UKC

I'd like to buy my daughter a sleeping bag for her (4th) birthday. To date she's been using one of ours, which works well. Unfortunately, all the junior ones seem to be less well insulated. Looking for something with a comfort rating of at least 0, preferably -5, and ideally available in red, or purple, or, if I must, pink.... Sparkly also good.

In reply to Nutkey: There aren't many kids' bags designed for temperatures that low, I've looked. If Alpkit have theirs in stock that might be your best bet. My son has used his basic kids mummy bag inside one of my down bags and was happy at -8, but he was a couple of years older than your daughter.

There's at least one UK webshop that specialises in kids outdoor stuff, and they'll have what other bags are available. Oddly, like rucksacks, chances are it will be German - Deuter and Jack Wolfskin. They do much more kids stuff.

In reply to Nutkey:

Alpkit do (did?) a kids down one, quite reasonably priced (£60) for what it is. In red

Can't find it on their website at the moment, might be worth emailing them (I think a lot of their sleeping bags were out of stock whilst they revamped the range?) - it was called the SkyeHigh 250.

My 4 year old is using it at the moment - his 7 year old brother would still fit it, but I've evicted him to a short adult bag. Great if you want them to be able to carry it for wild camps, but obviously needs a bit more care, so might not be so good for Scout camps/sleepovers, etc

Otherwise, synthetics - Vango OKish, and these a bit better I think http://www.outdoorsmagic.com/reviews/sleeping/synthetic-bags/ajungilak-litt...

In reply to Nutkey: http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/ayacucho-sky-250-junior-sleeping-bag-2012-82...

I bought my daughter this bag for wild camping in NE Scotland. It's ok for 3 season use but I wouldn't recommend for winter. Good luck with the search. It's hard to find "proper" sleeping bags for kids!

In reply to Nutkey:

the alpkit bag, skye high 250, is only suitable for hut use according to alpkit.

I can confirm it's not suitable for wildcamping - not warm enough

hopefully they will come back with a warm kids bag

not sure anyone else makes one but if i had to guess the scandinavians take keeping warn fairly seriously

practically 2 small bags one inside the other works (that's how we utilise the alpkit 250)

In reply to John Kelly:

I think only hut use is a bit tame - We've found the Alpkit one fine for wild camping in UK summer, so down to somewhere under 10 degrees - maybe equivalent to a 2 + season adult bag? (Which would fit - it's about half the weight of down in half the size of bag) Kids have tended to sleep in thermals too (to cut down on clothes carried), and they always seem to be hot anyhow. But yes, unlikely to do down to zero or below without extra layers of some kind.

In reply to Carolyn:

we used it on clear summer nights at 2000ft and it didn't cut the mustard

its a nice bag but for what i need
it could do with the skye high 600 fill equivalent
it could stand being a few inches longer

for me disappointing.

In reply to Nutkey: Snugpack have two junior ones marked as spring use.
http://www.snugpak.com/outdoor/laponie-junior-square
I don't know this product but my older kids use the adult ones and find them good.
sjm

In reply to Nutkey:
http://www.yetiworld.com/produkte/schlafsaecke/junior/vibjunior.html
About £320, the colour may not be suitable.

In reply to Nutkey: Just buy an adult sleeping bag and tuck the excess at the foot end underneath, worked for us

In reply to Nutkey:

In defence of the AlpKid, we had the 5yo in one this spring on the Annapurna Base Camp trek. Admittedly, this was hut use, but it got below zero at altitude and the bag was fine with a single thermal layer (not so the OH in a Vango venom 300). Previously had no problems either in the low single figures outside, provided a decent sleeping mat was used - kids being smaller have a greater surface area: volume ratio, which means that they lose proportionally more heat through ground contact than do adults.

Also, we had the 10yo in a Trimm junior sleeping bag, which I got off Sport Pursuit. It's rated to -2C and certainly seemed OK. Thirty quid, and I'd say good value; they tend to pop up quite regularly in the general equipment sales on the site. Did come in blue, though.

(logged in on wife's account)

Martin

In reply to maisie:

'kids being smaller have a greater surface area: volume ratio, which means that they lose proportionally more heat through ground contact than do adults'

I don't think your suggestion that kid loose more heat through contact with the ground than adults rings true.
I agree that kids have a greater surface are to vol. ratio and that makes them generally more vulnerable to getting seriously cold very quickly. However i don't think children contact the ground proportionally more than an adult would and therefore the proportion of heat lost through he ground remains the same - i think

In reply to John Kelly:

It's actually a long-established principle: best places to look for info are references for paediatric anaesthesia or sports physiology. Conductive heat loss in children is relatively greater than in adults.

But now I'm sounding like an arse, which wasn't my intention

The point I was making really is that decent insulation under the sleeping bag is even more important in kids, and upgrading a mat can extend the comfort range of the bag by a few degrees.

Unfortunately, there's relatively little work done on kids' bags in terms of lower comfort ratings, for fairly obvious reasons. This means that information comes mainly from parents' reviews, which inevitably tend to be subjective and, as can be seen here, quite variable. I think most manufacturers would be shy about producing really high performance bags for littlies, because there's too much potential for it to be a sh*tstorm. I had a bit of a chat with alpkit a couple of years ago about upgrading the alpkid, but they were quite happy about where they were/are. Frustratingly, they don't seem to have much intention of producing a bag for older kids either.

Hope this isn't taking it too much off topic, or destroying everybody's will to live.

Martin

In reply to Nutkey: Our eldest has a TNF synthetic which is OK - warm enough but he's a warm sleeper. The little fella has one I picked up cheap in the US (but is available in the UK, sometimes through sportspursuit at a good discount):

https://www.bigagnes.com/Products/Detail/Bag/littlered2012

It's a synthetic half-bag, you slip a thermarest or similar down the sleeve at the back. It's very warm and cosy, I'm positively jealous on cold nights at how snuggly he is in it.

Being synthetic most kids bags pack down to approximately the interior volume of a large expedition pack, so some sort of compression stuff sack is in order if it needs to be carried by you.

HTH

b

In reply to Nutkey: should have mentioned the major bonus is the mat down the back, as it is impossible for even the wriggliest sleeper to fall off the sleeping mat in the night (and so wake up cold, needing a cuddle at 3am etc).

b

In reply to maisie:

I agree, I think it's pretty subjective. 4 yo was fine wild camping in the alpkit one in the lakes last night (despite failing to remain on the thermarest at all), maybe 5 or 6 degrees. I was on the edge of chilly in an old ME 500 fill bag, that the label claims is good to -5. OH was toasty in N identical bag, and wearing shorts/t-shirt, whereas I was in thermals...

Shame they have no plans to make a larger kid bag, 7 year old was OK in a short adult one, but I'd have bought him an in between one if they made it, if only because it's less bulky for him to carry.

In reply to Carolyn:

>Shame they have no plans to make a larger kid bag, 7 year old was OK in a short adult one, but I'd have bought him an in between one if they made it, if only because it's less bulky for him to carry.

Get on to Alpkit! I literally can't find a down sleeping bag in the UK for the 7-12yo age range; I suspect PHD could do me one up, but we'd have to stop eating for a couple of months to afford it. It's always seemed a bit odd that alpkit do a bag for up-to-7 year olds, but nothing thereafter, 'cos there has to be a market for it.

In reply to maisie:

Yup, I'll drop them an email. Does seem to be a bit of a gap, and you'd think it was at about Alpkit's balance between quality and price. The German one someone linked to above looks great (though with two kids with a 3 year gap, I'm not bothered actually about having an extending one as they pass down) but price is beyond what I'm prepared to pay for kids kit for UK use,,,,,

In reply to Nutkey:
You haven't stated your intended use, but if comfort & warmth are your main concern then you'll probably find it hard to beat the Vango Sonno Junior, e.g. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vango-Sonno-Junior-Season-Sleeping/dp/B00AKW1XU4/re...
for UK campsite use. At £25 it's a steal.

It doesn't fit your colour/sparkle requisites & is quite bulky, but we were so impressed with the one we bought for our eldest last year that we've just bought one for our 4yo. Our 7yo is tall but I think we'll get a couple more years out of her's at least.