UKC

Hi , i have just joined a climbing centre  so i can belay my 7 yr old grandson ,i took him last week for the first time & realized due to his light weight belaying him down i had to raise my brake hand higher than what i would have thought i needed to do , to encourage the rope to run through the belay device ,next time i'm there i'll ask there advice , but meantime iv'e come across this forum & was wondering what your thoughts were on this .

thanks in advance

It’s not a problem. I seen myself, while controlling the dead rope with the right hand, using my left hand to pull live rope though the device. It’s fine to adjust the angle to decrease friction enough to allow gravity to work.

 This isn't really an issue if you are sure to keep in control.

Sometimes the ropes in climbing centres are fatter that normal because of the wear they take and also to cope with this wear. Because if this the rope can run quite slowly through the belay device.

Some belay devices are tighter than others, eg. the Wild country VC devices are quite grippy and the DMM bug less so with a range in between. So one option would be to acquire a DMM bug if you haven't already got one.

Otherwise, Some devices like the Petzl reverso or the Black diamond ATC have little teeth (of sorts) on the dead rope side of the device. see the link below:

https://insituclimbing.co.uk/ekmps/shops/8d8a75/images/petzl-reverso-belay-...

Although some inexperienced wall workers will tell you off for this you can run the rope through the device the opposite way so that the dead rope runs over the smooth side of the device to give less friction.

Obviously this is a safety critical system so if you have any doubt at all ask someone who knows what they are doing. Also, so you can get an idea of the friction expected, let your grandson climb a short distance and test things out at a low level.

Hope this helps.

The BD  ATC-XP and ATC-Guide belay devices are designed to do just this. High or regular friction modes.  It's in the manual that came with it.

Hope this helps.

7 year olds are very light so it's to be expected with fat ropes.  As mentioned above as long as you are in control and can stop lowering him and you are lowering him in a controlled way not a free fall I'm sure it's fine.  It will look different to lowering an adult.  If you are worried then do ask a member of staff to check.  

I don't have my own belay device yet, was thinking about getting a   ASCXp but now wondering whether to get a Dmm Bug to use with my 7 year old

With a very light child you sometimes need not-by-the-book technique because the issue is often getting the rope to move at all rather than being able to lock it off.

The thing to be careful of if you are almost always belaying a child is that you won't get away with some of the things you've got used to doing with an adult or older teenager.

I know this, some people don't.

Out of interest what belay device are you using?  Ropes have got thinner over the last few years, and belay devices have generally been made more 'grabby' to compensate.  But many climbing wall top-ropes are still usually a bit fatter and fluffier than average. 

It could be that you'd benefit from a slicker belay device with such a light climber, an old-school ATC for example.

i'm using whatever the club gives me to rent  ,still to buy one ,which one should i go for

I'd say probably something as slick as possible.  ('Slick' is the opposite of 'grabby' in a belay device - what I mean by that is that it offers less friction.)  Not necessarily what you want with a climber of your own weight and a relatively skinny rope, but it you seem to be experiencing a bit too much friction with your grandson.

An original Black Diamond 'ATC' is what I'd suggest.  Someone above mentioned the DMM 'Bug' - I use one of those now, which I bought to replace my ATC when I bought new ropes and found it a bit too slick with them.  It's significantly more grabby (a good thing, in my case, and why I bought it).

Someone else above mentioned the BD 'ATC-XP' and 'ATC-Guide' - both are newer variants of the original 'ATC' designed to add a bit more friction, or quite a lot more friction, depending on which way round you use them.  The 'ATC' is almost always just known by its initials, by the way, they have effectively become the name of the thing but they originally stood for the name "Air Traffic Controller'.

If you can borrow one, maybe give it a try?  If not, I'm pretty sure I have one kicking about somewhere (unused for a long time now!) - if you'd like to have a go with that drop me an email with a postal address and I'll bung it in a jiffy bag and post it to you sometime in the next few days..

It's tempting to be mischievous and suggest you ditch the harness, get some good gloves and give the kid a body belay instead.  (I would, if I was certain you'd realise I was joking - it's not an entirely terrible idea, but the climbing centre would be horrified and probably ask you to leave!)

The old style is still available in a rather nice purple.  

https://www.outside.co.uk/climbing-gear/belay-rope-devices/belay-devices/bl...

FWIW this is what I've always used with kids from 4 years and up to large adults.  

Sorry. I should have replied to the OP. 

i think it might be a good idea to see what rented belays they have at my climbing centre that way i can try each 1 out , hopefully they have a few different belays ,

Cool.  I found mine a bit too slick with my large adult partner leading on our own rope(s), which is why I'm using a Bug now.  It would probably still be fine on fat furry in-situ top ropes. 

In reply to crooner:

Yes, definitely.

I only climbed indoors with the big chap

UPDATE

i went to the gym to ask there advice & they said i have no need to worry about getting a belay device for my light climber , as jls said  It’s fine to adjust the angle to decrease friction enough to allow gravity to work ,which they are happy for me to do ,so if they are happy i'm happy ,the only point they made was to remember to go back to belaying properly if i am belaying an adult.

thanks to everyone who replied to this post

Merry Christmas