UKC

I seem to remember reading somewhere about an 'official' end date of alpine winter (in terms of climbing being classed as in winter)

Does this still exist? anyone know the date?

Was interested as the starlight and storm project has three to go and wondered how much time he had left?

Cima Grande, Piz Badile and Matterhorn ticked in winter solo. That's some big cojones already!

Was wondering what routes count as well, does the lauper, or the shroud, or the dru couloir?

In reply to smithaldo:

I think the "alpine winter season" used to be the same as the astronomical winter; ie it ended at the March equinox (usually 21st) - rather than (as did the meteorological winter) at the end of February. I recall it being pointed out at the time that although the first ascent of the Eiger's Harlin Direct route was generally regarded as having taken place in winter, it was actually completed just outside the "official" winter season on March 25th.

In reply to smithaldo:

UIAA said Dec 21 to Mar 20 inclusive, no?

Tom's mum did the Lauper as part of her Big Six, but she'd already done the 1938 route (I guess he has too?).

When Ghiradhini claimed the Big Three he did The Shroud, not the Walker, iirc. Nowadays you'd think you'd have to do the Walker or the Croz.

In reply to Damo: a few of us were chatting about this the other week and thought that the dru couloir would be more than acceptable for inclusion and that would he be quicker on something like the Colton Mac which in my eyes would count. After all isn't it the 6 north faces rather than any specific routes.

Either way he's got 35 days left according to the uiaa!

In reply to smithaldo:

Yes, agreed it's the faces, not necessarily any route. The Shroud was considered a bit of a cop-out though, I think. The way things have developed, the C-M would also be fine, though not realistic 20-30 years ago!

In reply to Damo:

The Shroud was considered a bit of a cop-out though, I think.

The Laupner was a bigger cop-out that not even on the same face.

In reply to Tom Ripley Mountain Guide:

Re: The Shroud, I was referring to Ghiradini, Tom. He did the 1938 Route on the Eiger, afaik?

Re: AH on the Lauper? Sure, as these big claim things go, maybe. But I'm sitting here on my arse, not about to solo any north face anytime soon, so I can't judge. She soloed the Croz on the GJ, so...

In reply to Damo:

The thing is though that at the time that the 6 North faces were first "touted" as a challenge there was only one route on each face wasn't there? So in my mind doing them surely means doing the original routes.

In reply to GridNorth:

I'm sure that cannot be true! When did rebuffats book come out? and when did it get 'touted' as a challenge? surely the desmaison goussalet amongst others on the jorrases (maybe even the croz) was done before both of those events?

In reply to smithaldo:

The Croz in fact predates the Walker.

In reply to smithaldo:

You are both correct about the Croz Spur, it was put up 2 or 3 years before the Walker but I don't think Gaston Rebuffats book has anything to do with it. The concept of the "Six Grande Courses" was established long before that. I was aware of it in the sixties.

In reply to GridNorth:
I think it was the six 'north faces' rather than six 'grandes courses'. However, like you, I've always assumed that Rébuffat was referring to six specific routes on those north faces.

In reply to GridNorth:

Having read your post again I see I missed the point of it. I wasn't aware that the concept was established long before Rébuffat. I do think though, as I said above, that it refers to the six routes that we are all familiar with, and that people interpreting differently like AH as mentioned above, for instance, might just be doing so for convenience.

In reply to jon:

Didn't it go that the 'race' was to climb the 6 north faces (by any route i assume) and after Rebuffat doing the first and publishing the book then he planted the 'rules' for the challenge?

In reply to Mr Lopez:

Hmmm, I don't know, but that sounds plausible.

In reply to Damo:


If i were in the judging panel, i would consider routes that are in the face (not somewhere in the vicinity of the face) and of similar length (not finishing on the shoulder/ridge half way up the face) if they are harder.

The CM in winter is considerably easier than the Walker would be in winter, so i'd let it slide if claiming "The 6 North Faces", but not if claiming a winter ascent of "The 6 North Faces" as that would be taking shortcuts.