UKC

Just took my GTX jacket to repair - delaminated- and Im looking for softshell now. But normally I climb/walk in a normal 200 fleece and feel fine! Even in cold windy conditions, but I have to keep moving then. During winterclimbing the same, I use layers with a powerstrech suit, a thin micro-fleece and over it the same fleece. Use GTX only in strong cold winds, standing still and in rain and wet snow.

Q. how much warmth gives a softshell like Pata core skin? Can you compare it with a normal fleece? I mean, I dont want to use a softshell and keep a goretex jacket AND a fleece in the pack...
If I buy a softshell can I leave the fleece 200 at home? ( in winter I always cary a down, and anytime GTX jacket in the sac)

In reply to xray:


Yes

In reply to xray: I luurve my new Sprayway 810 jacket, first time i wore it with just a thin fleece bas layer, it went through a wide range of conditions and i was always comfortable.

lunchtime was clear and breezy and i was toasty.
on the route it started raining and it kept me dry and warm. Sat on the top of the cliff belaying in the wind when the rain had stopped, the fabric was bone dry by the time my partner got up.

In reply to xray:

It's rather tricky to compare the warmth of a windproof garment with one that isn't windproof, as a windproof is so much more effective at retaining warmth in 'real conditions', i.e. when there's any sort of breeze.

The Core Skin uses Polartec PowerShield with R1 waffle fleece lining, which is roughly 100 weight fleece. Given that it's much more windproof than a simple fleece, I think you'd find it about as warm as your 200 weight non-windproof fleece in use.

I prefer a more windproof outer than PowerShield provides, and so favour the DriClime-style pertex/microfleece type garments, but others are keen on PowerShield; Dave Hunter, for instance, seems a recent convert. It feels more rugged than pertex/microfleece, and looks better

Jon - I think the 810 jacket is called the 'Zone 3'; Sprayway seem to have ripped off Patagonia's 'Regulator' nomenclature and replaced it with 'Zone'. I'm quite pleased with my '812 Zone 2' (well, at £18 from TKM...).

In reply to captain paranoia: whatever its called, i'm sold on Shoeller dryskin fabrics.

In reply to Jon Greengrass: Normally I'm damp and sweat a lot during intensive climbing. The normal fleece allows that, and if the wind is not to strong I feel comfortable. I'm climbing for many years in a Schoeller pants ( it shows..) and I am very happy with it too.

But your body needs more protection, even when all my friends wear GTX and windblockers I just have my fleece on, but don't want to stand still then.

In reply to xray: I used to sweat in a Buffalo, but now walk/climb/ski in an ME G2 Alpine Windstopper Softshell top & trousers with no base layer (apart from keks). Only cold spot is where the sweat can't get past the rucksack. I always carry a lightweight Rab Pertex top, but have never used it.
Never needed to carry anything else in English winter walking & Californian/European Ski conditions.

In reply to xray: I have been very pleased with my Mountain Equipment Microterm Zip-off. Extremely light, warm and compact and with the added bonus taht it can be worn as a gillet, so much so that i am going to purchase a Microterm Mountain Jacket aswell....

In reply to xray:
I use the ME Microtherm too - and wouldn't dream of taking anotehr fleece with me. It doesn't stand up to wetting as much as I'd like - certainly not as well as my Schoeller trousers - so I'm looking around for another jacket. ME G2 is an option, but would be interested to hear others (including more Scholler).

In reply to xray: The G2 is much better that the ME microtherm. The nylon hood is rather strange, but designed to fit under a helmet, rather than over it. The hood toggles can blow into your face when very windy and the cuffs have no adjustment, merely a softer inner cuff.
The Patagonia Dimension jacket has better features and a softshell hood with its adjustment toggles inside the chest pockets and adjustable cuffs, but is designed to fit with clothes underneath it, whereas the G" is designed as a stand alone garment, but is cool to the skin when not moving. The G2 has better ventilation as well. Both jackets are designed to stop at the symphysis pubis; this can leave you with a cold whanger, watch out! The G2 trousers are warm enough for skiing, but the snow cuffs are crap. When walking in deep snow, snow accumulates between the cuff and the trousers and they don't keep water out when walking in water, albeit briefly, gaiters are still needed, with an extra one for the nether regions if necessary.