UKC

When will we get a ski forum?

Right, now that's out the way down to business.

I'm considering Dynafit bindings for my next ski set up (realistically some time next year). I'm reluctant to take a punt on them without having tried them as I've heard a few (not many) tales from people that have done just that and regreted it.

Does anyone know of any way I can try before I buy?

I'm based in Inverness.

In reply to DaveHK: i don't know why anyone would tour with anything else unless they weighed 20st/enjoyed jumping off cliffs.

one warning though: i put some on a pair of scratch bcs for my girlfriend thinking that they would be ideal for touring around cham. didn't realise that the skis were too wide and bendy for them until she actually tore out the binding from the ski!

not sure what you would learn from a test apart from discovering there's a knack to clipping them in.

In reply to DaveHK: Too many good points in both posts to address separately! I've no idea why we have a cycling forum and not a ski (mountaineering?) one.

I've occasionally wondered what the advantage of, for example, Fritschi Freeride is over Fritschi Explore. Is it just the fact that you can crank the DIN settings up to more than 10? Or do they have some other strength-based benefits?

P.S. Sorry I can't answer the OP's question. Thought I'd just go off topic instead. I've always skied on Fritschi bindings, ditto most of my mates. Those who don't ski on Dynafit occasionally slate the system, those that do don't have much to say. I still think it looks great though, and given the way I ski I'd happily use them on pistes too.

Have a look at wildsnow.com, loads of info on there, I got my first set of dynafits last season and they're pretty much the only things I've skied on since then, they're a lot stiffer then any other type of tour binding so ski much better and are a lot lot lighter! If I was you I'd just go for it, you won't regret it.

In reply to DaveHK: Ok.I don't know where you can try them, or what sort of a skier you are.

I have dynafit TLT ST mounted on both my pairs of skis. A pair of light G3, and a pair of Blackcrows Corvus.

The Dynafit binding will drive big ski's...

The Corvus are 196cm long and 103mm underfoot. I weigh about 95kg and ski relatively steep stuff, but don't huck cliffs. I ride with the bindings screwed up to DIN 10, and haven't sufferer any unexpected releases, you can get the FT model which goes up to DIN 12. If you are into freeride with the accompany cliff drops, death in the event of a fall etc I would definitely reccomend a beefier freeride oriented binding.

When i was mounting the black crows at the shop i was undecided whether to go Dynafit or Marker Baron/ Duke. I decided on the Dynafit because of the swing point on the toe being more ergonomic.

My 2p....

Dan

<I decided on the Dynafit because of the swing point on the toe being more ergonomic.

Well the whole walking thing being more ergonomic really...

In reply to Daniel Armitage: Vertical ST... not TLT....

In reply to DaveHK: I tested some in cham so prob not much good for you. This was on a pair of light rando skis which were not much fun bit I stuck with the same bindings STs but went for a slightly beefier ski. As said above I can't see why you wouldn't go dynafit. The only advantage of the fritschi is you can lock the heels in walk mode and the ski crampons are slightly easier to engage and of course they accept a wider range of boots. It doesn't take long to get used to getting in and out of dynafits and they can handle quite a lot on and off piste. I have a dodgy knee and was worried about them not releasing in a fall but never found this to be a problem.

And yes a dedicated forum would be nice.

In reply to DaveHK: on my other skis i have marker barons btw - the one downside of dynafit is you can't put alpine boots in them.

In reply to DaveHK:

Thanks to all above.

I think I'm coming round to the idea. My wariness was based on a friend of a friend who said they were a colossal ball ache in scottish conditions i.e. wet snow. He said he had to carry a screwdriver to unblock the toe holes. Given that 95% of their use will be in Scotland that concerned me.

I'm similar to Daniel above as I like steep but don't huck cliffs. I'm also only 68kg and not particularly agressive.

The more ergonomic walking movement also appealed but it's mainly a weight thing.

In reply to DaveHK: Dave I ski almost every day of the winter in all conditions and race most weekends using this type of binding and lighter, nothing compares for weight saving. To prevent boots/bindings icing up just spray these areas with a silicone based lubricant each outing.

In reply to DaveHK:
Have you tried Mountain Spirit in Aviemore, last time i was in they had a good selection of touring ski's to try - not 100% sure if any of them had dynafits but worth a try!

I love my Dynafits, they actually enable me to keep up with the boys when i'm out! On the back of your last post though - i do remember using them a long day out in Scotland and having problems with the cleats icing up, that has only been on one occasion though and i've only used them in Scotland the past couple of years.

One more vote for the Dynafits from me!

In reply to Sib81:

See http://www.dynafit.com/products-winter/bindings/1.html
Mountain Spirit (http://www.mountainspirit.co.uk/) don't have the Dynafit TLT Speed but have the TLT Vertical in stock. Rob should be able to order though.

Cheers Ron

In reply to DaveHK:
I use the old light weight Dynafit bindings for pretty aggressive skiing (though on light weight skis), I have never had a problem, and they feel super secure. I decided to get light weight ones because I was told the screws break before the bindings and so heavy ones (VT etc) are unnecessary (don't know if its true!). Also din 10 is fine for me. Apart from being really light, the pivot point is right at your toe, so easier/less tiring to walk (imo) and easier to make conversions. Can occasionally be a faff getting them on especially if you have fallen on a steep slope, but realistically you (hopefully) don't do it that many times in a day, and practice helps. The only pain, if you want to use them for freeride type skiing, is that dynafit compatable boots used to be a bit softer, but nowadays you get heavy boots with dynafit points...I'd buy them everytime.

Like the tip re silicon spray.

In reply to DaveHK: I've just bought a set of Dynafit style bindings (G3)after years of Fritchi use. I was nervous about forking out that size wedge on a new system but after a chat with a mate who's a ski guide and had a Dynafits on his phat G3 Zen Oxides,I made the move. He recommended Dynafit but I went with G3, either way the weight saving in itself makes it worthwhile aside from the fact I find there is less flex in the binding. Just go for it.

In reply to DaveHK: Ski forum please.

In reply to DaveHK:

Dynafit all the way, for touring they make the most sence, Im working in a backcountry shop in Whistler at the mo, and everyone is making the transistion with little to no complaints!

Even Eric Hjorlefson (a sick skier who hucks huge cliffs) is riding them, the FT 12's granted!

Also look into a fairly new company called PLUM, same design as the Dynafit , but lighter and a lot less complicated!

In reply to DaveHK: Here is my experience, but before I get slated on the net, I stress it is my personal experience and not given wisdom.

I have at least 8 pairs of skis for different uses and with all the various bindings.

Light weight Dynafit:
- pros: light weight, body centre of gravity lower hence more precision in skiing
- cons: come off for no reason (happened to me several times luckily on easy ground, and to a friend on the rectiligne in Chamonix...less fun). No hardness settting only the walking up lock. For very steep skiing I have to lock them. So no more safety in case of avalanche or fall. Also very tricky to put on when perched on a steep slope. I need help from someone else to hold my ski flat so the I can clip my ski shoe in. Ice gets in the holes on the side of your shoes and the whole operation of putting your skis on suddenly becomes epic. I am talking of ski mountaineering when you have climbed a couloir, the sun is getting warm, a crust is slowly but surely forming and you have to get down immediately.

Diamir:
- pros: more solid (but my son broke one), easier to put on in any circumstances
- cons: heavy when you carry your skis on your back climbing, body centre of gravity too high, twist and have a tendency of ripping off the skis.

None of these allow you to ski with you mountain boots. The Diamir can take some of them but you have 1 mm of overlap at the front of your shoes which is a bit nerve racking. The only binding that will take ski touring and mountain boots are some old Salewa. They are not made anymore.

There are new bindings on the market which look like a good compromise. I am going to have a look at them next week. Surprisingly I need new skis and all in all I will not go for Diamir because of the twist.

In reply to Simon05: That is a great trick. Thank you!

In reply to francoisecall: Hi Francoise - the Marker F10 or F12 might be just what you're looking for.
Also, I've got a feeling the Fritschi come with a lifetime warranty - obviously not much help at the time but is good to know the manufacturers have confidence in their gear!!

In reply to DaveHK:

I'd be surprised if Braemar or Cairngorm Mountain Sports didn't have a Dynafit binding on a pair of their rental skis.

In reply to crazydiamond: 2nd vote for Plum, I use there race bindings which are excellent, though too light/minimalist just for general touring. They now make the Plum guide, similar to the speed but much lighter, excellent review in English here:

http://skitheory.blogspot.com/2011/01/plum-guide-binding-overview.html

or ATK 170's, though are a little on the pricey side. As for the dynafits, as long as you don't need DIN 12, and most, even if they think they do,don't, then go for the Speed or the old comfort binding. Loads for sale on German/Austrian ebay.

Plum also have the best customer service known to man, super personal and always keen to listen to problems or ideas. Probably not possible to buy in UK, but you can buy direct from their site.

BEFORE any one starts jumping all over me about DIN 12 comment, please note, I said MOST don't, not all, and I understand that some folk do require this feature

In reply to Simon05: how do plum differ to dynafit? looking at the photos and they look almost identical to my dynafit (apart from the lack of brakes)

In reply to DaveHK:

dynafit are about to release a new binding range, called the radical, which has improved toe location and a simpler heal lift

might be worth waiting for them to appear in the shops.

I have recently made the switch from fritschi to dynafit vertical st and managed to break them after 2 days (ok it was piste skiing on ice!), they are currently with anotom (uk importer) who will hopefully replace them

dynafit for touring (get another pair of skis for piste)

fritschi for piste and touring

In reply to rogersavery:

forgot to say - the brakes on the vertical st are rubbish, they are only slid on and have a simple spring mechanism to hold them in place - so if you land on the ski with it pointing up hill the brake will simply slide of the binding

In reply to Tobias at Home:

Lack of brakes (at least for this season, I've heard they're cookin' something for next year) and lighter than Vertical (and a lot more than next years Radical)...

In reply to Slugain Howff:

They don't do rental. Not in Aviemore anyway.

In reply to Tobias at Home: Yep as HeMa pointed out there will be brakes soon. For me, personnaly, I never use brakes only leashes. If you make the leash yourself, never use the leg breaker types sold by Fritschi etc, then they are plenty strong enough to stop you loosing a ski, but also weak enough to break if you have a super world cup downhill crash or are caught in the violence of an avalanche. This does not apply to the plum race bindings that are either on your back or locked to your feet with only a heel release. The main difference between the Plum guide and speed is the range of adjustment on the heel piece (more on the guide), allowing you to ski maybe a beefy free ride boot and a boot with a dramatic sole length difference for the same size such as a scarpa F1 or Dynafit TLT5. However that said the TLT comfort will also give you a wide range of adjustment for a lot less cash. The ATK is different again in that it is usable as a normal touring binding but weighs an amazing 340g a pair! As always it all comes down to cash and compromise on weight, these new bindings/ski/boots packages now allow you to tour with minimum of weight for climbing without compromising too much downhill but as usual = MORE CASH

In reply to ColdWill:

Yep, why no ski forum, there is a forum for running,bikes, photography etc but still no ski mountaineering forum, why not?

In reply to Simon05:

Dunno, didn't know there was a bike section till you mentioned it.

use winter climbing as others do?

In reply to DaveHK: Phone Mountainspirit in Aviemore on 01479 811788. They have a decent load of ski mountaineering skis for hire, surely they'll have some Dynafits. To buck the trend, I vote Fritschi - no probs withe wet snow turning to ice, I like a robust indestructible binding for being tall with a big pack on my back.

In reply to nickinscottishmountains:

Can't have dynafit bindings for rent because they have to fit exactly the shoes.

Thank you all for all this info. Am going shopping next week with loads more information.

In reply to francoisecall: This is not the case. Dynafit make rental bindings, the difference being that there is a huge ammount of adjustment on the heel piece. The toe does not move but it is not a massive problem for rental skis. Some people also buy this rental binding as it allows really small boots to be fitted to dynafit skis with the new inserts. Wether these bindings are available for rent in UK is a different question all together.

In reply to DaveHK:
Dave,
Another vote for D'fits. I made the switch from Fritschi a couple of years ago and would not go back. Fritschis are fine mind, but for mainly touring I think Dynafits are very hard to beat. For more of a mix of piste and touring - say 50:50 - Fritschis or Marker Tour (lighter and cheaper) are possibly better bet.

I've found the D'fits to be much more robust than they look and I find they ski much better (more responsive from edge to edge) than Frtitschis, though I've not tried the very latest Freeride, which should be an improvement on older versions. I do take a small screwdriver for clearing the inserts on my boots and to scrape out wet snow from under the toe piece, but it rarely needed. As somebody has already mentioned, the brakes on the ST version are a bit pants.

I was also a bit wary of making the transition but managed to get an old pair off ebay - the TLT version with no brakes. I'd sold my Fritshis within a couple of weeks of first using the D-fit set-up.

Graham

In reply to DaveHK:

Amusingly my mate was harping on to me the other day about how good his new dynafit bindings are compared to my Fritschis. This was minutes before one them randomly released on a turn and shot off down the salle a manger. Having said that I know a lot of people are really happy with them, I think the ones mentioned here are possibly faulty. They're certainly much lighter and it seems 50% of the new touring skis people are using are Dynastar mythic lites and dynafits.

Ski touring forum please


I have just got Dynafit bindings, not had chance to use them yet, but I have reservations already concerning the faff factor, and having to remove the boot to revert to climbing mode.

I suspect the only thing going for them is the weight. But must try and keep an open mind...and get out on them!

In reply to top cat: Don't be concerned - you get used to it extremely quickly and the lightness more than makes up for it. They also are robust and make kick turns very easy as the weight is at the back on the ski, rather than on your boot, meaning the tail drops immediately...

In reply to top cat:
but I have reservations already concerning the faff factor, and having to remove the boot to revert to climbing mode.


You have to take your skis off with any binding, unless you like skiing with your skins on!

In reply to Simon05:

If your skins detach from the front (like some of the older Coltex ones I used to use) then this isn't true -- just give a kick to the heel so the tip comes up and unclip the skin and peel it off.

Similarly, I've skied with people who take each other's skins off to save faff with bindings -- we were using Telemark indings that were a bit of a faff so it worked out very well.

In reply to Flashy: Yep, I know, but the point made was that the dynafit was a faff because you have to take your boot out of the binding to go back into climbing mode, well you have to do this with all bindings, unless your gonna lie down while your mates put your skins on too.

In reply to Simon05:

Fair enough. What I was driving at was that it really can be an advantage not to need to take your skis off to switch between modes. Flattish terrain where you don't actually need skins makes this feature useful


It's a funny image. Or, you could do what we've done in the past and kick your ski up and rest the tail in the snow while your mate puts a skin on. Only really useful if your bindings/leashes are a massive pain.

In reply to top cat:
>but I have reservations already concerning the faff factor, and having to remove the boot to revert to climbing mode.

you don't. Simply rotate the rear binding and stamp your heal down. (and dont forget to undo the lock lever at the front)

In reply to Simon05:

you can take skins off without removing your skis with abit of practice. here is a video on how to do it...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMnWDLhLo9k&feature=player_embedded#

In reply to Tobias at Home:

He's a bit of a guri is Mr Mclean.

In reply to DaveHK: But this is how we do it in the races

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1CgHTAmUvA&feature=related

In reply to Tobias at Home:

can you do that with brakes?

In reply to Morgan Woods: dynafit brakes tuck in next to the boot when you fix the heel so it shouldn't make any difference.

to be honest i don't really see why it would cause a problem any way - would just be a bit more fiddly no?

In reply to Tobias at Home:
Just related to that video, when I first bought my skins the shop chap told me to fold in half and stick together, which I did. First time out I tried to pull them apart - nightmare! It took 2 of us and a lot of tugging to pull them apart, ended up keeping my fluffy gloves on because it was freezing and it took ages, so now I've got bits of fluff permanently stuck to my skins!
So, when I returned I got a separator sheet. However, that can be a faff as well. Do you guys stick the 2 halves together? Does the glue become weaker, or does it stick better in certain conditions?

In reply to JuneBob:

The glue works better when it's warm (once it gets really cold it can stop working altogether), and degrades gradually. Newly glued skins are always a bugger at first when stuck to themselves -- cheat sheets are less faff in these cases.