UKC

Ok so I bought the new Rockfax Mallorca guidebook (2006) for my trip there last week and was disappointed when I found a copy of the Cicerone guidebook (2000) written by Chris Craggs.
Obviously I wasn’t disappointed to find a guidebook but due to fact that the Cicerone guide was far superior in comparison with the Rockfax guide. The descriptions of the routes were loads better (more info/accurate) and also the descriptions of the locations and how to get to them. Ok the Rockfax one had nice colour photo topos where possible but that seemed to be the only benefit.
I’m not knocking Rockfax as a whole as I own about 7/8 different guidebooks of theirs and they are superb, I’m just wondering why they couldn’t have bulked out the descriptions as the guidebook isn’t exactly the biggest?

As a result during the trip the Cicerone book took precedence and the Rockfax was relegated to the bag!

Anybody have similar experiences/comparisons?

In reply to Tris: Thought rockfax was about not giving betas to climbing

In reply to Tris:

No. In fact, the complete opposite. We found the grades in the Cicerone guide to be so unreliable as to be useless, 5 could mean 5 or it could mean 6b.

In reply to Simon Caldwell: Ok I know the grades wwere out but that is common in Mallorca apparently.
I'm talking about decriptions of routes and how to get to the crags.

In reply to Glyn Jones: is telling you where a route goes, i.e. trend right at the crack etc giving you beta?

In reply to Tris:
I'll be getting the Rockfax one when I next go out. I have the printed out version at the moment.

Had the Chris Craggs one but don't know where it's got to...

In reply to Tris:

If there is any particular bit of information you are basing your assessment on then please let me know since, as far as we are aware (and keep in mind the fact that Chris was a proof reader on the 2006 Rockfax) the information in the new book is more accurate and up to date in every respect possible to Chris's 2000 book. This is particularly relevant for crag approaches since at least 5 of the crag approaches have changed significantly since 2000.

The Rockfax also contains 300 more routes (not including the routes in Chris's books that are on crags which are now banned) and 6 new crags.

Alan

In reply to Alan James - UKC: the descriptions for routes at La Creveta and Calvia. Also the description for how to get to Calvia. I have since checked your website and have seen your note about the error in the book but that didn't help me in the middle of the Spanish countryside.

I don't have the two books with me at the moment so cannot give you exact route description comparisons.

All I'm saying is for many routes there was a one line description in the Rockfax guide and a more decriptive few lines one in the Cicerone guide.

I'm not trying to pick faults with the guidebook as it is great, I'm just curious why the route descriptions are not as detailed? maybe it is the beta thing which I am not aware of?

This is just my opinion and other people might prefer a cut-down compact description...

In reply to Tris:

Was it really that hard to follow the routes on Creveta using the Rockfax? What if (like around 25% of our market) English isn't your first language?

There are all sorts of factors that come into play when deciding how to present information.

What I would urge you not to do is judge an entire guidebook based on one erroneous approach description, especially when the guidebook you compare it to has at least five inaccurate crag approach descriptions, plus three banned crags presented as not-banned, because it was published 7 years ago.


Your assessment here is correct; people do prefer the cut-down descriptions presented with big crag photos in our experience. Also, we get a lot of complaints when we include too much beta on routes, especially from continental European climbers where guidebooks contain no beta.

Thanks for your feedback anyway and I'd appreciate details on any other crag approach problems that you found.

Alan

In reply to Alan James - UKC: thanks for your comments Alan. I was interested in the reasoning behind this. You do a fantastic job in producing guide books and it must be hard to cater to all tastes especially on the continent. This I had not realised until now.

I guess I will have to debate beta/route descriptions with some French/Spanish climbers..

In reply to Alan James - UKC:
Was it really that hard to follow the routes on Creveta using the Rockfax? What if (like around 25% of our market) English isn't your first language-
I had no problem at all finding le crevata, i parked where you told me, i walked where you said, and climbed (desperatly) on the routes.
great book, no more info needed
oh except on how to get down form Albrahida, as my mate took us the wrong way and we had to spend the night on the south side on a massive slab)
keep up the good work.