UKC

I read an old thread about staying in Cham on the cheap earlier - one of the points made was that sometimes tents can be confiscated from those camping on the Col du Midi.

The author advised digging a snowhole instead. Apparently it's a lot sturdier in storms than a tent (fair enough) and there's obviously no risk of confiscation.

I've never actually stayed in a snow hole before so this might be a completely ridiculous question, but digging a snowhole on a glacier and then sleeping in it seemed a little bit silly to me. What if there's a crevasse underneath, and you weaken the snow bridge by digging out a huge section of it?

Feel free to tell me if I'm being stupid, but I'd appreciate any input...

In reply to alexm198:

I've never slept in a snow hole either, but I think the common practice is to probe the area first, and obviously dig it away from frequently used tracks in the snow, and away from the base of slopes in case of avalanche or falling seracs etc.

In reply to alexm198:

I have slept in snow holes both on and off glaciers. I've always found sleeping on ice uncomfortably cold no matter how many karrimat/thermarest you use. Yes it a good idea to check that you aren't building you hole over a crevasse. But you can sometimes put your hole inside one.
The question is "why" would you go to all that trouble to dig a snow hole at the Col du Midi. There's a great big hut there. For a few quid you can have a warm dry bed and a cooked meal. Ok the new hut isn't as good as the old one but it's a f**k sight better than a hole in the ice.

In reply to OwenM:

I take it you're talking about the Cosmiques hut? If so, I think it's a bit more than a few quid! Plus it's privately owned, isn't it? So no reciprocal rights discount...?

In reply to OwenM:


Completely agree. Kind of misses half the fun of climbing in the Alps for me if you're going to sleep in tents / snow holes and all the associated cooking / dampness / educed comfort etc that goes with it.

Save the camping for when you need to in the Alps, i.e. not 200m away from a hut!

No doubt someone will be on in a moment to tell me that they get the best sleep they've ever had in a snow hole, huts are for wankers and I'm doing it wrong if 7 months in the Alps costs me more than £9 including getting there and a new pair of ronhills...

In reply to alexm198:

Won't digging into a solid glacier (ice?) be somewhat harder than say doing the same in Scotland?

In reply to Dave Perry:


Exactly my thoughts. In high Summer you'll be lucky to get more than a couple of feet into a glacier without hitting something with the consistency of marble. Unless that is, the Midi area is a huge snow collector by wind deposition in storms?
Maybe I'm wrong on this one...?

In reply to alexm198:

Re tent confiscation, I have seen the Gendarmes using the helicopter's downdraught to flatten tents and I'm sure French taxpayers would be delighted to know their money was being spent so effectively but I don't think it happens very often as usually there seem to be tents there all the time.
Legally you are allowed to bivi between sunset and sunrise, in practice if you take your tent down before you set off for your route you'll be fine. Just pull the poles out and collapse it, you don't need to pack it away, a lot easier than digging a snow hole which somebody would probably stand on anyway and impale you on the end of their crampons.

In reply to Edradour:


On the otherhand, some people might think being self sufficient and sleeping under the stars rather than isolating yourself from the mountains in a noisy, hot man made environment was half the fun?


Don't know about the Ron Hills but if you hitch £9 should see you through the season

In reply to Dave Perry:

I meant digging into the snow that had accumulated on top of the glacial ice - I was under the impression that a fair amount of snow lies on top of the Vallée Blanche, even in the summer. Whenever I've seen tents on the Col du Midi they've always had enough snow to excavate down so the tent isn't completely exposed.

I would've thought some of the bigger windscoops might still accommodate a snowhole even late in the season, but I might be wrong.

Yeah - I don't quite subscribe to the 'missing the point' argument! Call me a masochist, but I think a lot of the fun is being self sufficient and doing it on the cheap - even if it is a bit cold and damp at times.

In reply to alexm198:

Last time I was in the Cosmiques was around March a few years ago and there where two hot Guardiennes and wine on tap for a not completely unreasonable price. Me and me brah polished of a bottle each then hit up the Chere Couloir next day.

What's not to like?

In reply to alexm198: Camping below the midi has many advantages, One trip up the cable car with enough food and fuel for two weeks. No valley campsite fees, no more cable car fees, no spending in bars and cafes. You get really well acclimatised and have stacks of routes to go for and should be the first on them. A snow hole would be grim for two weeks and not worth the effort for one or two nights, The hut would be far to expensive for a long stay.

In reply to alexm198:

You'd dig the snow hole in the snow not the ice which would be a bit too much like hard work. Another point to bear in mind in well frequented spots in the Alps is that many have gone before and didn't have access to toilet facilities so be careful where you are digging! The same goes for digging snow to melt .

As said above bivvying from dusk to dawn in French National Parks is tolerated so if you take a light tent and take it down during the day you'll have no trouble. In fact in most places off the beaten track you'll have no trouble if you leave it up - makes finding it again easier when you come back in the evening too.

In reply to Bruce Hooker:


Absolutely. The Midi plateau can be kinda gross in that respect - particularly if you think you are going to melt snow for water.