/ Rope length for El Chorro?

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mikekeswick - on 20 Nov 2012
As you might have guessed i'm off to El Chorro in a few days. I haven't got the guide yet and was wondering what length of rope it's best to take. I'm guessing a 50m is only going to be of limited use so is 60m enough or is it worth getting a 70m. Also how many quickdraws would it be wise to take?
Cheers.
A Mountain Journey - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick: Had a 60m when there a few years ago. It was enough for lots of routes, but there were times when 70m would have been better.
Pero - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick: There's plenty to go at with a 50m rope. Even more with a 60m. You only need 70m if you're going for more specific routes.
GrahamD - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick:

We managed on a 60m rope even for routes of nominally 35m with rope stretch and careful belaying. Can't remember how many draws are needed for ElChorro but I will tend to take 14 or 15 as standard on this sort of trip
Ciro - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to GrahamD:
> (In reply to mikekeswick)
>
> We managed on a 60m rope even for routes of nominally 35m with rope stretch and careful belaying. Can't remember how many draws are needed for ElChorro but I will tend to take 14 or 15 as standard on this sort of trip

I had the opposite experience the first time I was there - used the full length of a 70m rope on a route that was supposed to be 30m.

These days I just take an 80m for a spanish sport trip by default so I know I'm unlikely to see a route I like the look of and not be able to climb it.
batson - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to Ciro:

Hi does anyone know if a 60m will belong enough for for Lourdes?

thanks
OliBangbala - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to batson: I don't know about Lourdes but i took a 70m and most of the time was quite glad of it, There are loads of routes you can do with a 50m but the more rope you have the more it opens up your options.. There was still the odd time when we got caught out!
OliBangbala - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to batson: it says 35m in my guide so you may struggle with a 60m
jon on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick:

I'm in agreement with Ciro. I think you'll struggle with a 70m. The last time I was there I did a load of routes where 80m was almost too short.
GrahamD - on 20 Nov 2012
In reply to Ciro:

I'm guessing from your profile you were doing harder stuff than we were. We did find the Rockfax pitch lengths a bit suspect at times but all the routes we did in our range we managed OK on a 60m
mikekeswick - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick: Cheers everyone.....still undecided on a 60 or 70 though........aaaaargh! I suppose a 70m makes more sense alround.
floss_81 on 21 Nov 2012
> As you might have guessed i'm off to El Chorro in a few days. I haven't got the guide yet and was wondering what length of rope it's best to take. I'm guessing a 50m is only going to be of limited use so is 60m enough or is it worth getting a 70m. Also how many quickdraws would it be wise to take?
> Cheers.

We all used 60m singles or two 50 twin. I found the 60m single the easiest option. 15 draws sound be enough. Remember to take a few slings and crabs so you can make a via ferreta set up for the walk way. Eat at el rancho down the road, where the locals go. Cheap but tasty. The big hotel giganta was garbage. Enjoy your holidy.
mikekeswick - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to floss_81: El rancho it is then! Thanks for that. Gigantic garbage hotels are out....
Thinking about it i'll probably get more use out of a 60m because it will be fine for all the sport round here too like Malham, Kilnsey etc and it will give me an excuse to do more sport climbing.
thedatastream on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to floss_81:
> Eat at el rancho down the road, where the locals go. Cheap but tasty. The big hotel giganta was garbage.

Really? We ate at La Garganta a couple of weeks ago and the food was great (black pudding and pumkin stew, leg of kid goat, Grandma style pudding.... mmmmmmm). Caveat: we didn't go to El Rancho but it did come recommended.

We also went to the Rocabella up the road past Encantadas. Save yourself the trip, it wasn't great :/
Ciro - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to floss_81:

> Remember to take a few slings and crabs so you can make a via ferreta set up for the walk way.

Watch the DMM video about how to break slings (http://dmmclimbing.com/knowledge/how-to-break-nylon-dyneema-slings/ ), and then bring some old dynamic rope to make a via ferrata setup for the walkway.
GrahamD - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to Ciro:

The walkway is protectable by slings because the cable is horizontal so there will be give in the system there. Its not a standard via Ferrata where you are going to fall directly onto a stanchion.
rocky57 - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to GrahamD:
> (In reply to Ciro)
>
> The walkway is protectable by slings because the cable is horizontal so there will be give in the system there. Its not a standard via Ferrata where you are going to fall directly onto a stanchion.

In all my years that is the first time I've heard that as a reason to not use a VF set on the CDR. If, and it is a big if, you did fall from the walkway. Either by it giving way, or you losing balance, then it would still shock load the wire and in turn the bolts, as well as the sling(s). That is not a situation that I would want to be in. Even a short bit of rope is pushing it a bit. Just my opinion though.
GrahamD - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to rocky57:

We'll have to gbeg to differ on this one. I suspect that all that would happen is that you would slide down to the centre of the wire. Its all speculation really - most people will also be holding their hands on the wire for the thinner sections.
GridNorth - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to rocky57: GrahamD is spot on there is not much chance of shock loading the slings and this is the issue he is addressing.

When I did it I only recall one small section that felt a bit iffy. We didn't have anything but carrying a Via Ferrata kit would have been a bit over the top.
rocky57 - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to GrahamD:

As I said, just my opinion.

However, the wire finishes and starts in many places on a bolt, and if you happened to be on that bit when it popped off then you'd more than likely slide off the end of it. Whatever, eh.
mark20 - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to rocky57:
I've tested it, a short sling and screwgate is fine
Skyfall - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick:

I certainly wouldn't be bothering with a 60m sports rope nowadays (assuming you will be climbing abroad), even if you could get away with it at El Chorro. I made the mistake of getting one when I was just getting into sports climbing and almost immediately had to get a 70m. You won't regret getting a 70m.

There is some sense in getting an 80m as some routes are too long for 70m (we found quite a few at Antalya) and you can also use it more easily for multi-pitch stuff. However, it will weigh a lot that's for sure.
Ciro - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to GrahamD:
> (In reply to rocky57)
>
> We'll have to gbeg to differ on this one. I suspect that all that would happen is that you would slide down to the centre of the wire. Its all speculation really - most people will also be holding their hands on the wire for the thinner sections.

I suspect that's all that would happen too, and to be fair I think the chances of falling off would be pretty slim anyway (I've wandered along it without using anything to secure me).

But if you're going to use protection, why take the risk of using a sling which you know isn't designed to be fallen on, when you can take a few feet of an old rope which you know was designed to hold you?
Ciro - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to mark20:
> (In reply to rocky57)
> I've tested it, a short sling and screwgate is fine

How many falls did you take?
mikekeswick - on 22 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick: Don't worry guys....i'm not going to start shock loading slings by jumping off concrete ledges!! :) I fully understand the implications of fall factors and limitations of slings ;)
Umm maybe a 70 is the way to go?? After all better too much than not enough said the actress to the bishop.
Sean_J - on 22 Nov 2012
In reply to mikekeswick: I've been a lot of times, using a 60 and a 70. I'd recommend a 70 for general peace of mind when lowering off, plus when it wears out and need ends chopping you will still have a useable 60-ish m rope. Re. Lourdes, I think there is a note in the old (2000 or 2002?) guide that a 60m is JUST enough, even though it's 35m long it's so steep that you're OK on a 60. But i've lost that page in ym old guide so can't confirm myself.
rocky57 - on 22 Nov 2012
In reply to Sean_J:
> (In reply to mikekeswick) I've been a lot of times, using a 60 and a 70. I'd recommend a 70 for general peace of mind when lowering off, plus when it wears out and need ends chopping you will still have a useable 60-ish m rope. Re. Lourdes, I think there is a note in the old (2000 or 2002?) guide that a 60m is JUST enough, even though it's 35m long it's so steep that you're OK on a 60. But i've lost that page in ym old guide so can't confirm myself.

From the guide. "Note that many of the routes are at least 30m in length and very steep. It is possible to reach the ground on Lourdes with a 60m rope, but it is a close thing and there's nowhere to go if you find you are a few metres too short. On the less steep routes keep in touch with the other rope as you lower."

I have only watched someone lower off that route once, and he was on a 60m rope. With stretch it was fine, but don't just do it because I said it worked for him.

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