/ Does this tent exist

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CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
After a lot of looking around, i've yet to find a tent to meet all of my criteria:

2 man.
Under 2.5kg-3kg.
SilNylon outer with a decent denier (i.e. not something flimsy like 15).
Pitches outer first for UK weather.
Is stable in high winds.
Under 350

I've found multiple tents that meet all but one criteria, the closest i've found is the Nordisk Oppland 2 Si for 360 and 2.9kgs

Maybe i've just got to bite the bullet and get a Hilleberg tent...
HeMa on 27 May 2014
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to HeMa:

Looks pretty good! Good find :)
mickyv33 - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Maybe give these guys a look:
http://www.lightwave.uk.com/products/tents/mtn
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to mickyv33:

Cheers, yea i've looked a lot at these. Most are inner pitch first. Though the only one that's really cheap enough for me is the T20 Trail XT which is 400 and 3kg.
sbc_10 - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

This one may suit your needs...

http://www.tarptent.com/scarp2.html

..has a clever exoskeleton that can be added in rough conditions.

ben b - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Stephenson's Warmlite 2R.

Next...

b
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to sbc_10:

I really like the look of these, and have had rave reviews. But ends up pretty expensive after import tax and shipping.
Flinticus - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Exchange rate is pretty good though: Scarp 2 with solid interior and cross poles with shipping is $456 = 270.

Don't know what the import tax would be however.
kestrelspl on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Marmot Grid
ben b - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

http://warmlite.com/tents

Well under 2kg, 2 man, stable, exchange rate favourable, outer first. What's not to like?

:-)

b
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to Flinticus:

About 370, import tax is a rip!
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to ben b:

Outdoor gear lab's review shows poor build quality, big flaw being that it's only got one stake point. So on soft ground it could collapse in high winds.
Not sure i like the single skin premise. Perhaps for drier climates, but certainly not lakes/Scotland.
tripehound - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Duomid or solomid are brilliant. They do a mesh inner although Oookworks can do you an inner but there is a waiting list.

http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com/shop/index.php?cPath=47

http://oookworks.com
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Anyone got any experience with Force Ten tents? The Ion 2 looks pretty good. Just put off by the fact it's Vango. Gear snob coming out in me.
In reply to CharlieMack:
Perhaps tents where inner and outer go up together are optimal but I really think the idea that you 'need' outer pitching first for the UK is bullsh*t. I can pitch my inner first Terra Nova, on my own, in the dark and rain in a few minutes. The inner is lightly water-repellent anyway but you just chuck the fly over whilst still putting in the poles if you are really worried.

It's never even been a big issue with my one man which is only a mesh inner either.

But what about Macpac? Does their smaller two man fit your criteria? I think they go up inner and outer together.
Post edited at 12:02
In reply to CharlieMack:
> Anyone got any experience with Force Ten tents?

My mate was having a few zip issues with his in Norway this summer, but it is about 25 years old and has been used in wild mountains around the world so he was quite forgiving! :-) Their top of the range ones seems to very well liked by experienced users so probably well worth considering.
Post edited at 12:02
OwenM - on 27 May 2014
CharlieMack - on 27 May 2014
In reply to TobyA:

My previous tent was a mainly mesh inner, so obviously whenever i put it up in the rain, the insides were all pretty wet.

I think i might be choosing between the Ion 2 or the Vaude Odyssee power 2. Both seem more or less the same.

The macpac tents seem to be just PU coated with a low H/H.
mickyv33 - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Do you really need outer pitch first?
I've pitched my terra nova quasar in downpour before and it gets a tad but it soon dries out because the wall material is thin and well ventilated.
There's maybe not as much of an advantage in outer pitch first.

Personal preference I suppose.
Ramblin dave - on 27 May 2014
In reply to mickyv33:

> Do you really need outer pitch first?

> I've pitched my terra nova quasar in downpour before and it gets a tad but it soon dries out because the wall material is thin and well ventilated.

Yeah, I'd second this. It's nowhere near as big a thing as I expected it to be.

SidharthaDongre - on 27 May 2014
In reply to mickyv33:

I'd third this, (fourth if we count Toby), but with reference to the Alpkit Kangri.
Skol on 27 May 2014
In reply to mickyv33:

I've always had inner pitch first tents and had no problems.
My mate purple mick , had a ? Saunders spacepacker which pitched outer first. The distinct advantage being that you could leave the inner at home in good weather, and have a large tarp:)
Mr-Cowdrey on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

I've always been under the impression that "inner pitched first" tents are more stable in high winds etc, or have I been ill informed?

I have the Terra Nova Superlight Voyager and that's an inner pitch first, but have had no issues with the inner wetting out when pitching in rain or snow, it'll dry quite quickly once inside and cooking.
neil9216 - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:
I have a hilleberg nallo gt2
We have been thinking about selling and i have been checking ebay lately to get an idea of how much they are going for.
They seem to be averaging between 350 and 400 depending on condition.
A used one around 5 years old in mint condition went for 380 a few days ago.
From your post this tent would certainly fit your needs and I can vouch for the tent being awesome.

We won't be in a position to buy a new tent until nearer Xmas so won't sell ours just yet
However if you keep an eye on ebay you may just pick one up




stevenbreeze - on 27 May 2014
Castleman - on 27 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

I had a forerunner to that Vaude one mentioned at the top of the thread. It always did really well for me. Great design.
Dave Rumney - on 28 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:
MacPacs go up outer first (with inner normally already attached) for about that price - takes about 3-4 mins to put up ready to put stuff inside. Good quality tent and never had a problem with them in high winds and very waterproof. I've had a small minaret and currently have the larger Olympus.

My only complaint would be about having to seal the seams myself, but I get the impression that some other makes have that feature too.
Post edited at 00:06
forcan - on 28 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

I'd have to suggest the Blacks Octane 3 - I've had one since 2006, and can't fault it. comes in at just under 3kg, space for 3 if required, otherwise very comfortable for 2, and the porch is almost the same size as the sleeping area. Siliconised nylon flysheet, and the outer pitches first ( you can all get inside the flysheet and then put the inner up!). And the best bit? It's 180 just now...
alimckay on 28 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

How about:-

http://tinyurl.com/ndswbrc (quite small for two people but well under your weight limit)

http://tinyurl.com/lykuqc4 (bit bigger but a bit more expensive and a bit heavier, but still under your weight limit)
The Ex-Engineer - on 28 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack: Just to echo what others have said - get a decent inner first tent.

I spent a good 40+ nights under canvas in the wet Summer of 2012. Every inner first tent I had the misfortune of using with groups was an utter nightmare. There is just no easy or quick way of getting them dried out during/after an expedition. By comparison, free standing inner first tents (especially if you use a footprint) are a complete doddle to get dried in around 20 minutes of bright sunshine or moderate wind.

I wouldn't even consider most outer first designs for heavy UK use.
CharlieMack - on 29 May 2014
In reply to forcan:

Had a look at the 2 man which looks good though not having silicone sheet.

Think im just going to get a lightwave g20 trek. Unless anyone knows where to get a trek xt or ultra for cheap/ second hand?
CharlieMack - on 29 May 2014
In reply to alimckay:

Look not as sturdy as the lightwave and about 100 more expensive. Though a bit lighter. I think I'd prefer hardiness over a slight lightness advantage.
Stash - on 29 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

just buy a Hilleberg Nallo 2 and get a little deeper in to your pockets
mikehike on 29 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Have a look at Tarptent website.
I did and bought two, The double Rainbow and the Contrail.
We wild Camped the West Highland way in the Double Rainbow.

http://www.tarptent.com/cloudburst3.html

just buy one you wont regret it.
mh
sebflynn - on 29 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:
mountain laurel designs super tarp fit's the criteria.
Post edited at 18:26
CharlieMack - on 29 May 2014
In reply to sebflynn:

A tarp?! Really... Stable in high winds? I think not.
sebflynn - on 30 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Tell mark Twight that they are unstable in high winds, i think he may disagree with you.
cas smerdon - on 30 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

http://www.ukcampsite.co.uk/tents/p/Wild-Country-Duolite/1592

I have one of these. Pretty stable and quick to pitch. Keep inner attached and just lay out tent and clip onto poles.

I don't think they are available new anymore.
Bob_the_Builder - on 30 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

I have the g2 Ultra and its a sexy tent. Its light enough for solo camping and its comfortable for 2 people. Good in wind if pitched tail into the wind. The porch can be a bit fiddly, and difficult to find a good place for a stove if the wind is wrong.
But light and seems strong.

I'm looking at a tarptent though. They're cool!
ads.ukclimbing.com
sebflynn - on 31 May 2014
In reply to Bob_the_Builder:

be aware that if you are after a good (stable) tarp you will have to buy from a small company, the best tarp on the market is the one i mentioned earlier, the mountain laurel designs super tarp what's good about this tarp is that it's sil nylon so it wont cost an arm and a leg like cuben fiber tarps do, it also has top notch build quality and near perfect tie out points, somthing you wont find on most tarps.
CharlieMack - on 31 May 2014
In reply to sebflynn:

Seb, its very impressive that you've read soneones book or blog somewhere. But you do realise that they use it in the alps or high ranges where weather is more predictable and more importantly, much dryer.

Tarps are a nice light way to get by in the mountains. Not comfortable when the wind is whistling through them. Have you actually tried one?
I've already got a tarp and im painfully aware of its uses through, you know actually having one and using it in UK conditions.

I know that you're just trying to help and you've maybe just discovered a new thing. But its really not helpful. And talking condescendingly to someone about something you've clearly little experience in won't get you very far at all on UKC.

Anyway I've ordered a terra nova voyager, so looking forward to that arriving soon to go and play in the wet and windy mountains of UK.
In reply to sebflynn:

> the best tarp on the market is the one i mentioned earlier, the mountain laurel designs super tarp

How many other tarps have you tried and in what conditions?
5tormin' on 31 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

You've picked a dinosaur which will take at least
10 minutes to pitch,overpriced and a condensation generator.Go for MLD or Henry Shires Tarptent,look
at the range available,all better than your dog kennel choice.You obviously think you know it all
but a little knowledge is a dangerous thing!
CharlieMack - on 31 May 2014
In reply to 5tormin':

Its perhaps not the best choice. But im getting it for 250 through a mate. So im wiling to firgive sone short commings for low price. Im aware that it's a slow pitch, but as its for 2 of us it shouldn't take too long.
I'm more than aware that I dont know it all.
I'd be surprised if it really was as bad as you're making out given that it gets such high praise by so many seasoned review panels over so many years. And that it has been updated with materials in 2010 but not design. If it ain't broke don't fix it.
I've not used it myself so can't comment yet, but a few friends have it and many regard it as a benchmark lightweight 2 man tent. So we shall see how it goes.
5tormin' on 31 May 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

With only one entry this TN semi geodesic design was copied from Bob Saunders back in the 80's,his was called the Felltrek but had 2 entrances, front and rear.Better for through ventilation and only 2 poles,pitched in 5 mins.weight about 2.4kg.
2 doors easier for 2 people,look on fleabay or or similar.
CharlieMack - on 31 May 2014
In reply to 5tormin':

There are a plethora of tents with this design now. There are only so many ways to set up some fabric and poles.
There are tents with more current fabrics that are similar to that design with two entrances. Macpac do one that's more or less the same.
I'd be surprised if a tent from the 80's was more waterproof than one with more current fabrics, but im always happy to be surprised.
My order for the TN is going on Monday, so I've got this weekend to find anything better.

The force 10 ion or the vaude odyssey are the only two at the mo that might tempt me otherwise. Though both are quite a lot more expensive than what I can get the voyager for.
malk - on 31 May 2014
In reply:
any thoughts on this for a budget hike'n'bike tent?
http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/vango-banshee-200-tent-p140006


CharlieMack - on 31 May 2014
In reply to malk:

Cheers for the suggestion. Doesnt look to bad for a vango (had bad e e experiences in the past) popping into go outdoors today. Their geodesic tent looks quite good too. North ridge silicone outer with bathtub inner. 2.8kgs but only 190.
malk - on 31 May 2014
In reply to sebflynn:

> be aware that if you are after a good (stable) tarp you will have to buy from a small company, the best tarp on the market is the one i mentioned earlier, the mountain laurel designs super tarp what's good about this tarp is that it's sil nylon so it wont cost an arm and a leg like cuben fiber tarps do, it also has top notch build quality and near perfect tie out points, somthing you wont find on most tarps.

chris townsend rates them: http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/2012/03/trailstar-wars.html

can't be that difficult to copy/ make yourself? are there any uk companies making similar tarp tents?
sebflynn - on 01 Jun 2014
In reply to TobyA:
no other tarps tried though 60 mph winds, 80mph gusts and was very stable slept straight through the night, while the rest of my group suffered in noisy tents(which funnily enough where terra nova voyagers.)
Post edited at 02:04
sebflynn - on 01 Jun 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

What are these mystical "UK conditions" that suddenly make tarps fall flat and makes the fabric into mesh, if you cant use a tarp in wet weather look at ultra light hikers in the pacific north west they either use a bivi, mesh bivi or use a mesh insert so next time you spend a night in your tarp try using any of the above (bivi bag is best for mountain use). There is lots of stuff out there to help you (an entire internet) with adapting you're tarp to different weather so don't just give up on it go out there and look for a solution that isn't getting another tent.
5tormin' on 01 Jun 2014
In reply to CharlieMack:

Take a look at this review before you buy
the TN Voyager
http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/?page_id=92628
CharlieMack - on 01 Jun 2014
In reply to sebflynn:

Its not that they turn them to mesh, whatever that means... I want a tent for work so ive got an area to organise in the evening without wind coming through underneath the tent, have some privacy and be able to sit up properly. In my experience you can have a high tarp to let air through. Or in storm mode where its down in front of your face and is much more prone to condensation, especially in very wet conditions.
CharlieMack - on 01 Jun 2014
In reply to 5tormin':

That's the super light version. I intentionally steered clear of that after having a look at one. Agreed that its a bit flimsy material and attachments via hooks you may as well have an outer first pitch tent.
Interesting about the center seal leaking. I've not come across that before. Not sure whether seam seal will do a better job than glue.
Bob_the_Builder - on 03 Jun 2014
In reply to malk:

I've got an older Banshee and I like it, but I can't sit up in it and there's no way it is a 2 man tent! Maybe its bigger than it used to be, I don't know.

Add to that the tunnel design which only works if you have at least a couple decent peg places. The old design was 6 pegs minimum for a decent pitch (getting the vents open) in no wind, this one looks like it needs more.

But with the Lightwave g2 ultra being hardly any heavier, way more roomy, and freestanding except for the porch it is the obvious choice unless every gram counts.

It just occurred to me that I could probably use my trekking poles to hold the porch out, gotta try that!
minus273degrees - on 04 Jun 2014
In reply to malk:
For a cheap tent it is a great starter I've squeezed two people in it with a fair bit of gear. Its got nice little storage areas at the end for boots and things.

Its a roomy one person my climate partner stayed in it for two weeks in the alps.

Or it can be a tight ish two person but ok for one/two nighters

PS could be the 300 we use (whats actually cheaper by 2p)
Post edited at 08:56
TMM - on 04 Jun 2014
In reply to 5tormin':

> With only one entry this TN semi geodesic design was copied from Bob Saunders back in the 80's,his was called the Felltrek but had 2 entrances, front and rear.Better for through ventilation and only 2 poles,pitched in 5 mins.weight about 2.4kg.

> 2 doors easier for 2 people,look on fleabay or or similar.

Are you sure that the Voyager is a Saunders clone?

The Voyager started life as the Wintergear Emerald. Wintergear was purchased by Wild Country and the Emerald became the Voyager. Wild Country then sold its tent business to new entity called Terra Nova. The 'Voyager' has been on sale and subject to a gradual evolution and various 'Ultra' and 'Superlight' spin offs since 1982.

I recall that until the Space Trek (a Quasar clone) all of Bob's designs were fly first pitching with used either and that none of them were geodesic.

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