UKC

After returning a pair of approach shoes which started to fall apart after walking only 7 miles in them it occurred to me that about 25% of all the gear I buy is either faulty and has to be returned or is just a bit rubbish. I've had numerous boots that have fallen apart, leaking water bottles, climbing gear recalls, faulty stitching on sleeping bags and tents to name a few.
Discounting manufactures which I have only bought 1 item from the only gear manufactures that I have been 100% happy with everything I have owned have been DMM, Alpkit and Decathlon own brand kit. Was wondering what other peoples opinions were? Am I just unlucky?

In reply to andy.smythe:

I just had to return an Alpkit bikepacking bag because they had sewn half a wrong buckle on to it so it wouldn't stay closed, I've had to have one headtorch swapped and I've had three of the old Numo mats that all have had problems. So it happens to every brand. Alpkit tend to be very good about just swapping it quickly for a new one though so keep people happy that way.

When you say the shoes started to fall apart, what actually happened? When you work in shops you notice that some people have higher standards for how things should look or perform than others (including me I guess).

In reply to andy.smythe:

Well, if you really do insist on going to Sports Direct....

In reply to TobyA:

the sole fell off! The manufacturer agreed it was faulty and replaced them straight away.

In reply to Indy:

Ironically I've been happy with most things I have bought from Sports Direct.

In reply to andy.smythe:

I think that would actually count as "fell apart" rather than "starting to fall apart"! Go on, name names - which shoes do we need to keep an eye on?

In reply to andy.smythe:

Never been disappointed by Black Diamond, MSR, Mountain Equipment, DMM, Lowe Alpine or Rab. All of them are at higher end of the price, but well worth it.

Actually, my current main two climbing shoes are Tenaya and I just love them. Oasi for sport/bouldering which are great and fit like a glove while Masai are good for trad. Sizing is quite weird, but if you get them right... I had to return two or three pairs of 5.10 Verdes after couple of months use for each as material between two pull tabs kept failing. I'm quite happy Cotswolds always kept me happy, so they refunded money after replacing couple of shoes. They indirectly suggested that I could have a pair of brand new shoes every couple of months, but that would be like stealing.

In reply to andy.smythe:

Alpkit?

Kit that doesn't last but fantastic customer service...

A sweeping generalisation of course but based on numerous sleeping mats, a torch and a down jacket.

My sleeping bag of theirs is great though.

Love DMM, BD, Patagucci, 5.10, Sportiva

In reply to andy.smythe:

In my experience, Rab and La Sportiva have always been great.

In reply to PPP:

My verde did that too but after 6 months of fairly heavy use. I repaired them myself.
Every pair of rock shoes I have owned the uppers have failed before the soles wore out.

In reply to andy.smythe:

Simply marvellous service and gear.

http://www.aiguillealpine.co.uk/

Also Cioch Direct on Skye (made to measure salopettes)

In reply to andy.smythe:

I love Edelrid and Edelweiss. Never been let down by either brand. If they start doing approach shoes I'll be in heaven. Also, gotta put Black Diamond in there personally, got a lot of their gear (because they sell a lot of stuff and saturate the market decently well) and their c4's are just a pleasure to use. Vipers too.

In reply to andy.smythe:
DMM have been excellent for me. Seen many a wildcountry snapgate stick open straight out of the pack.
5.10 and scarpa haven't let me down footwear wise.
Edit: cheap karimoor dry bags are the nads

In reply to andy.smythe:

I never had any problems with Black Diamond, Petzl, Camp, Cassin, Mammut, Lowe Alpine, Quechua, Beal, La Sportiva, 5.10...

The only item I wasn't satisfied with was Edelweiss Laser 9.6 rope. I had to replace it after 15 months of use (Beal or Mammut ropes usually last up to three years).

In reply to andy.smythe:

I¡¦ve don¡¦t think I¡¦ve ever had consistently ¡§bad¡¨ products from any manufacturer and for every instance of failure; I¡¦ve had a swift like for like or upgraded replacement. I¡¦ve got all my climbing ¡§stuff¡¨ from pretty much every brand out there.

Recent failures have been:

Osprey Mutant (old-ish style) ¡V ripped the compression straps off climbing with skis, replaced

Alpkit Stove ¡V leaky seal meant a lot of flame not where I wanted it, replaced

Thermarest ¡V Delaminated in a hot tent, upgraded replacement (my mat was discontinued)

Patagonia synthetic jacket ¡V Zip ripped off, sent it back for repair, got a new version as a replacement.

Five Ten White ¡V sole peeled away at toe, replaced (this has been the only quality issue I¡¦ve had in probable 30 odd pairs of five tens)

Evolv Canvas approach shoes ¡V Another hot tent issue last week, the soles have started peeling of at the toe.

Rab Neutrino Jacket ¡V Had various Velcro tabs fall off, zip come away but never sent it back as it wasn¡¦t a catastrophic failure, just a cheaply made, and in retrospect not very well cut, jacket.

In reply to TobyA:

On the approach shoe front: 5-10 approach shoes are great for a few weeks but will fall apart within months in my experience. Merrell are better except that the foam at the heel tends to come out in chunks after about a year. Salomon seem to last forever, and so far I have been doing well with scarpas.

In reply to andy.smythe:

being involved with manufacturing consumer goods from numerous sources and countries I can tell you that 80% of the time you get what you pay for.

When it comes down to it the bigger corporations on a year on year basis want bigger margins and greater turnovers. There are two things that can get abused at the end of the day, one is the product the other is the person making the product. If either are squeezed to make a better business proposition you find that the returns rates go up.

No production will be perfect and there will be faults and failures however I guarantee that a proper price usually buys a proper unmolested product, so much of the stuff we buy now is semi-disposable and made to extract the greatest amount of money from us whilst giving the smallest amount back. A good example is a kids mountain bike from halfords, so cheap that it makes bikes available for everyone, where as when I was younger a mountain bike was a very big investment and whilst it was within everyones reach it was generally a more considered purchase.

its just my 2p!

In reply to robal:

Very true but I find Decathlon own brand gear to be an exception to the rule. Everything I have had from them has been amazing, often better than the top brands but at a fraction of the price. Makes me think that we must pay a huge amount just for the brand name.

In reply to andy.smythe:

Decathlon stuff is excellent value but I've had things with faults on them as much from them as with any other brand. They are cheap because they can sell very large amounts but also because they do look at good ideas from other brands and make things very like them, just using non-branded fabrics.

In reply to Removed UserZebdi:


I got one of the first Petzl Myo head torches, and took it to bits after it developed a fault to find the connections weren't soldered in, but were made via gaps in the wire insulation pressed into little metal slots, it only needed the wires inside to move a bit (as happened) for the fault to develop, the fault being the light going on and off when the lead going into the unit from outside was wiggled.

My modern Tikka headtorch seems fine, bought on the theory that there's nothing to work lose, but I'm vaguely wary of buying much from Petzl in the way of head torches since exploring why mine wasn't working right. Pretty cheapskate of them I thought, people's lives can sometimes rely on having a functioning head torch.

In reply to Timmd:

Insulation displacement is not inherently unreliable. Just about every ribbon cable in your laptop will be made up this way, as are most of the phone wiring in your house.

In reply to davidbeynon:
Salomon seem to last forever, and so far I have been doing well with scarpas.

The sole fell off my Salomon approach shoes, however I had had them for FIFTEEN years, so wasn't too brokenhearted at having to bin them.

In reply to GrahamD:

It was because it was part of something which gets wiggled about that I wasn't very impressed, in looking at the result of decision being a dodgy head torch. :-|

In reply to davidbeynon:
Had a pair of older guide tennies for over a year now and still going strong. Lots of mountain days logged in them and plenty miles put in, money well spent.

Pair of Anasazi Greens I had wore through at the toe after a years use but with over 100 routes done in them and worn as shoes at the climbing wall for training twice a week I think I got my £70 out them. Just replaced with Pinks so we'll see how they stand up.

To OP; DMM, BD, ME, Rab and Scarpa have been good to me so far!

In reply to andy.smythe:

yup, I completely agree, you are paying for the piece of mind that comes with a brand, for instance when I sell something to the likes of lakeland or marks and sparks, they add massive margins, one item I'm selling to them is a pair of scissors, I sell it to them at £0.80 they sell it on for £6.99, all they have to do is put it on shelf and run the shop, these sorts of margins aren't uncommon for non branded products, branded products that have to bring in enough money to cover the marketing and the broader business plan are running on much much higher margins.

I could take a set of Wild Country cams out to my metal casting factories, make a set of moulds and in 16 weeks have a merchantable product, but who the hell is going to trust robal cams.....

Its the reason why places like Starbucks Mcdonalds etal flourish globally, there is a security in going into one of their places in Thailand/china/Africa/south america that there isn't in going next door to the locally run one that is a fraction of the cost. We're creatures of comfort I think!