they'd killed VR off.)

For showing where paths actually exist on the ground (regardless of whether they're a PROW or not), the Open Street Map and its variations are generally much better.  Especially in popular areas, as it relies on volunteers to keep it up to date.  (Wikipedia style.)

Slightly bizarrely the "auto routing" feature when you plan routes on the OS's own website (as a premium subscriber) uses OSM data to determine where the path goes rather than their own now.  And as it turns out it is better that way.

Thanks all, very interesting... 

Looks like OS are slow to add this to their print and cards... Online data is quicker.. Doesn't explain how it's on the 2019 Graham Round map but different data sources I guess.

For me, the biggest takeaway is planning with multiple resources and having some of those when out on the hill. 

Although my GPS is my default goto device... Halfway accross that path I stopped to check OS maps on phone AND the paper map! The path was only shown on the phone! (I was in thick clag so couldn't see the Cairn or Skiddaw House on the other side). 

I've got a few different years of OS 1:25k on memory map. It's not there in 2019 or 2023, but is there in the 2024 map.

Google maps shows what looks like a well warn path

I don't mean to be patronising, but are you aware that 'path', is simply a path visible to the map maker, but NOT a Public Footpath.?  Public footpaths are marked green - this isn't.  The reason it appears in maps post 2018 is probably because there was no sign of it on the ground prior to that date.

Totally... and I do get the path, Footpath, ROW issues.. 
As I said... having the marked cairn there and it being a fairly distinct track.. I was questioning why it wasn't on a 2023 OS source. 
Thanks for the responses folks.. its been good to learn some of the differences and gain more learning in using various sources, and noting differences 'before' going out on the hill and wondering where the track disappeared to on the GPS!!. 

Not sure of the date, but there's been a reasonably visible path there for several years, and it's not a particularly well visited patch of soggyness.

If you're interested using all the sources you can find online to plan a route, can I suggest one more? 

Down here in and around the Peak, where it's relatively busy and I'm often looking to get off the beaten path (but still on some kind of a path), besides the OSM I often find it's worth having a look at the Strava Heatmap to see where people actually have been going. 

Sometimes across open ground, if there's been enough traffic to create a defined path, you can actually see the 'fuzzy' bits where the path disappears and everyone follows a different route until they pick it up again.

Slightly annoyingly you do need to be logged in to see a useful amount of detail though - but a free account works fine and there's no need to pay a subscription.

I presume the interest is that you are collecting Wainwrights as this path seems to go out to Mungrisdale Common - the least favourite of Wainwright allegedly, so I think there is definitely likely to be a track for those collecting such tops.

Good call on strava heatmaps, forgot about that.

Two things that struck me looking at the heatmap for that area:

1. The massive amount of traffic on the BGR from Great Calva to Blencathra.

2. The lack of traffic from Atkinson Pike to the Cloven Stone. This possibly confirms my thinking that there's been a path / sheep trod there for years, and it's not suddenly appeared due to increased foot traffic.

It’s the Definitive Rights of Way held by local councils that the OS take their data from. So, if a council grant a new PROW or Permissive Path it’s left to the OS to update their map when they see fit.

As to the Open Street Map, I find that a lot ( not all) of their paths are nothing but dog walking paths and local cut throughs, certainly not PROWS and this is in the Sheffield/Barnsley area  

Yes.  None of that contradicts anything I said in that post, I think we agree.

Indeed - though I think you're perhaps being a bit too dismissive of mere "dog walking paths".  A lot of people like to walk their dogs in nice places, and often know good routes around their local area that you'd never know existed or were accessible from just looking at the OS map.  Finding those 'local' paths without the benefit of local knowledge is one of the things the OSM is particularly useful for.

Calling them dog walking paths was a bit remiss of me but a lot in my area cross private arable land and across other land that is signed as private property. The fact that they are shown on OSM as dotted paths gives rise to people thinking and sometimes claiming that these are PROWS. Some are but a lot aren’t. 

Interesting stuff.. Love the Strava heatmap.. Will definitely look into that. Thanks.. 

Fascinated by the Strava heatmap.

The track is obviously in use by Wainwrightists wishing to 'bag' Mungrisdale Common.

Edit - I often use satellite imagery on Bing Maps to check for the existence of a path on the ground, and there certainly seems to be a well used path in this case.

https://www.bing.com/maps?osid=771857c8-b959-46b1-afbe-79c9c1694f50&cp=...

https://wtp2.appspot.com/wheresthepath.htm

This site is great for that, side by side google earth and os maps with the cursors synched.

Thanks... 
I never knew that... 
I was using it as a link-up between Blencathra and Skiddaw to make a nice circular route. 
 

Very interesting, thanks. 

..although it is a pity that the zoom isn't synched too.

It is if you want it to be, there's a box you can tick for that.

Ahh, thanks.