/ Savile s old cottage Glen Coe. Pull it down?

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fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
There seems to be a growing feeling amongst some folks that jimmy Saviles old house in the Glen should be pulled down. I know it does have history as being once Hamish McInnes old residence. To me it always looked completely out of character of the place and maybe its time. What u think?
Jamie B - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

There's been a lot of nonsense talked about this, this is the most sensible contribution that I've read: http://crankitupgear.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/jimmy-savilles-cottage-glencoe.html
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie Bankhead:

This aside we have a building smack bang in the middle of the glen with resin pressed roof tiles ? White upvc windows, upvc patio windows not to mention a very poor extension.

Funny how even in the cities you can't even put a velux window in but you get this in the middle of glen Coe. Not matter it is an eye sore whatever its history.
Dave Kerr - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I think this is really about you getting told you couldn't put a Velux window in.
jonnie3430 - on 11 Jan 2013
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to jonnie3430:
I remember seeing this before and found it really interesting but it didn't change the fact the cottage looks like something you find in the central belt of Scotland rather than glen Coe.
Cuthbert on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Something positive could come of this if the property was used to encourage young people into the hills. Scottish UCPA I say.
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to Dave Kerr

I got 5 but in conservation areas of the city you have to put in the traditional skylights. But white upvc I windows isn't really in keeping is it.

You wonder why planning at least didn't insist on the local slate rather than the roof tiles you buy from B&Q.
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
Really! That's a bit like converting concentration camps after the war into cooker factory's .
Cuthbert on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Yes, I'd like young people to have the opportunity to experience Glen Coe in a setting full of the history of Scottish Mountaineering. Not a direct version of UCPA but you know what I mean.
Tom Last - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:

Agreed. It's not proved that anything untoward actually happened there so the concentration camp analogy doesn't really stand up. What of it anyway, it's only a building after all, but one that it would be unlikely to ever be replaced once gone, even if the need should arise.
Cuthbert on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to Southern Man:

Aye, there is ample accommodation for Geoffries now through club huts and hostels etc. Time for something a bit different. I'd be happy with the original proposal also.
beardy mike - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: so your solution to nasty tiles and PVC windows is to pull a building down? Slightly drastic me thinks when all you need to do is change the tiles and windows. It's a building fer f*cks sake. That used to belong to an evil man. You going to pull the colosseum down because Mussolini went there and it's looking a bit shabby these days? Someone could make that property what it should be rather than spending money on destruction.
craigloon - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> There seems to be a growing feeling amongst some folks that jimmy Saviles old house in the Glen should be pulled down. I know it does have history as being once Hamish McInnes old residence. To me it always looked completely out of character of the place and maybe its time. What u think?

Yes, and while we're at it we should pull down Stoke Mandeville and all the other hospitals and the BBC for good measure. FFS people, get a grip.
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to mike kann:
Nope.
This is the field I work in and find it very surprising this could be found to be acceptable where its situated.
Where else in the glen do you see a build to this spec. I have seen new builds in Glasgow with a more rural spec than that.
Best it gets at least a major overhaul. ( An use the local slate)
fmck - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to craigloon:

Calm yer self were talking about an ugly building in Glen Coe. Just needs a DIY makeover or scrapping. The beast n a track suit only has put it into the lime light.
beardy mike - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: so it gets given to someone who will make good use of it like a charity for kids who give it a major overhaul and then its worthwhile. Bit better than wasting the energy required to pull it down when it could be used for bettering the world.
Jim C - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: my worry is that someone sees the number of people who stop in Glencoe and try and use it for some kind of tourist/retail outlet.
( but a public toilet would be handy if the sewage system it has could cope, which is doubtful.
Dave Kerr - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

So actually its nowt to do with JS, you just don't like the building?
Pursued by a bear - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: Keep it. Find a new use. Saville will pass from public consciousness, though obviously never from that of those he assaulted.

T.
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NathanP - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to Saor Alba)
> Really! That's a bit like converting concentration camps after the war into cooker factory's .

No. That's a bit like insisting on demolishing almost every grand building in Europe in 1945 on the grounds that the Nazis had briefly commandeered them.
Red Rover - on 11 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: I thought they blew it up in Skyfall
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jim C:
It couldn't possibly be used for anything other than a home. Extremely limited parking, its on a bad bend therefore stationry traffic without a doubt leading to accidents. Na stick with the original idea pull it down and restore the glen to its original.
Trangia - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Better still turn it into a public loo? Good place for a final dump before heading up into the hills....
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Trangia:
Na refer to the above.

There's an excellent opportunity to restore this area to its original natural landscape aside anyone who stayed there in the past good or bad.
I wonder just how many folks climbers or walkers were even aware of its past before JS and all the press. If your honest I bet there's very few.
The building has no architectural significance in fact very much the opposite, badly positioned, its history might be romantic to climbers and walkers but that's it. That's the single argument to keep it.

Nope not seen a plausible argument yet other than restoration of the countryside to its original.
Doug on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: "restoration of the countryside to its original"

Would have thought the road was more of an eyesore than Hamish's old house, would you remove that as well?
tradmonkey - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: I think it would be a good idea to turn it into some kind of museum about Hamish McInnes & the work he did there on his axes & stretchers.
craigloon - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

You may be talking about knocking down an ugly building, but most of the chatter about this has been about "erasing the association of the beast with the glen" or some other such nonsense.

Anyway, its no more or less ugly than any of the other buildings in the area. Personally I don't care what they do with it, just the Daily Mailish manufactured hysteria that I find bizarre.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to sloth:

Therefore blasting out the rock hillside in order to provide parking. Yes very sensitive to the glen. NEXT!
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Doug:
Do you not think the road has slightly a tad more of a argument to stay than a romantic idea of times past that few till recently knew anything about.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to craigloon:

It's the opportunity to make good. It's no ones home so wouldn't it be good to restore at least this little corner
beardy mike - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: you're dismissing things as being irrational, but the plain fact is, you're suggesting pulling somewhere down on the basis that:

It has nasty tiles
It has nasty windows
Needs a revamp
Used to owned by a baddy.

Who's the irrational one?
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to mike kann:

Nope. Try reading things properly before.

It's a discussion forum not a planning comitee. If you consider restoring the countryside as irrational behaviour I trust you live in the city.
Offwidth - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: So the victims of Saville must now suffer from us as well, as his assets must be obliterated (rather than forming a compensation pot) to ease our nimbyist concerns.
dek - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to craigloon:
> (In reply to fmck)
> Anyway, its no more or less ugly than any of the other buildings in the area. Personally I don't care what they do with it, just the Daily Mailish manufactured hysteria that I find bizarre.
No more 'hysteriical' than the annual 'demolish the CIC hut'.
Let the locals decide what to become of it!

Tim Chappell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Great idea. While we're at it, let's pull down the Tower of London, Edinburgh Castle, Arthur's Seat, and Holyrood Palace. From what I hear, some pretty rum stuff has happened in all of those places.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Tim Chappell:

Now your being silly and not reading things properly before ranting with your fingers. Lol!
Tim Chappell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Me, ranting with my fingers? Oh you ironist.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to dek:

Does it really belong there? When the radio was in there before mob phones it did help me and many others in the past. No one apart from lazy b######s really need it now.
Steve Perry - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: The house has been around a lot longer than anyone here planning it's demise so how can it be out of place? It appears your "growing feeling amongst folks" is unfounded, in fact I think you made that up.

As previously said on links and posts JS is but a short history in the life of the place and hopefully the local people will get to decide what happens to it but that's doubtful. A bunkhouse for school trips allowing kids to explore the area would be a good idea.
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Offwidth - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Steve Perry:

How can the local people decide in reality unless they buy it (then demolish) or work through the council (which would involve public money for compensation to the owners).
wee jamie on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Steve Perry: Once all this hoo-ha has died down a bit, I'd love to have it as an open art studio/gallery. Parking's a slight issue, but not insurmountable
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to wee jamie:
How would you propose to resolve the parking?

Mr Perry I won't bother answering as he appears to of joined the discussion without bothering reading all the previous posts.
Rock Badger on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: Just burn it, f*"k knows what went on in there
Bruce Hooker - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

It must belong to someone, I imagine he left a will, so it will be up to the new owner to decide. If he or she doesn't have a use for it then the best would be to put it up for sale, someone will buy it... just one iffy owner after several positive ones shouldn't prevent this; anyway people are so fickle that in a year or so it will all have been forgotten except for those directly concerned.

It's been there quite a while, isn't any more out of place than many a traditional house and as for any dark memories it might bring back there are already far darker ones to be had in Glen Coe if you worry about such things.
Bruce Hooker - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to count:
> (In reply to fmck) Just burn it, f*"k knows what went on in there

I know what went on there for years, Hamish Macinnes made ice axes there - I've got one... knocking the house down would turn my axe into an orphan :-(


fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Bruce Hooker:

It's just a discussion as to what folks think should happen to it. I don't think anyone here is under the illusion that we are deciding its fate on UKclimbing.
At least not everyone.
isi_o - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to wee jamie:
Studio/ gallery with a mountain rescue/ ice axe museum in the outbuildings perhaps? Sounds like a great idea to me!
Siward on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to isi_o:

Why not turn it into a Sir Jimmy Saville Museum?





















Coat already got....
BolderLicious - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
Germans still sing their national anthem because Hitler was a small part of the history of germany. Savile was a small part of the cottage's history.
Simon Caldwell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to dek:
> Let the locals decide what to become of it!

What locals? It's 6 miles from the village
MJ - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Siward:

Why not turn it into a Sir Jimmy Saville Museum?

You could have the McInnes museum in the front and then take them around the back for a taste of Savile's contribution.
Simon Caldwell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> Extremely limited parking, its on a bad bend therefore stationry traffic

If it were used as a bunkhouse/hut then there's more than enough space for parking (it's a small building so couldn't fit large numbers in. But in any case, it's 600m from a massive layby/carpark and a wide track leads from it to meet the road just 150m from the building. There's even a pavement at the bridge just west of it.

And though the building is on a bad bend, the access track leaves the road on a fairly straight section further east.
Gordon Stainforth - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: I'm surprised no one's mentioned that Cameron MacNeish has come out v strongly in favour of retaining it, and turning it into some kind of hut, youth centre etc. I support him in this wholeheartedly. Obvious name is the Macinnes Hut (or Cottage). All traces of JS can and should be obliterated. It's only getting this reputation because there's a kind of person who likes reveling in the sick and perverted. Let's move on and celebrate all that Hamish did and stood for.
Cuthbert on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to dek)
> [...]
>
> What locals? It's 6 miles from the village

See if you can work it out. Google is your friend.
Cuthbert on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Agreed. I am against the bunkhouse unless it's aimed at young people. There are already lots of them. However, the origonal idea has merit.
Simon Caldwell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
A couple of farms a mile or two away? The Clachaig? The Kings House?
Nobody local enough to be affected by whatever decision is made. Unless the outbuildings are owned by someone else?
Shani - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I fine with them pulling down this cottage - but let's makes damn sure that before they do, they pull down BBC Broadcasting House, BBC Television Centre, Leeds General Infirmary, Stoke Mandeville Hospital, Broadmoor Hospital, the old Tyne Tees Studios in Newcastle and if they are still standing the Plaza Ballroom on Oxford Street in Manchester (and his old house in Higher Broughton), the Mecca Locarno ballroom in Leeds and the Mecca-owned Palais dance hall in Leeds.

F*ck it; let's also ban the marathon.
Simon Caldwell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> I am against the bunkhouse unless it's aimed at young people

Isn't that what's been suggested? I'm struggling to see a downside.
Colin Wells - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Bruce Hooker:
> (In reply to fmck)
>
> It must belong to someone, I imagine he left a will, so it will be up to the new owner to decide. If he or she doesn't have a use for it then the best would be to put it up for sale, someone will buy it...

It belongs (belonged) to Savile's Leeds-based charitable trust, who, before his fall from grace, had announced plans to convert it into a 'respite centre for the disabled'.

These plans, needless to say, have been somewhat abandoned, if for no other reason than The Jimmy Savile Charitable Trust has now abolished itself, due to terminal embarrassment. I've no idea where this leaves ownership of the property in legal terms - in legal limbo I'd imagine. Perhaps one of our learned friends on here could enlighten us? (PS. I'm quite happy to have it if no-one else wants it)
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fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:
National trust for Scotland?
Cog - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Colin Wells:

It was pointed out last year on this site that JS's assets have been frozen until his victims have been compensated.
toad - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Shani: Add the Royal Marines to that list? The police quote today that he "Groomed the nation" is about right. We were all taken for suckers and knocking down a nondescript house on a busy main road is small potatoes either way.
Cuthbert on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:

No, Lochaber, Glen Coe, Ballachullish. The cultural space of the area.
Simon Caldwell - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
I live in York but wouldn't call the people of Malton 'locals'.

I'm not sure why I'm arguing about this ;-)
Cuthbert on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:

Because it's the way of UKC posters, particularly males from the south, to think that a few climbing trips means they are experts in any issue related to the upland areas of Scotland. Don't worry about it, you are just following the rest ;-)
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:

Local councilor Andrew Baxter stated that demolishing was an end option and had been expressed by local residents.

Google it and you will find it.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I agree with most folks on here that the locals should decide but I don't know if they would agree with their answer.
Another consideration is who vandalised it. I don't think anyone travels a distance to their vandalising site. I reckon its highly likely they were local as well
Steve Perry - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to Toreador)
>
> Local councilor Andrew Baxter stated that demolishing was an end option and had been expressed by local residents.
>
"Highland councilor Andrew Baxter said the local community might want the cottage to be pulled down"

Might! Sounds like someone else doing a lot of presuming.
Cog - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

> I don't think anyone travels a distance to their vandalising site. I reckon its highly likely they were local as well

Yes.

You don't think.
Jamie B - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Steve Perry:

I've seen no evidence that Mr Baxter is speaking for the community (my community) on this matter.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Steve Perry:

I was referring to "the Scotsman" and not the BBC article I see you got that from. BBC dear, dear!
IainRUK - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> (In reply to Toreador)
>
> Because it's the way of UKC posters, particularly males from the south, to think that a few climbing trips means they are experts in any issue related to the upland areas of Scotland. Don't worry about it, you are just following the rest ;-)

Wow.. that chip is getting freaking huge!
IainRUK - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie Bankhead: I wondered that.. an issue in small rural communities is a lone voice can be seen as the community voice far too easily.. although he's a community representative unless he's consulted he's no right to talk at that level..

Would be a pity to have a residence lost up there.. I doubt a new spot could be found due to planning regs so may as well use it..

Some sort of bunkhouse would be good.. just no mention of JS..

I don't see why it should be knocked down at all.. the sooner he's forgotton about the better, but its a great location, so it should be used.
petestack - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie Bankhead:
> I've seen no evidence that Mr Baxter is speaking for the community (my community) on this matter.

Likewise. On which note I've been here since long before Jimmy Savile bought Allt-na-reigh and have a photo of it (as foreground to Gearr Aonach and Aonach Dubh) on my living room wall... think I should take it down? ;-)
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie Bankhead:

Local Aye right bet your an incomer probably English to boot.
IainRUK - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to fmck)
>
> I agree with most folks on here that the locals should decide but I don't know if they would agree with their answer.
> Another consideration is who vandalised it. I don't think anyone travels a distance to their vandalising site. I reckon its highly likely they were local as well

I wouldn't say that.. look at the grafiti in the slate quarries in North Wales?

That could be anyone.. it's right beside the A82.. the major trunk road for anyone traveling to the NW..
petestack - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> It's just a discussion

Diatribe.
Jamie B - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

> Local Aye right bet your an incomer probably English to boot.

Lived in Kinlochleven for the last 10 years. Not sure if that makes me a local or not but I grew up in the Highlands and am definitely not English!
Eric9Points - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Where are you from?

It pretty obvious you're not from the Glencoe area.
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Bruce Hooker - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:

> Because it's the way of UKC posters, particularly males from the south...

Nice one Cyril! I'll remind you of this next time you say you are not anti-English.
fmck - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie

That wasn't a good comment. Apologies.
Steve Perry - on 12 Jan 2013
In reply to Jamie Bankhead:
> (In reply to Steve Perry)
>
> I've seen no evidence that Mr Baxter is speaking for the community (my community) on this matter.

That was exactly my point Jamie.

In reply to fmck:
I emailed Andrew Baxter weeks ago when he first suggested demolition. AS a Highlander whose ancestors were cleared from Knoydart I feel more than enough properties have been demolished over the centuries not to mention those that seem to lie empty for the major part of each year . He didn't reply
fmck - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to The Watch of Barrisdale:

So no comment at present but an empty one on UKCLIMBING. Lol.
k.shark - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: How many people have drove past this house and wished they stayed there? I think you protest to much, huge chip on your shoulder .Have you paint on your hands or a victim ,probably have only seen it on google earth .
Murko Fuzz - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

The truth is I don't know anyone here who wants it pulled down. None of the locals want that.
Leave it alone.

The end.
Cuthbert on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to IainRUK:
> (In reply to Saor Alba)
> [...]
>
> Wow.. that chip is getting freaking huge!

Nah it's the opposite actually. It takes time and and effort to get to know a place. A few climbing trips dont give much of a picture. Unfortunately some genuinely believe that they can make an informed judgement about many issues from a distance and based upon a few, short experiences in the hills. When this is challenged, they react like you have.

Mind you I could be wrong so I have decided to intervene in the care home situation in Bourg St Maurice based on my visit to Les Arcs last week.
Cuthbert on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Bruce Hooker:

I'm not Bruce. I am just anti-pish. Pish is commone to all mankind and you are no exception.
fmck - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to k.shark:

Nope. It was always going to be one sided obviously not much point in that.

Personally I would re roof it with Scottish slate ( Was Hamish responsible for the cheap urban roof tile?), nice trad timber sash windows white upvc doesn't belong in the middle of glen Coe. Get rid of the upvc patio doors.

I think that would look good.
Cuthbert on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I dont have any issues with the windows. White UPVC is common all over the place, Highlands and elsewhere and I dont think many want additional planning regs. I see your point though but think it not that important.

Maybe we should write to the MCofS with suggestions.
Sir Chasm - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: Are you local? Or just a typical ukcer gobbing off?
Cuthbert on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Sir Chasm:

I am not born and bred in Lochaber if that is what you mean but I have 15+ years of working in community development in the Highlands, in particular Lochaber and understand that what is on the internet is often far from reality.

So I represent no-one but I do understand that what is posted on UKC is often nonsense but presented as fact as the poster doesn't know what they don't know, to paraphrase my namesake...

There is a two page article in the Sunday Herald today about the house.
Sir Chasm - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: That'll be a no then. Typical ukcer, are you called Geoffrey?
Siward on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: Isn't the reality that, like any other house anywhere, it will be put on the market, someone will buy it and live in it (or put it to whatever use they see fit)?

The house is private, it is not a public building. Contributors to this thread (me included) have no more say in the matter than they do over what I should do with my own house.
Alan_on_top - on 13 Jan 2013
This is a climbing website....
Dave Kerr - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Alan_on_top:
> This is a climbing website....

No it's not. It's a website for climbers, who being people as well as climbers have opinions on things not to do with climbing.
In reply to fmck:
Whit are yo on aboot?
Raskye - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

> Personally I would re roof it with Scottish slate ( Was Hamish responsible for the cheap urban roof tile?), nice trad timber sash windows white upvc doesn't belong in the middle of glen Coe. Get rid of the upvc patio doors.
>
> I think that would look good.

If you're going that far, then there's also proportionality of the windows, roof pitch, etc etc to address...............

And while you're at it, can we restore Bendy bendy?

fmck - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Raskye:

I just like to see a nice place in keeping with the glen. You on the other hand appear to be straight out a chapter of " zen an the art of motorcycle maintenance"
BTW : Too deep for a make over. Lol!
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fmck - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to The Watch of Barrisdale:

With regards to your post about there being enough clearance of the highlands : Are you for real? Do you live in a cave on the west coast of Jura? Give it a rest we have a different set up in the highlands now. I think we call it 2013 real life!
k.shark - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: If that would please everyone they could give building to me as i build house's .As was already touched on the roof has tiles on because of low angle of roof,would probably need re-roofed then slated .How old is building looks like its from the 50's . You must drive pretty slow to have taken in all that detail i am usually watching for oncoming traffic from corner.
In reply to fmck:
I am real- I have a house in Wester Ross - complete with slates. I speak Gaelic and drink uisge beatha
Slainte mhath, mo ghraidh!
Duncan Bourne - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
Looks very nice. I'd keep it. I've seen worse
Duncan Bourne - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
Sounds good. The actual walls look OK from the photo
Sir Chasm - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Duncan Bourne: Knock it down and build a doran, much more in keeping with the vernacular.
In reply to fmck:
Glencoe actually has quite an interesting history of self-builds, with Jacksonville, the Squirrels Drey and the Rannoch Doss.
In reply to The Watch of Barrisdale:
Not forgetting the Bendy-bendy which has already been mentioned.
Goucho on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Shani:
> (In reply to fmck)
>
> I fine with them pulling down this cottage - but let's makes damn sure that before they do, they pull down BBC Broadcasting House, BBC Television Centre, Leeds General Infirmary, Stoke Mandeville Hospital, Broadmoor Hospital, the old Tyne Tees Studios in Newcastle and if they are still standing the Plaza Ballroom on Oxford Street in Manchester (and his old house in Higher Broughton), the Mecca Locarno ballroom in Leeds and the Mecca-owned Palais dance hall in Leeds.
>
> F*ck it; let's also ban the marathon.

Well said!
Toby S - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to Raskye)
>
> I just like to see a nice place in keeping with the glen.

Much as it would look slightly more aesthetically pleasing with Ballachulish slate and sash windows, I don't think it's worth getting your knickers in a twist about it. Especially when you consider there's a road and numerous laybys right through the middle of it.
splaty on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to mike kann)
>
> Nope. Try reading things properly before.
>
> It's a discussion forum not a planning comitee. If you consider restoring the countryside as irrational behaviour I trust you live in the city.

lol! i live in the country. do yu want to pull my house down too to restore the country side? get a grip!
Jim C - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to mike kann:
> (In reply to fmck) It's a building fer f*cks sake. That used to belong to an evil man. You going to pull the colosseum down because Mussolini went there and it's looking a bit shabby these days?

Or number 10 , because ( enter your own hate figure)
alan wilson on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Sir Chasm: off topic, but why are Dorans not able to get a mortgage on with a bank ??
Jim C - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to Saor Alba)
> [...]
>
> Isn't that what's been suggested? I'm struggling to see a downside.

Having it full of young folk is what Savile would have approved of......
Maybe a reason NOT to do that,

I will stick with my public toilet suggestion, and everyone can piss on his memory.
Sir Chasm - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to alan wilson: I think it's a (possibly misplaced) concern that they won't last as long as the term of the mortgage.
Jim C - on 13 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> (In reply to Sir Chasm)
>
>
> There is a two page article in the Sunday Herald today about the house.

But is it accurate? I take what I read ok UKC with a pinch of salt, but newspapers I would need a cellar.

If you think it is worth reading, I will take your recommendation, and look it up.

fmck - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I was thinking after renovations to make it more in keeping it could be a small inn/pub.

Possibly name it something like " Hamish n Jimmys" that would keep its history also possibly some artefacts around the walls.?
Erstwhile on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to craigloon)
>
> It's no ones home s

It was my home, many years ago. Shame to see it destroyed.

Cuthbert on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

It's already got a name - Allt na Reighe - so doesn't need a new one. The history is way longer than a climbing one.
Cuthbert on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Jim C:
> (In reply to Saor Alba)
> [...]
>
> But is it accurate? I take what I read ok UKC with a pinch of salt, but newspapers I would need a cellar.
>
> If you think it is worth reading, I will take your recommendation, and look it up.

My recommendation is to dig another, larger, cellar for your UKC salt store and add that to your newspaper one.
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Bjartur i Sumarhus on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: How much do you reckon it's worth?
Cuthbert on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Game of Conkers:

What the house? At a guess, 150,000-250,000 leaving aside its current association. Best to ask a solicitor in Lochaber that question.
Rollo - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Erm... wouldn't this have passed to someone else's ownership in his will?

Presubabl they will decide what to do with it. Or is it for sale and I missed it?
PeterM - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

No it shouldn't be pulled down. The tw*ts that vandalised it should be ashamed of themselves.
Tim Chappell - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:
>
Let's move on and celebrate all that Hamish did and stood for.


Hear hear.

Offwidth - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Rollo:

I guess the fruitcakes here just arn't listening as you are about the fourth person to rightly point this out.
Bjartur i Sumarhus on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: Judging by it's location, sounds like a perfect investment holiday let and not very expensive as well if your estimate is correct.
fmck - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Offwidth:

As has been stated twice previously no one believes the fate of the place is being decided on UKCLIMBING its just a discussion of what folks thought. At least maybe there are a couple of fruitcakes on here that actually do think so. Nutters!
Simon Caldwell - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> It takes time and and effort to get to know a place. A few climbing trips dont give much of a picture. Unfortunately some genuinely believe that they can make an informed judgement about many issues from a distance and based upon a few, short experiences in the hills.

What's this got to do with 'the hills'? It's a house in a glen.

After 1 or 2 weeks in the Highlands every year since about 1986, 250+ Munros (about 150 twice), most of the Tops, a few dozen Corbetts, how much longer before I can have an informed opinion?
Offwidth - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

That's your perspective. I see mostly gossips poking into stuff thats none of their business.
Simon Caldwell - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Offwidth:
> I see mostly gossips poking into stuff thats none of their business.

It's none of anybody's business apart from the owners. Doesn't stop anyone else having an opinion though (as long as they've lived in the Highlands for at least 3 generations).
DH3631 - on 14 Jan 2013
Macarthur Stewart were marketing it for a short time last year before it all kicked off. I think it was on at o/o 235k, but couldn't swear to it. A property like that will be difficult to value due to the lack of comparables but the fact that nobody snapped it up at that price may suggest it was on the high side. The fact that it doesn't have mains water/sewerage/power (I believe), plus the noise and lack of privacy, would probably put many people off it as a house though. I dare say traffic on the adjacent trunk road was significantly lighter when it was last in use as a permanent dwelling.
Not aware of any great local enthusiasm to raze it to the ground despite what may have been reported in the media. That is of course leaving aside the small technicality that it is private property. Turning it into some sort of outdoor centre for young people is a nice idea. However, good luck with finding a public/3rd sector organisation with funds to convert, maintain and operate it. A cafe, gallery, museum or visitor centre of some sort might be interesting though not necessarily financially viable, planning consent for change of use could be tricky though, for road safety reasons. If there is a mountaineering club out there looking for a hut, regardless of whether their members are called Geoffrey, to be honest that may be one of the most realistic options as they could probably live with most of the issues. This is leaving aside the Saville connection, which in a few years time will probably be largely forgotten in the history of the glen.
As for the vandal(s), chances are they are not local and will just forget about it and jump on the next tabloid outrage bandwagon whenever that crops up.
Eric9Points - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to DH3631:
> A cafe, gallery, museum or visitor centre of some sort might be interesting though not necessarily financially viable, planning consent for change of use could be tricky though, for road safety reasons. If there is a mountaineering club out there looking for a hut, regardless of whether their members are called Geoffrey, to be honest that may be one of the most realistic options as they could probably live with most of the
issues.

Wouldn't a cafe or gallery break the conditions upon which Unna gave Glencoe to the National Trust? I'd be quite happy to see it remain as private dwelling or a hut or hostel but I don't think I'd like to see it turned into a commercial property of that sort.

This is leaving aside the Saville connection, which in a few years time will probably be largely forgotten in the history of the glen.
> As for the vandal(s), chances are they are not local and will just forget about it and jump on the next tabloid outrage bandwagon whenever that crops up.

Yep.
DH3631 - on 14 Jan 2013
In reply to Eric9Points: The house is outwith the NTS boundary and has never been in their ownership as far as I know, so they would have no interest other than as neighbours.
Young Fox on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
The cottage in its current build is a replacement for the trad slate roofed case and sash windowed previous version that burnt down when Hamish lived there. It was because of the damage and time to rebuild that he moved to Achnacon. Hamish is a true gent and I expect he isn't bothered that much if it stays or goes (although you would have to ask him). The point is that JS is feckall in the buildings history and is no part of the equation. It fair makes my pish boil when folk on here make comments that its miles from any community. Like most community councilors this geezer Baxter (kinlochleven community council NOT Glencoe) is possibly a settler with the time to comment and out of touch. While some community councilors are very genuine locals doing their best for those without a voice, many of the inbound variety from outside are just interfering gits. Same story everywhere I expect.
Jim C - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to Game of Conkers:
> (In reply to Saor Alba) Judging by it's location, sounds like a perfect investment holiday let and not very expensive as well if your estimate is correct.

it is right on a busy road, not sure how noisy it would be in there, and how annoying head lights would be at night or in the winter, I personally don't fancy it if I have to close the curtains all the time, so it is not without issues, but nice enough if it was unmodernised .

petestack - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to Young Fox:
> Like most community councilors this geezer Baxter (kinlochleven community council NOT Glencoe) is possibly a settler with the time to comment and out of touch.

Highland Councillor and sub-postmaster, Davy! Granted that he's a comparatively recent incomer, but he's also a decent guy who cares about the community and I've always found helpful...

> While some community councilors are very genuine locals doing their best for those without a voice, many of the inbound variety from outside are just interfering gits.

So not IMHO an 'interfering git', but that's not to say he's always right (on which note I believe as strongly as you that he's miscalled this one and will tell him so). But let's not see this thread turned into a witch hunt against Andrew Baxter when most folk on here don't know him from Adam and we're probably just looking at knee-jerk reactions (from him and parties unknown*) to the vandalism because that's just not fair!

*If Andrew says local folk have suggested it, then (knowing Andrew) I have to believe that. In which case it becomes all the more important for other local folk to tell him they don't agree.
fmck - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to Young Fox:

Is this true? Was Hamish responsible for the buildings dire sympathetic to its environment build quality.

OMG! I didn't notice before plastic gutters n drain pipes!

OMG!

Where will it end!
IainRUK - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to Young Fox:
> It fair makes my pish boil when folk on here make comments that its miles from any community.

Whilst the locals should have the loudest say.. it's one of the most iconic valleys in the whole of the UK.. from which the local community greatly benefit... outsiders have a perfect right to make comment..
petestack - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to petestack:

From Andrew Baxter (quoted by permission)...

Quote
------------------------------------------------------------
My position has always been that demolition might be a final option if no other use is found for the building and it remains a focus for mindless vandalism. Admittedly, my comments on television didn't demonstrate that last week. Since then, I have plenty of contact from the mountaineering community and also initial discussion with David Gibson from MCofS about the building's future. Last Friday, I took part in a radio phone in on BBC Scotland with Cameron McNeish. We agreed that we would meet up to discuss how we proceed with trying to find a use for the building - such as a club hut. We are likely to meet next week.

If you would be interested in getting involved with assisting in such a project, along with anyone else you would recommend, I would appreciate the help.

Of course, the building still forms part of the Jimmy Savile estate so they still determine its future at the moment. I am keen to get them to transfer it to community ownership.
------------------------------------------------------------
Unquote
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Cuthbert on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to Saor Alba)
> [...]
>
> What's this got to do with 'the hills'? It's a house in a glen.
>
> After 1 or 2 weeks in the Highlands every year since about 1986, 250+ Munros (about 150 twice), most of the Tops, a few dozen Corbetts, how much longer before I can have an informed opinion?

When you live there.

fmck - on 15 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Folks going on about this being a club house or bunkhouse does make me wonder. Given mr J. Saviles life style he probably was w#####g off like a monkey in there or worse. Sod sleeping in there!
Simon Caldwell - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> When you live there.

Even if it were for sale, I couldn't afford it.
biped - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> (In reply to Toreador)
> [...]
>
> When you live there.

So why are you posting here then? I agree with the vast bulk of your posts on these forums but you often display a 'you're not from round these parts' attitude which does your arguments no favours. Am I right in thinking you live in Inverness? It may be in the Highlands but some may regard you as a mere townie.



999thAndy on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:
> When you live there.

Are these local hills, for local people then?
jkarran - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

> There's an excellent opportunity to restore this area to its original natural landscape aside anyone who stayed there in the past good or bad.

Except for the road. And the pub. And the boundries.

> The building has no architectural significance...

Like 99.9% of the homes in the uk then.

> That's the single argument to keep it.

Surely the best argument to keep it is it's a valuable piece of Savile's estate and there's no good reason to do anything but sell it and move on.

jk
MG - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to jkarran: How about UKC "club" hut?!
nw - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Young Fox:
While some community councilors are very genuine locals doing their best for those without a voice, many of the inbound variety from outside are just interfering gits. Same story everywhere I expect.

Presumably he was elected by locals.So if he's doing a job which needs doing, and a number of locals have elected him to do it, is this a bad thing that makes him an intefering git? Or somebody trying to take an active part in their community?
Bjartur i Sumarhus on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba: "When you live there"

Oooh, let your guard down a little bit there. People have their suspicions but you would do well to cover the cracks in your veneer to keep the true colours hidden. That was sloppy

;-)
lummox - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Game of Conkers: Oh I think he let slip quite a while ago..
fmck - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to jkarran:

JK theres little brought to the table from you that hasn't been posted to death already.

I agree sell it. Maybe not the climbing community as they probably wouldn't do much with it but private sale would I imagine.
myserable old git - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: Don't forget the pass he must have driven down it loads of times, DIG IT UP NOW, its our only salvation!
Cuthbert on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Stuart Mitchell:

I merely say that to know a place you need to live there. This is particularly true of the Highlands.

This may run contrary to UKC thinking which appears to be that a few climbing trips means one is well informed about an area, whether Chamonix or Cannich. The reality is that to know any place you need to approach it with an open mind and take time.
Eric9Points - on 16 Jan 2013
In reply to Young Fox:
> (In reply to fmck)
> The cottage in its current build is a replacement for the trad slate roofed case and sash windowed previous version that burnt down when Hamish lived there. It was because of the damage and time to rebuild that he moved to Achnacon. Hamish is a true gent and I expect he isn't bothered that much if it stays or goes (although you would have to ask him).

To go off at at a tangent, how's Hamish getting on these days I guess he must be in his 80's now?

Erstwhile on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
> (In reply to Young Fox)
>
> Is this true? Was Hamish responsible for the buildings dire sympathetic to its environment build quality.
>

Just so people know, after the house was burnt down, Hamish negotiated a deal with the National Trust in which he was loaned the big house down the Glen in exchange for loaning the Trust the house (this was to avoid it being sold - I believe Savile had already offered to buy it all those thousands of years ago). The Trust then renovated and extended the original cottage (and demolished a few things Hamish had constructed, (including a sun-lounge for his (ex) wife). The Trust then used the cottage to house their workers at the old visitor centre. Over time this use was abandoned and the house was put on the market by Hamish, who was again made an offer by Savile (I believe) but instead sold to a couple of doctors living in Glasgow (one of whom was a very active mountaineer at the time). Years later they too chose to sell and finally Savile was able to buy. He drastically changed the interior and the window fixtures, giving the house its present rather excessively modern appearance. He also cut down all the trees planted and protected from sheep in part by Hamish (sitka spruce) and part by myself (Scots pine and rowan) so that (according to popular interpretation) the passing tourist coaches had a clear view into the cottage for JS to wave to his "fans" as they passed.

Nobody has mentioned that the cottage already had a history perhaps even more sinister than the home of a child molester. It was very likely involved in the infamous massacre of Glencoe and the despicable "murder under trust" by the Campbells. My mother used to swear she work up in the night with somebody standing over her in the bed and holding her down. We told her she was just bonkers, but other people, independently, suffered exactly the same experience ...

So what was it that drew Savile to this place?
Why did nobody ever want to live there for very long?
(Time for a letter to Hollywood? "House of the Evil Glen")
Erstwhile on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to Erstwhile:

P.S.
I still have the key to the "original" cottage door, the one that got burnt down.
MG - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to Erstwhile: Thanks for the history!

paul-1970 - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to Eric9Points:
> To go off at at a tangent, how's Hamish getting on these days I guess he must be in his 80's now?

I broke down in the old wreck of a car I once had while taking the old road through the trees at the bottom of Glen Coe one evening. After doing the Basil Fawlty routine of shouting at it for a while in the hope of re-starting it, I then gave up and decided to go to the nearest house to ask to use a phone to phone Chisholms Garage at Ballachulish (I didn't have a mobile with me).

First house I knocked at an old bearded guy came to the door. He kindly said that I didn't need to use his phone, he'd give me a tow to the garage. As he came out and got busy with the ropes and his car I realised who he was.

He then proceeded to give me the fastest and most hair-raising rope tow I've ever had. Much proabably like seconding him on one of his routes. I thanked him kindly and offered him petrol money, but of course he refused and drove off into the evening. I then told the mechanics at the garage about the high-speed tow and who had been the driver. "Aye, that's Hamish" was the nonchlant reply.
drmarten on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to paul-1970/Erstwhile :
Thanks for those posts, both entertaining in their own ways.
off-duty - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

I would imagine that since it is a valuable asset in Js estate then it is unlikely to be given to anyone or handed over for anything less than market value. The impending civil claims should put paid to that idea.
I'm not sure that "the community" will have much say in its future
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Bruce Hooker - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to Saor Alba:

> I merely say that to know a place you need to live there.

How many years did you live in Westminster then? Quite a few I imagine the way you lecture us about the place :-)
Bruce Hooker - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to off-duty:

> I'm not sure that "the community" will have much say in its future

I'm not really clear why people think they shoud.
Jim C - on 17 Jan 2013
In reply to paul-1970:
> (In reply to Eric9Points)
> [...]
>
> I broke down in the old wreck of a car I once had while taking the old road through the trees at the bottom of Glen Coe one evening. After doing the Basil Fawlty routine of shouting at it for a while in the hope of re-starting it, I then gave up and decided to go to the nearest house to ask to use a phone to phone Chisholms Garage at Ballachulish
>
> First house I knocked at an old bearded guy came to the door. He kindly said that I didn't need to use his phone, he'd give me a tow to the garage. As he came out and got busy with the ropes and his car I realised who he was.
>
> At primary school I won a prize for just stopping opposite the Christmas tree during a spot waltz. Ever since I have (tongue in cheek) claimed to be a 'prize winning dancer' despite that I have two left feet, but I never elaborate, and infer I don't like to boast.

If what happened to you, had happened to me, I would forever have claimed to have 'done a Route' with the great man. ( The fact that it was just a car a route to a garage matters not a jot)
Chisholm's Route would be a good name.

David Myatt - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to Erstwhile: The Glasgow doctors still climb. I was out with one of them last month. They only chose to sell because they were fed up with folk breaking in and stealing their climbing gear. Nothing else ever went, so must have been "fellow" climbers. Before selling, to share the responsibility of the place, they offered me a half share, but we'd just moved and doubled our mortgage, so not a good time. We did though have keys to the cottage for several years and had some great times there and never saw a ghost.
It is very small inside and with the water supply being from the burn and electricity from the generator (even after installing the auto-start) its not an ideal premises. Road noise was an issue. Pulling it down though would be stupid.
David
nw - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
What happened there?
fmck - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to nw:

Where?
fmck - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

It's all been a bit of a contradicting journey of " oh it's no different to the rest of the houses there" to " what neighbours it's an isolated cottage in the middle of the glen" and similar p##h of that nature.

Removing the road? Yeh right where? the A 9 to Fort William. This would make a lot of sense compared to an ugly cottage. ( JS is an excuse to remove it not a reason)

All the same the resident ghost already present apparently holds people down in their beds! Yeh sounds like a good accomplice to some other departed person. Good luck with that as a bunkhouse.

Btw : I think the road has been very sympathetic to the environment compared to the cottage of plastic. I take it the glen must be a Conservation area with planning now so probably wouldn't be allowed as a new build now. Def needs a refurb if its going to stay.
nw - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:
Someone making allegations about someone else, post disapperared pretty sharpish.
fmck - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to nw:

Did this happen here or somewhere else that only you think is real?
fmck - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to nw:

Nw my mother has dementia and this has some creepy similarities. You ok? Jimmy savile isn't that important.
nw - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck: You don't know man..you weren't there
fmck - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to nw:

Ah ok!
Erstwhile on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to David Myatt:
> (In reply to Erstwhile) The Glasgow doctors still climb. I was out with one of them last month.

Say hello to them from me next time you see them - they will remember me as the daft colonial Scot who lived there two families before them. I also slept there once or twice after they had taken over, and we (Edinburgh climbing gang) used to go down from the Drey to warm up. (Some among us may have had other motives.)

You might mention I am now in an even better placed location for climbing, in the Italian Dolomites, if they are ever over this way I could return the favour.
Mike Peacock on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to Erstwhile:
> (In reply to fmck)
> [...]
> My mother used to swear she work up in the night with somebody standing over her in the bed and holding her down. We told her she was just bonkers, but other people, independently, suffered exactly the same experience ...
>

That has sleep paralysis written all over it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_paralysis

It's a pretty horrible thing to experience, and easy to attribute to malevolent forces if you don't know what it is.
fmck - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Just a thought but wouldn't it's removal allow the road to be straightened out and possibly better parking for the start of AE ridge. If tastefully done like they did with the bridge replacement ( using natural stone etc) it would work.
Cuthbert on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Obvious answer is yes but a better solution would be a tunnel. Oh wait, there's no money for that...
Erstwhile on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to Mike Peacock:
That's what I told my old Mum. However, a girlfriend of mine (who I had definitely never told anything of my mother's experience) visiting woke up in the night screaming with the same sensation, so that does make one wonder a bit. There were other strange "details" too.
fmck - on 22 Jan 2013
In reply to Erstwhile:

Ok give in. Lets hear the rest. Sounds like a Ben Alder job . Maybe better?
fmck - on 26 Jan 2013
In reply to

Any truth in the rumours that two guys clearing snow round there go by the names of Gary Gritter and Jimmy shovel?
nufkin - on 26 Jan 2013
In reply to fmck:

Nice one
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