UKC

Hi ... I've been told to get some winter mountaineering experience under my belt before heading off next June to do an alpine intro. course. I'm wondering whether to go for Scotland or Spain - which would give me the best prep?
The Sierra Nevada is higher, so I'm assuming that = more snow?
I just want to get familiar with the kit & techniques before heading out to ze Alpenland.
What have other folks on here done?

Thanks
Tim

In reply to Pippin:

Scotland would be my suggestion, as it's more accesible for me. The drawback is getting the right conditions, but when you do, its staggeringly, amazingly beautiful and the climbing is superb.

You should do a lot of walking in crampons, I found that a drama (and still trip over my crampons) and go nuts on the self arrest. Once you've done that go for grade 1-3 routes with someone with experience.

Jonnie

In reply to Pippin:

scotland

In reply to Pippin:

Scotland its got to be ! If you head to the outdoor capital of the UK, Fort William ! You have a choice of Ben Nevis, Glen Coe or use the uplift for an easy day on Aoanch Mor !
The choice is simple !

Enjoy

In reply to Pippin:

Go and book a course with one of the Scottish guys, Moran, Pescod, Kimber etc and they will find the snow in their area to show you winter skills. There is also the Glenmore mafia, (morning George), who have more good instructors than anywhere else but not as personal maybe?

Do a bit of searching for those people in the winter forums and decide who suits best.

In reply to Pippin:
Cheers and thanks ...looks like Scotland gets
the thumbs- up

In reply to Pippin:
I live in Scotland, so I vote for Scotland.
However, for you, which is cheaper and easier to get to?
Pyrenees?
Sierra Nevada?
Scotland?

Also, there is the UKC picnic in Glencoe this coming March.

In reply to almost sane:

I considered those places also Doug, but decided against du to the lack of English speaking instructors there, unless you know different. Pippin could probably fly from Stanstead quicker and cheaper there than Scotland.

In reply to sutty:
yep that's true - my journey time to Stansted is about 1.5 - 2hours; to Scotland about 7 hours. Then there's Mr O'Leary's cheap flights, which will prob cost me less than 2 tank fills of diesel! I've never seen Scotland winter tho ...would really like to.

In reply to Pippin: I would go for Scotland if I were you. Scotland is even more beautiful when covered in snow and ice and the locals are really friendly. I did my first season a couple of years ago in the Cairngorms and loved it.

In reply to Pippin:

Depends, if you live close to Scotland then Scotland if you live in the South of England then I'd jump on a flight to the continent. As your only looking for an intro course it really doesnt matter were you head so dont rule out North Wales or the Lakes (if conditions allow)

Scotland is good but its not the be all and end all that some people would have you believe. Places that spring to mind that I know of people doing intro winter skills/mountaineering courses abroad are the Picos de Europa, Sierra's, Pirins, Julian Alps and even Morrocco all easily reached from the UK and probably give better value for money.

In reply to Alan M:

You say you know of people going to those places, could you give details for everyone to see please?

In reply to sutty:

Will do I will get the details from people as and when I see them.

Here's a company in the Sierra's http://www.guidinglight.org.uk/home.html I will be able to give you a full report in January as I am using this company myself.

Later

In reply to sutty:

Morning to you Mr Sutty (actually it's evening now but hey!)

Cheers fur noo
George

In reply to sutty:

i guinea-pig'd for glenmore in MIC asssessment a couple of years ago. two days of being a pretend winter climbing learner for a candidtate being assessed by a glenmore assessor. something like this might suit pippin, altho we were going at grade II / III. check the website.

i found the glenmore folk highly organised, efficient, professional, friendly and skillful.
ahunter

In reply to andy hunter:

I had a hill walking friend who went on a winter skills course there some years ago, a non climber then. He gained that much confidence, when the summer came he wanted to be on rock as well.

In reply to sutty:

thats ideal, a great grounding to go from.

its a good place. a training centre. the ethos or culture may well be different from private guides whose margins are tighter and have to give clients 'the whole' bit to gain the rep, the onward referrals, the repeat business. if they dont get it right they could out of business in a season or two. the poorish winters must make it hard.

i sometimes feel glenmore should have / deserves a higher profile as somewhere we should be proud of - a genuine centre of excellence for long time. maybe quietly working away at that level is a good idea though.
ahunter

In reply to andy hunter:

Yes, the between seasons such as now are lean times. I have known Ian Clough to be working on the roads with the council when there was no guiding work on.

I think Glenmore lodge is the centre of excellence, but you have to pay for it and some people find that hard to find.

In reply to sutty:

its slightly different, but i read and thoroughly enjoyed The Villain recently and was amazed / impressed to find Don Whillans had worked on the Hydro (wasnt it?) and in Blacks as a shop assistant in order to keep bones together between climbing up here. Maybe I shouldnt be, just naive. I'd be interested to know what local glasgow crags it was he went to.
ahunter