UKC

Is it just my thoughts or are the main factors of HMS krabs not stength, smooth running, size, to fit big knots on and general easy use when belaying. SO whats the point in having a minature HMS?
CAMP Picito? Tiny. Is advertised for alpine use, would you prefer a small hms over a larger one?

In reply to chickenpox: Camp picto, Sorry.

In reply to chickenpox: Small HMSs are just as strong as bigger ones. Rope runs smoothly through smaller ones just as well as bigger ones (probably is a difference but you can't tell). Smaller ones are indeed lighter, which is their main selling point.

As for fitting knots on, i can fit two clove hitches onto a small screwgate just fine - but I do use 8.5mm halves. But I do carry just one large screwgate as a main belay point, and a small one for belay plate. If i need more I just double up snaplinks, it saves carrying dead weight around.

In reply to chickenpox: The primary purpose of an HMS karabiner is to work with the Italian/Munter hitch. The shape is specifically designed to work well with that knot. It just so happens that a large HMS is good for fitting more than one knot onto but that's not what it was designed for. Also, by the nature of the shape it is in fact weaker, rather than stronger than a regular "D" shaped biner.

Harry.

In reply to harry1969: I've been looking at a range of HMS along side each other and nothing realy stands out about each individual one as being similar to another and different from a none HMS.
Finding the definition of a HMS krab a bit confusing. Unless it is just the shape of them but them some none HMS are the same shape but not HMS.

In reply to chickenpox: I recently lost my normal belay device (DMM bug) and it's large HB HMS krab and have been using a HB Air Marshall designed for sub-8.5mm ropes.

Using thin ropes and a smaller belay devices means that a standard sized HMS (DMM Boa) is far too big and just unnecessary extra weight. I've found used a stardard offset-D krab with the Air Marshall awkward as it doesn't sit properly so I've decided I need one of these small HMS krabs that you're talking about.

Basically if you're using 8mm ropes, smaller belay devices, thinner slings etc. rather than the 11mm ropes people were using years ago smaller krabs make perfect sense.

HTH

In reply to chickenpox:

HMS krabs are designed to be loaded from the centre of the wider end (similar to oval krabs) but completely different from D-shaped or offset-D krabs which are designed so that if loaded the rope sits close to the back bar resulting in a stronger krab.

The usual features of any 'HMS' krabs are that the rope end is wider, broadly symmetrical and sits perpendicular to the long axis of the krab when loaded.

These features mean that HMSs are suitable for belaying with, either using an Italian hitch or a belay device. It also means that they are normally perfect to take two clove hitches as part of a belay set-up.

HTH