In reply to Stuart the postie:
I tried Andys BD softshell jobbies at the weekend and they were very good (50 bucks tho !) : dispite allways having a budget of 15 quid for gloves, im starting to think you get what you pay for. Thin fleece is just no use. Those OR ones look very good for the price.
I've got a pair of wee davie specials on the way : i'll see how they go (also think they might be too short for full on winter conditions), Let me know how you get on with the OR ones if you buy them.