UKC

I am looking to get a water filter and have been looking at what is available out there.

I have searched this forum and read through some of the posts in the past to try to get some direction. There doesn't seem to be any clear consensus on which filer or brand is the leader in the market.

I have looked at the MSR Miniwaterworks and actually qquite like it. It feels robust and reasonably well made, although the connecting tube to the main body could do with some reinforcing at the join.

Currently I am inclinded to go towards MSR, but then have looked at the waterworks in comparison to the miniwaterworks and note that the miniwaterworks filters down to 0.2 as aposed to 0.3.
Does this make any real difference? Does the waterworks filter out something that the miniwaterworks would let pass through? and its about double the price as well so I should hope that there is some benifit.

I just looking for some direction from people who have used them and have a better knowledge of them than myself. Is there any clear product or brand to go for? or is it all much for muchness?
Is it important to get down to 0.2 microns or is 0.3 ok?
Is there any new filters recently on the market I should be looking at?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers
DTE

In reply to DTE:
I've got the MSR miniworks - an old one (had it about 6 years)

its great - used it extensively in Southern Afica for hiking/camping and its even been out a few times here in the highlands etc

a nice bit of kit although you can get by with the iodine/chemicals etc for short irregular use. Also, the latest range of £20/30 pocket filters might be ok for you -all depends on how much use you see it having. dont forget about the cost of the replacement ceramic cartidges as they will up the price etc significantly

hope that helps

In reply to DTE:

Where are you going to be using it? The UK? The Congo? The Alps?

In reply to DaveBrown: Not overly sre on the where. I am intending to do some walking on Dartmoor, in Wales, Scotland possibly in the Alps in a year or so's time. I've got the chemical solutions as well, but think a filter is a good idea as well. essentially I want to keep it in my walking pack so that if I run out of water when walking, whereever I may be I can get some drinking water. I'll also use it as my main way of getting water when doing overnight walks etc.

In reply to DTE:

I`m pretty sure that the filter we used in the forces was much the same as the miniworks one. But if you are looking to use something over here , try & get hold of some sani-tabs(Chlorine/Iodine based methinks?) & just use a double layer of standard coffee filters in a small funnel to fill your water bottle, to filter out insects & grit & then boil.
Won`t take long to go cold on Dartmoor!.......,believe me.

In reply to DTE:

I work for a filter manufacturer and I would say 0.3 micron would be just fine. Typically beverage manufacturers go down to 0.45 for removal of nasties, and the pharmaceutical manufacturers go to 0.2.

I've used my waterworks throughout Asia and the Pacific, it's bombproof, easy to maintain and screws directly onto a Nalgene or MSR's own bladders. A really good bit of kit that proved itself invaluable over extended journeys in remote areas. Hope this helps.

In reply to DTE: where do you plan on walking in scotland where you will need to filter water?

In reply to DTE:

Try the Wellness Water Filter, they have a whole range of systems ranging from Jug filters, Travel Sports bottle through to whole residential systems they also do more than just filter the water they re-energise & Enhance the water as well. They are more expensive than most other filters but their testimonials suggest that they are well worth the extra cost.

In reply to DTE: I use an MSR Miniworks, I'm quite happy with it. Also useful if you have an environmental concern over plastic bottle use in, for example, Mexico or India.

In reply to jimtheape:
Chances are slim - but potentially anywhere - (case a few weeks ago of crypospiridium on rannoch moor)- and anywhere with lots of our e coli carrying woolly friends - or round bothies where there is to much human faeces etc etc.

OE

In reply to DTE: I use the katadyn pocket filter. It goes down to .2 micron. .1 micron is required to purify everthing but .2 is sufficient for most needs. If you want tot do the job properly then boil the water.

In reply to healthman:

"re-energise & Enhance"

oh yeah?



like how exactly?

In reply to tmh: its all to do with the water having good karma dude. if your water isnt energetic enough, well, it can lead to serius bad vibes.

In reply to ceri:

Waterfilters obviously dont get rid of LSD

In reply to pagoda: thats the "enhance" bit...

In reply to tmh:

The filter contains nine layers of different volcanic media which replicates the waters natural journey through the earths strata. Each level of media has a different effect on the water each haveing different health benefits. These media levels inpart minerals into the water, lowers the surface tension, changes the ph of the water and reformats the memory of the water and radiates far-infra red rays and acts as a medicine at the quantum level making the water which comes out of your tap like volvic but the difference is that volvic has been sat in a plastic bottle for some time.

check out : www.wellness-water.co.uk

In reply to ceri:
The filter contains nine layers of different volcanic media which replicates the waters natural journey through the earths strata. Each level of media has a different effect on the water each haveing different health benefits. These media levels inpart minerals into the water, lowers the surface tension, changes the ph of the water and reformats the memory of the water and radiates far-infra red rays and acts as a medicine at the quantum level making the water which comes out of your tap like volvic but the difference is that volvic has been sat in a plastic bottle for some time.

check out : www.wellness-water.co.uk

In reply to Dan:

Christ! If that's what it does to your common sense, I think I'll avoid using them.

Bob

In reply to Bob:

Bob, I sense you must be having problems in other areas of your life judging from your response. The wellness systems have been ranked as number one in the world by the world health organisation, and is the only product in the world to lower life insurance premiums. I have been studying water for 5 years now, what particular part of my last message could you not grasp, I would be happy to explain it in more " SIMPLE " terms for " YOU "

In reply to Dan & Bob:

hand bags at dawn?

In reply to Dan:

i think bob may have been refering to the fact that you were talking bolleux.

from the website:

DISCLAIMER: While there are numerous reports of health benefits from the Japanese Ministry of Health, physicians and users of the Wellness Filter, for legal reasons Wellness Water Ltd will not make any claims of health benefits until it has conducted independent clinical trials in the UK.

In reply to satori:

which particular element do you feel is bolleux ?

In reply to Dan:

I'm intrigued by "reformats the memory of the water".

(Another) Bob

In reply to Ian:

Aw, cmon, squeegee bottles at least!

Dan: the passage you quoted is full of pseudo-scientific claptrap (to put it kindly).

"reformats the memory of the water": What memory of the water is going to be reformatted/restored? Memories of flowing majestically over the Niagara Falls? Dripping over a columnade in Carlsbad Caves? Erupting from an Icelandic geyser?

Changing the pH? So it removes/adds a few ions - so what? Any water supply you are likely to apply it to is not going to be so acidic or alkali that it will cause you harm.

"acts as a medicine at the quantum level": I didn't know that there were any quantum level medicines, must ask my GP for some of these - maybe they will help with the other areas of my life with which I seem to be having problems.

"lowers surface tension": I didn't realise that such a fundamental feature of water was so injurious.

Bob

In reply to Dan:


i think bob's just about summed it up.

ps. my degree covered quantum mechanics and also medical physics.

the only crossover between these two subjects i studied involved medical imaging scanners - not quantum medicine. lol.

In reply to Dan:


PMSL!!!!!

>is the only product in the world to lower life insurance premiums

Now this I am interested in. Please supply name and contact details of the life insurance company...

>reformats the memory of the water

FAT32 or ext3?

In reply to Bob:

ok Bob, Water has an ability to remember ( all be it electromagnetically ) the resonant frequencies, of past contaminants be they chemical ( or emotional ) and continue to emit these frequencies, even though the emittor of the frequencies have been removed, this is done using a japanese far infra red emitting media called tenko-seki,( see the book "messages from water by Masuro Emoto")
also do a google search on tenko seki)) Have a look also at the works of Dr. Serge Jurasunus (see google)who has done a hell of a lot of research into tenko seki.
Tenko Seki also has a stong capacity to protect cell membranes from free radical damage.
There have been remarkable advances in quantum physics and quantum medicine. Far-infrared rays have been successfully studied, analyzed and their results documented. Among several studies, those of 4 to 14 micron wavelength demonstrated remarkable efficacy in treating various
diseases, and thus are a part of quantum medicine.
pH. It is important for us humans to maintain a slightly alkaline pH level in order to maintain healthy cell function. In the U.K our water supply is acidic at around 6-6.5 plus the vast majority of people lead very acidic lives, and dehydration is rife, which results in acidosis.
Surface tension is not a bad thing, however a lowered surface tension makes a super- hydrating water, with the ability to increase both the speed and the efficiency of nutrient uptake and intra cellular traffic.
As for the insurance companies, (I don't think this was your question Bob)
Nissay Dowa General, Nippon Life Insurance, Mitsui Mutual Life Insurance, Sony Life Insurance Company, and Sumatomo Life Insurance Company.

In reply to tmh:
see the response to Bob for the life insurance companies

In reply to Dan:

Did, an admittedly quick, Google on "water memory" - a contentious field as you no doubt are aware. Most of the early hits returned were from articles desperate to prove the argument one way or the other rather than study or explain the case.

One that was not sensationalist was http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aligned_water_theory

As for insurance companies - it would appear that all the companies you mention are Japanese. Might the Shinto religion have something to do with this?

Suggest you do a search on "The Emperor's New Clothes".

Bob

In reply to Dan:

>Have a look also at the works of Dr. Serge Jurasunus (see google)who has done a hell of a lot of research into tenko seki.

He hasn't had any of it published in peer reviewed journals.

I can feel my life getting a little acidic at this point, so I'll leave debunking the rest of the tripe you've posted as an exercise for the reader...

In reply to Dan:


the water memory thign is to all intents and purposes , aboslute rubbish, while your quoted sources may be true with their 14 micron wavelentgh stuff, the fact is (and it is fact not idle speculation) that the memory of water is only shown to be effective for microseconds, if that.

alas i dont' know the papers to quote, but it was published in teh last couple of months as part of a research program in to homeopathic medicine.

cheers
GTE

In reply to Dan:

Perhaps your water contains some bad acid

Bob

In reply to tmh:


Your attitude and state of mind is synonomous of chronic dehydration, I feel you should let the other readers make their own decisions. Hydration and brain function are directly linked.

In reply to Dan:

I just checked it out on the website, it is called a disclaimer.

In reply to DTE:

Hi Guys,

I personally use a Wellness Sports Bottle and rarely go anywhere without it, I uesd it for 4 months in Nepal & it never let me down.

In reply to Dan:

Disclaimer = "anything we say may be taken down and replaced with something that you cannot prove"

Would you care to post a link to a peer reviewed article that has appeared in any internationally respected scientific journal supporting the claims that water has memory?


Bob

In reply to doc.g:

What is in question here is not the fact that the system acts as an effective water filter but the assertion, among others, that the system "reformats the memory of water".

Bob

In reply to Bob:

Dear Bob,
I have just read all the preceding messages;
I personally am of the understanding water is capable of holding certain frequencies.
I feel that infra red technology whilst it is relavively new is a very up and coming area of research, the results of testing conducted in Australia, Japan, China embody some of the most exciting advances in human wellness.
I have personally noticed great benefits since using the Wellness travelsport, I am diabetic, and since using the travelsport, my blood sugar level fluctuations have reduced by 50%, and live blood analysis demostrated a significant increase in blood cell mobility, and elasticity.

In reply to doc.g:

I'll ask the question of you then:

"Would you care to post a link to a peer reviewed article that has appeared in any internationally respected scientific journal supporting the claims that water has memory?"

Bob

In reply to Bob:

Isn't it odd how all the people posting raving about this product have absolutely no profile about their climbing.

While all people suggesting that its somewhat dubious do...

Further, 'Testamonials' are never worth the Interweb bandwidth they are transferred with.

In reply to Dave B:

From the website referred to:

" Over 30 years ago Japanese sports scientist Haru Naito embarked on a quest to find the perfect water. His study took him to certain areas of the world where people were living longer and healthier than others.

He visited places such as the Hunza Valley and Caucasus mountains ..."

From a website devoted to the Hunza valley:

"Hunza was the likely model for the Shangri-La of James Hilton’s novel ‘Lost Horizon’ where he describes it as a country of peace and contentment where the people do not ago. The myth of the longevity of the Hunzakuts probably stems from the fact that it was selected by the National Geographic magazine as the kingdom where people loved longest, free from social stress and succored by their high intake of apricots and low intake of animal fat.

You see in Hunza a large number of old people, most of them apparently in good health, but few, if any, live to be 120."

So we are in search of Shangri-la

Says it all really.

Bob

In reply to Bob: I think The Backstreet Boys summed it up perfectly:

"We've been waiting so long
Just can't hold it back no more
Creepin' up and down now
It's time for me to let it go
If you really wanna see
What we can do for you
Send the crazy wildin' static
Sing it"

In reply to DTE:

Hi,

I am not a chemist nor Back street boys fan like but seems that the rest of you are, I am a keen wakeboarder, base jumper & climb occasionally , the real reason I am in this forum is because I am looking for a new good location where I can do a jump with a decent depth of water for a landing.. It just happens that I have heard of and bought a wellness system.

I have allergies and did alot of research into all the leading water filters & Purification sytems both in the U.K and abroad by getting incontact with many different nutritionists & healthcare proffessionals.

A few had heard of the Wellness Systems and did recommend it as the leading filtration system. Those who had not heard about the systems did research of their own into it. on the whole their conclusion was that even though the manufactures of the sytem where not making these claims for legal resons, there was high possibilities that it could help my Eczema. What gave me confidence in the product was by visiting the allergy show and talking to other allergy suffers who recommended the system. Also when any new innovation is released there is bound to be a time where more people dont know about it than do. The fact that they gave me a 90 day money back Guarantee and it has cleared up my eczema is fantastic!

Also I used to drink bottled water -- the water that this system produces is of a far better quality.

Girls: you will be able to relate to this when I say that This water is so good that I hardly need even need to use an Shampoo or conditioner when showering in the wellness waterm my skin doesnt dry up, my hair colour lasts longer and it is just a really lovely experience to think f bathing in a natural spring water.

I am a great beliver that the proof is in the pudding, so I suggest if any of you are in any doubt, then have a try of this water and make up your own mind.

If anyone can recmmend a better filter after using one of these then I will happily try out there recommendations. but wellness have set the bar very high.

Can 500,000 people be wrong ?

P.s. Can anyone help with a Good cliff jump in the U.K. or Europe.

In reply to stacey:

Yes.

How many people were in the Nazi Party (to name just one)?

In reply to stacey:

So Dan, doc.g and stacey are all registered users with no profile set up. What else do they have in common? The only thread on these forums that any of them have contributed to is this one.

Cheddar?

Bob

In reply to Jenn:

funny you should say that because in WW1 I think you'll find that chlorine gas was used in the trenches cause its a heavy gas that hangs low and gases everyone --- think of your morning shower and the "steam" that you inhale with every breath (surely not good!!) & in WW2 Hitler used Flouride in the concentration camps to surpress thought and lower mental activity preventng escape attempts etc..

Why is everyone so anti this amazing water -- surely it makes sense to be ridding all the chemicals and nasties from polluted tap water and enhancing the propertiesto replicate those found at these special springs in the world... I don't know why everyone is so up tight about this - it makes perfect sense to me and i am happy with my decision.

In reply to Bob:


Hey Bob I searched google for water & climbing & this forum can up. I think you need to get out more.

In reply to stacey: Stacey, if this is really the case why is evidence to support your claims anecdotal or pseudo scientific? I'm not uncomfortable with metaphysical arguments being presented- there's a lot we just don't know- but I'm confused as to why a manufacturer of a product allegedly as good as this has to resort such weak arguments.

In reply to stacey:

Ah yes, this magic water, blessed with recomendations from such luminaries as Sandy Corlett - http://www.quackwatch.org/04ConsumerEducation/Nonrecorg/drc.html

As well as famous health experts from golf clubs and restaurants across the US... Anyone care to substantiate the claim that it's ranked #1 by WHO, and lowers life insurance premiums?

In reply to stacey:

I think you need to stop trying to sell snake oil on websites populated by people with working brains.

In reply to psd:

Actually I need to do some work, which now that the required hardware has arrived I can do so.

Bob

In reply to DTE:

Nice one and I am of to North Wales to do big Quarry free climb & Jump.

In reply to stacey:

More water quackery - http://www.chem1.com/CQ/gallery.html

And http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penta_Water

In reply to psd:

Hey,

I know nothing about chemistry I just recommend this filter which was the original request of the person who started the thread.

It tastes good, makes my skin & Hair feel great & has no nasty chemicals in it and that is good enough for me.

I do not wish to argue about science etc.

In reply to stacey:

Which 'big quarry free climb' are you after doing?

I only ask because I don't know a single climber who uses the term 'free climb' as you have done.

In reply to DTE:

This could run and run (unless someone turns off the tap) arf arf.

Try water crystal of the month for size: http://www.masaru-emoto.net/english/ephoto.html

Bonus for anyone who can track down the elusive "Reader's Water Crystals" site.

In reply to Dave Hunter, Rock + Run:

one in llamberis a friend is takeing me to

In reply to Dave Hunter, Rock + Run:

Hey mate can you rcommend any others in this country or maybe in europe.

In reply to stacey:

Only too pleased to help: email me direct, hunter@rockrun.com and I'll give you a list. What grade are you comfortable climbing?