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If routes are graded for the level of danger then does this grade stay the same when headpointed? Surely the tick is for the onsight not for the a pre practiced set of moves.
I soloed aardvark and the ferret at sea walls in the avon gorge rececntly and while this is graded E7 6b a more realistic grade of E5 or E6 could be applied for the headpoint. The route has moves that are not hard just slightly sketchy and unprotected, as no one has onsight soloed the route shouldn't the grade be set for the headpoint?
I soloed aardvark and the ferret at sea walls in the avon gorge rececntly and while this is graded E7 6b a more realistic grade of E5 or E6 could be applied for the headpoint. The route has moves that are not hard just slightly sketchy and unprotected, as no one has onsight soloed the route shouldn't the grade be set for the headpoint?
In reply to phsharpy: Not meaning to piss on your bonfire, so to speak, but is it not E6?
In reply to phsharpy: it is to lead but the solo is considered a separate line as you don't have to traverse 2 metres of route to place the gear. Hence as a purer line it can be given a diferent grade
In reply to phsharpy:
who gave it this grade? or did you make it up?
> (In reply to phsharpy) it is to lead but the solo is considered a separate line as you don't have to traverse 2 metres of route to place the gear. Hence as a purer line it can be given a diferent grade
who gave it this grade? or did you make it up?
In reply to phsharpy:
No body has even onsighted Aardvark as far as I am aware. Aardvark was once considered E7 6b to lead and E8 6b to solo.
Now the concensus of opinion is solid E5 to lead, hard E6 to solo.
Technically you cant have the E grade tick unless you onsighted ... But I wouldnt worry!
Fred
No body has even onsighted Aardvark as far as I am aware. Aardvark was once considered E7 6b to lead and E8 6b to solo.
Now the concensus of opinion is solid E5 to lead, hard E6 to solo.
Technically you cant have the E grade tick unless you onsighted ... But I wouldnt worry!
Fred
In reply to phsharpy:
strictly speaking british grades are only for the onisght lead. Therefore you can't really give yourself a lower grade beacuse you broke the rules.
I'd say you headpointed an E6. IF you want to say you can lead X grade (UK grades) then you need to have onsighted it!
As no one as on site lead lots of route int he grade range E7 - E10 then the real grade can only be guessed at
Stevo
strictly speaking british grades are only for the onisght lead. Therefore you can't really give yourself a lower grade beacuse you broke the rules.
I'd say you headpointed an E6. IF you want to say you can lead X grade (UK grades) then you need to have onsighted it!
As no one as on site lead lots of route int he grade range E7 - E10 then the real grade can only be guessed at
Stevo
In reply to CurlyStevo:
He didnt make it up, the newest Avon guide gives it E6 to lead and E7 to solo.
Fred
He didnt make it up, the newest Avon guide gives it E6 to lead and E7 to solo.
Fred
In reply to phsharpy: Why would it be harder if you are making less moves than if you were leading it?
And no, after headpointing it isn't the same grade so to speak. As grades are given for an onsight (Ithink).
And no, after headpointing it isn't the same grade so to speak. As grades are given for an onsight (Ithink).
In reply to FredMead:
what's your best onsight lead grade fred? how does that compare to your best headpoint grade?
what's your best onsight lead grade fred? how does that compare to your best headpoint grade?
In reply to Oli:
You climb stay further right and climb the arete all the way, its harder than starting further left and placing the gear the traversing right.
But the grade is higher because its a solo ... its all in the mind on friction moves like on Aardvark!
Fred
You climb stay further right and climb the arete all the way, its harder than starting further left and placing the gear the traversing right.
But the grade is higher because its a solo ... its all in the mind on friction moves like on Aardvark!
Fred
In reply to Fredmead: those grades sound about right, most of sea walls e7's seem to be over graded. Critics choice gets it but then that has been onsight soloed by adam. Even stuff like to be is not too bolt is fairly soft touch as it has good gear and not particularly hard moves
In reply to CurlyStevo:
Profile is wrong, I dont put correct grades in that. Actual hardest onsight is (soft) E5. But yes, it is much lower than best headpoint grade.
Fred
Profile is wrong, I dont put correct grades in that. Actual hardest onsight is (soft) E5. But yes, it is much lower than best headpoint grade.
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
But you can't solo a route and claim a higher grade just because it is more of a mind game?
For example; If one was to lead a route at E3, you couldn't then solo it and claim E4 because you didn't have any gear/it was scarier.
> (In reply to Oli)
> But the grade is higher because its a solo ... its all in the mind on friction moves like on Aardvark!
>
> But the grade is higher because its a solo ... its all in the mind on friction moves like on Aardvark!
>
But you can't solo a route and claim a higher grade just because it is more of a mind game?
For example; If one was to lead a route at E3, you couldn't then solo it and claim E4 because you didn't have any gear/it was scarier.
In reply to phsharpy:
To Be Is Not To Bolt lost pegs a few months ago and is defo now solid E7. Independent Route is Solid E7 ... I would agree Critics is E7 for onsight solo, but E4 for headpoint with bolt.
Avon stuff only gets big grades due to little or no gear. The climbing really isnt that hard. With the noteable exceptions of The Prince (Soloed at E8/E9 by a person who does not wish to be identified) and Two Gay Dads by Adam which has got F8a(?) climbing on it, and Two Gay Dad's originally got E6 6c until it recently got upgraded to E7 7a!
Fred
To Be Is Not To Bolt lost pegs a few months ago and is defo now solid E7. Independent Route is Solid E7 ... I would agree Critics is E7 for onsight solo, but E4 for headpoint with bolt.
Avon stuff only gets big grades due to little or no gear. The climbing really isnt that hard. With the noteable exceptions of The Prince (Soloed at E8/E9 by a person who does not wish to be identified) and Two Gay Dads by Adam which has got F8a(?) climbing on it, and Two Gay Dad's originally got E6 6c until it recently got upgraded to E7 7a!
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
Interesting, So I guess to headpoint takes off about a grade and a half for you atleast....
Still all impressive stuff!
Stevo
Interesting, So I guess to headpoint takes off about a grade and a half for you atleast....
Still all impressive stuff!
Stevo
In reply to Oli: as i said in the first post it is more of a direct line, eliminates any rest whilst standing in the niche to place gear and is a much cleaner line that does not cross over any other routes
In reply to Oli:
Hmm, yeah I see where you are coming from, but you have to remember that the E grade also takes safety into account. Aardvark is safe with gear (tested by many who blew their onsight, including me) but solo you would be fooked if you fell!
Fred
Hmm, yeah I see where you are coming from, but you have to remember that the E grade also takes safety into account. Aardvark is safe with gear (tested by many who blew their onsight, including me) but solo you would be fooked if you fell!
Fred
In reply to Oli:
no it's all speculative, but then again so are most climbs at that sort of level!
no it's all speculative, but then again so are most climbs at that sort of level!
In reply to phsharpy: You didn't actually say that you could rest in a niche/not rest when soloing. That seems a better reason to give it a higher E grade than the "I'm soloing it so i get another E point" argument.
In reply to FredMead: the prince is e8 and that sounds like a fair grade. Rumour has it that *** only soloed it cos the holds were so small he couldn't take a hand off to clip them. to be is not to bolt is still a safe route, you could fall off either crux with some confidence and independent route is too eliminate and escapable to be really dangerous. good landing too
In reply to phsharpy:
Really! Well Im not surprised, the holds are non existant on it!
But I disagree that Independent route has a good landing ... You will probably bounce down the slab and hit the ledge at the bottom of 5b groove...
Really! Well Im not surprised, the holds are non existant on it!
But I disagree that Independent route has a good landing ... You will probably bounce down the slab and hit the ledge at the bottom of 5b groove...
In reply to phsharpy:
More likely they couldn't find someone to belay in their lunch hour.........
> (In reply to FredMead) the prince is e8 and that sounds like a fair grade. Rumour has it that *** only soloed it cos the holds were so small he couldn't take a hand off to clip them.
More likely they couldn't find someone to belay in their lunch hour.........
In reply to phsharpy: yes the grade is for the onsight 'i onsighted E7' it is still E7 if you redpoint it 'i redpointed E7' thats the difference.
In reply to phsharpy:
About right. Generally it's regarded that headpointing a route is equivalent to onsighting a route that's two full grades easier.
Well, the true challenge is still there and traditionally that is what one aspires to in British routes, and why they're graded for the onsight.
You can either choose to accept that challenge, be good enough to tackle it, and climb at that standard - or you can choose not to...
> while this is graded E7 6b a more realistic grade of E5 or E6 could be applied for the headpoint
About right. Generally it's regarded that headpointing a route is equivalent to onsighting a route that's two full grades easier.
> as no one has onsight soloed the route shouldn't the grade be set for the headpoint?
Well, the true challenge is still there and traditionally that is what one aspires to in British routes, and why they're graded for the onsight.
You can either choose to accept that challenge, be good enough to tackle it, and climb at that standard - or you can choose not to...
In reply to Fiend:
>Generally it's regarded that headpointing a route is equivalent to onsighting a route that's two full grades easier.
Really? Surely this will vary massively depending on the people and the amount of effort put into the headpoint?
>Generally it's regarded that headpointing a route is equivalent to onsighting a route that's two full grades easier.
Really? Surely this will vary massively depending on the people and the amount of effort put into the headpoint?
In reply to Aly:
Just what I've heard / read from various sources, but yes I guess it would vary, from point to point, maybe it's an average estimate.
Just what I've heard / read from various sources, but yes I guess it would vary, from point to point, maybe it's an average estimate.
In reply to phsharpy: So your dilemma is that you want to measure your progress in headpointing skill against a subjectiv scale, but that the readymade scale is for onsight skill?
In reply to jwi: I would tend more towards head pointing a grade and then knowing what i can onsight. Now i'v headpointed e7 i'll go for some harder onsights.
In reply to phsharpy: headpointing and onsighting are so much off a different game though, same as trad versus bolt is a different game. Having an idea of what's ahead settles your nerves so much more.
imho it doesn't matter too much about what grade the guide book gives so long as you are honest (especially with youself) as to how the ascent felt and the ethical style you felt was justified to accomplish it. Did't Mr Gresham talk about this in an article ages ago , I think he even mooted the point of a headpoint grade for a route.
It's just a point where the trad system falls down really. But you can't go giving different grades for differing ascent styles, where will it all end???? E7 onsight, E6 headpoint, E5 preplaced gear E2 preclipped 1st piece yo yo style 7a+ on top rope?????????????????
Main thing is did you enjoy said route, grade's pretty much pointless IMHO (except as an aid to pick out the routes you feel you can do) but route quality that's what counts - Good effort mind!
imho it doesn't matter too much about what grade the guide book gives so long as you are honest (especially with youself) as to how the ascent felt and the ethical style you felt was justified to accomplish it. Did't Mr Gresham talk about this in an article ages ago , I think he even mooted the point of a headpoint grade for a route.
It's just a point where the trad system falls down really. But you can't go giving different grades for differing ascent styles, where will it all end???? E7 onsight, E6 headpoint, E5 preplaced gear E2 preclipped 1st piece yo yo style 7a+ on top rope?????????????????
Main thing is did you enjoy said route, grade's pretty much pointless IMHO (except as an aid to pick out the routes you feel you can do) but route quality that's what counts - Good effort mind!
In reply to phsharpy:
At the end of the day if you report an ascent honestly then it doesn't really matter what grade it is.
UK grades are given for the on-sight, mainly for historical reasons but also because it would be very confusing to have two meanings to one grading system as suggested by your last sentence. I.e. up to E5 the grades are for the on-sight, above this they are for worked or headpoint ascents. This does mean however that if a route has only ever had ascents after practice then the grade given in the guide is just an estimate. As an example - is Indian Face on Cloggy really E9? As yet we don't know as it hasn't had any on-sight ascents and certainly not enough for a consensus.
Oh, and finally, routes are not graded for the level of danger, but for all aspects of the climbing - technical difficulty, fall potential, quality of rock, exposure, etc. See http://www.aqvi55.dsl.pipex.com/climb/uk_grades.htm for a fuller description.
boB
At the end of the day if you report an ascent honestly then it doesn't really matter what grade it is.
UK grades are given for the on-sight, mainly for historical reasons but also because it would be very confusing to have two meanings to one grading system as suggested by your last sentence. I.e. up to E5 the grades are for the on-sight, above this they are for worked or headpoint ascents. This does mean however that if a route has only ever had ascents after practice then the grade given in the guide is just an estimate. As an example - is Indian Face on Cloggy really E9? As yet we don't know as it hasn't had any on-sight ascents and certainly not enough for a consensus.
Oh, and finally, routes are not graded for the level of danger, but for all aspects of the climbing - technical difficulty, fall potential, quality of rock, exposure, etc. See http://www.aqvi55.dsl.pipex.com/climb/uk_grades.htm for a fuller description.
boB
In reply to Bob:
Nah they're just guesses everyone knows that!!
Nah they're just guesses everyone knows that!!
In reply to Bob:
So much discussion about onsights, headpoints, ballpoints, bigprickpoints.
Shouldn't we have everything graded for routes done as the FA was done, and if you use more gear or oin different style it is two grades easier?
Anyone for all the original routes on Cloggy and Scafell and Pillar up to HVS with only one sling runner? What would the grade be now?
So much discussion about onsights, headpoints, ballpoints, bigprickpoints.
Shouldn't we have everything graded for routes done as the FA was done, and if you use more gear or oin different style it is two grades easier?
Anyone for all the original routes on Cloggy and Scafell and Pillar up to HVS with only one sling runner? What would the grade be now?
In reply to Bob:
Bob, grades take into account danger, just like the Font bouldering grade does.
Fred
> Oh, and finally, routes are not graded for the level of danger, but for all aspects of the climbing - technical difficulty, fall potential, quality of rock, exposure, etc. See http://www.aqvi55.dsl.pipex.com/climb/uk_grades.htm for a fuller description.
Bob, grades take into account danger, just like the Font bouldering grade does.
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
I think Bob meant to say "not JUST graded for the level of danger"
I think Bob meant to say "not JUST graded for the level of danger"
In reply to Bob:
In which case you were just agreeing, I said "Hmm, yeah I see where you are coming from, but you have to remember that the E grade also takes safety into account. Aardvark is safe with gear (tested by many who blew their onsight, including me) but solo you would be fooked if you fell!"
This is why sea walls E7's are so technically easy for the attached E grade.
Fred
In which case you were just agreeing, I said "Hmm, yeah I see where you are coming from, but you have to remember that the E grade also takes safety into account. Aardvark is safe with gear (tested by many who blew their onsight, including me) but solo you would be fooked if you fell!"
This is why sea walls E7's are so technically easy for the attached E grade.
Fred
In reply to FredMead: yeah that makes sense, onsighting them would be an impressive achievement. eg. mike weekes onsight solo the quiet mind
In reply to phsharpy:
Mike Weeks, yeah that was crazy. Especially quiet mind, the crux is blind as f*ck!
Fred
P.S. Mike fell from the crux of Aardvark solo! He barn doored off and managed to jump and grab the rope that his photographer was sitting on!
Fred
Mike Weeks, yeah that was crazy. Especially quiet mind, the crux is blind as f*ck!
Fred
P.S. Mike fell from the crux of Aardvark solo! He barn doored off and managed to jump and grab the rope that his photographer was sitting on!
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
You can only do that so many times - before life gets very painful indeed.
Mick
You can only do that so many times - before life gets very painful indeed.
Mick
In reply to FredMead:
Is that right? I thought that font grades were independant of height/landing/tigers etc.
Do highballs get higher grades for easier climbing in 'bleau?
> ...take into account danger, just like the Font bouldering grade does.
>
>
Is that right? I thought that font grades were independant of height/landing/tigers etc.
Do highballs get higher grades for easier climbing in 'bleau?
In reply to sutty:
No. Move with the times, grades should be for the current guidebook.
Norrie
> (In reply to Bob)
> Shouldn't we have everything graded for routes done as the FA was done, and if you use more gear or oin different style it is two grades easier?
>
Dear sutty
>
No. Move with the times, grades should be for the current guidebook.
Norrie
In reply to palomides:
More so if it's a bit of a bad landing. Fleurs de Rhum (7a+) at Apremont is a classic example. More like 6c+, but has a bit of a grim sloping boulder below it.
> (In reply to FredMead)
> [...]
> Do highballs get higher grades for easier climbing in 'bleau?
> [...]
> Do highballs get higher grades for easier climbing in 'bleau?
More so if it's a bit of a bad landing. Fleurs de Rhum (7a+) at Apremont is a classic example. More like 6c+, but has a bit of a grim sloping boulder below it.
In reply to Norrie Muir:
so we have to accept that modern climbers are not as brave overall as the pioneers.
so we have to accept that modern climbers are not as brave overall as the pioneers.
In reply to sutty:
With all the advantages available to modern climbers - improved protection, bouldering mats, hi-tech shoes, varieties of chalk, improved information about routes, much more advanced training - they have the perfect opportunity to clearly improve on the style of climbing in the past. Whether they take that opportunity is a different matter.
With all the advantages available to modern climbers - improved protection, bouldering mats, hi-tech shoes, varieties of chalk, improved information about routes, much more advanced training - they have the perfect opportunity to clearly improve on the style of climbing in the past. Whether they take that opportunity is a different matter.
In reply to FredMead:
Routes aren't graded for solo ascents, unless of course there is no gear at all so a lead is the same as a solo. I don't know the routes in question but they sound serious and so would/should be technically easy for the grade.
P.S. It's generally brown trouser time if you fall when soloing no matter what the grade.
boB
Routes aren't graded for solo ascents, unless of course there is no gear at all so a lead is the same as a solo. I don't know the routes in question but they sound serious and so would/should be technically easy for the grade.
P.S. It's generally brown trouser time if you fall when soloing no matter what the grade.
boB
In reply to Fiend:
>they have the perfect opportunity to clearly improve on the style of climbing in the past
Ah, but that is the point, they don't. They add bolts instead of pegs, place runners where the FA used none, use chalk that damages flora.
Now if that is not lowering the grade of climbs to their level what is?
Think very carefully, I may soon be back on the crags, and if you agree all these things are ok then I may be placing gear to reduce the climbs to my level.
>they have the perfect opportunity to clearly improve on the style of climbing in the past
Ah, but that is the point, they don't. They add bolts instead of pegs, place runners where the FA used none, use chalk that damages flora.
Now if that is not lowering the grade of climbs to their level what is?
Think very carefully, I may soon be back on the crags, and if you agree all these things are ok then I may be placing gear to reduce the climbs to my level.
In reply to sutty:
I think you and I are talking about different eras of the past, so our comments might not be mutually applicable.
I also think that style is not about what equipment you are using, but about what attitude you take and how you approach the challenge of the climb.
I think you and I are talking about different eras of the past, so our comments might not be mutually applicable.
I also think that style is not about what equipment you are using, but about what attitude you take and how you approach the challenge of the climb.
In reply to sutty:
This reminds me of a caption from Doug Scott's book, Big Wall Climbing. Had to look it up but on page 222 the caption states: "A climber with twenty-four chocks, descendeur and gloves on a one pitch climb in Derbyshire. Too much equipment makes progress difficult and in this case needlessly because there is room for only one chock ont he climb".
This was in 1974!
boB
This reminds me of a caption from Doug Scott's book, Big Wall Climbing. Had to look it up but on page 222 the caption states: "A climber with twenty-four chocks, descendeur and gloves on a one pitch climb in Derbyshire. Too much equipment makes progress difficult and in this case needlessly because there is room for only one chock ont he climb".
This was in 1974!
boB
In reply to palomides:
Not sure. Pads make bumping up the grade a bit pointless. Especially when a lot of the classic US highballs in J Tree/Bishop/Yosemite seem to have flat sandy landings. I think Midnight Lightning gets V9 partly cos of the mantle though?
> (In reply to Tom, UKC News Editor)
>
> Well, well. I've learnt something today.
>
> What about V-grades?
>
> Well, well. I've learnt something today.
>
> What about V-grades?
Not sure. Pads make bumping up the grade a bit pointless. Especially when a lot of the classic US highballs in J Tree/Bishop/Yosemite seem to have flat sandy landings. I think Midnight Lightning gets V9 partly cos of the mantle though?
In reply to Tom, UKC News Editor:
Naa, V grades are just the hardest move. That is why there are problems that the V grade does not translate to the Font grade.
A problem that gets (say) Font 7b, in a Font guidebook, translates to V8. But an identicle problem in Hueco Tanks may get V7.
So in answer to your original question:
No the V grading system does not take height/landing into account
Fred
Naa, V grades are just the hardest move. That is why there are problems that the V grade does not translate to the Font grade.
A problem that gets (say) Font 7b, in a Font guidebook, translates to V8. But an identicle problem in Hueco Tanks may get V7.
So in answer to your original question:
No the V grading system does not take height/landing into account
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
Nah...
Correct me if iam wrong but the V and Fnt grade comparrison only falls down because of the V8/V8+. We brits use it here, but dont think anyone elses does.
That as far as i always thought was teh only discrepency.
Though iam willing to be proved wrong...
Nah...
Correct me if iam wrong but the V and Fnt grade comparrison only falls down because of the V8/V8+. We brits use it here, but dont think anyone elses does.
That as far as i always thought was teh only discrepency.
Though iam willing to be proved wrong...
In reply to FredMead:
It's an easy move V3? but I wouldn't want to fall off it.
That said I really need to take some brave pills and go and headpoint it before I can really comment on it.
M
> But I disagree that Independent route has a good landing ... You will probably bounce down the slab and hit the ledge at the bottom of 5b groove...
It's an easy move V3? but I wouldn't want to fall off it.
That said I really need to take some brave pills and go and headpoint it before I can really comment on it.
M
In reply to Adam Lincoln:
Ok maybe V8 was a bad example ... what I meant was that you will get discrepancies (sp?) with the font system depending on height and landing. The V grade system doesnt take this into account. Therefore (using a better example), it is possible to get a Font 7a which is only V5...
But I am not going to argue with you if you disagree with me, Adam, because you have been to Font way more times than me - so you will win!
Fred
Ok maybe V8 was a bad example ... what I meant was that you will get discrepancies (sp?) with the font system depending on height and landing. The V grade system doesnt take this into account. Therefore (using a better example), it is possible to get a Font 7a which is only V5...
But I am not going to argue with you if you disagree with me, Adam, because you have been to Font way more times than me - so you will win!
Fred
In reply to FredMead:
Is the V grade not supposed to grade the whole problem, e.g. a long sustained traverse could be harder problem than one hard move? Otherwise surely V grades are just as useless as UK tech grades for boulder problems?
> Naa, V grades are just the hardest move.
Is the V grade not supposed to grade the whole problem, e.g. a long sustained traverse could be harder problem than one hard move? Otherwise surely V grades are just as useless as UK tech grades for boulder problems?
In reply to Anonymous:
how right you are (same as font grades)
> (In reply to FredMead)
> [...]
>
> Is the V grade not supposed to grade the whole problem, e.g. a long sustained traverse could be harder problem than one hard move? Otherwise surely V grades are just as useless as UK tech grades for boulder problems?
> [...]
>
> Is the V grade not supposed to grade the whole problem, e.g. a long sustained traverse could be harder problem than one hard move? Otherwise surely V grades are just as useless as UK tech grades for boulder problems?
how right you are (same as font grades)
In reply to FredMead: Fred, you're sprouting so much sh!t on this thread. Why don't you calm down and learn to appreciate local history rather than spreading pointless rumours and slander?
In reply to sutty:
Dear sutty
As I posted earlier, move with the times. I never thought less of first ascenders when I soloed old timer's routes.
Norrie
> (In reply to Norrie Muir)
> so we have to accept that modern climbers are not as brave overall as the pioneers.
> so we have to accept that modern climbers are not as brave overall as the pioneers.
Dear sutty
As I posted earlier, move with the times. I never thought less of first ascenders when I soloed old timer's routes.
Norrie
In reply to Anonymous:
Yeah i get that, why else would the 40 metre cuttins traverese be V8 when each section is a piece of piss...
I didnt mean hardest move even tho that is what i said ... i meant that the v grade system doesnt try to take into account things like height and landing.
Yeah i get that, why else would the 40 metre cuttins traverese be V8 when each section is a piece of piss...
I didnt mean hardest move even tho that is what i said ... i meant that the v grade system doesnt try to take into account things like height and landing.
In reply to FredMead:
Probably. I managed it about third go but on the last time I was out I was getting absolutely nowhere on V3s at the Cuttings Boulderfield....
> V3? Nah probs easier than that... V1 V2 maybe.
Probably. I managed it about third go but on the last time I was out I was getting absolutely nowhere on V3s at the Cuttings Boulderfield....
In reply to Anonymous - the Blueyonder email one:
Erm, I am sorry Anonymous, I did not realise I had reacted in any way that could be considered as 'not calm'. As far as I know, I am not spreading pointless rumours. This is how I have always known the font grading system to work.
History of certain areas? I am sorry, I think you have misunderstood. I was assuming the person who asked about font grades wanted to know what the system was originally created to do, and what it now does in the majority of places. There may be a few exceptions.
Come out of your anonymity and I may take you more seriously. Untill then I am assuming you are a troll.
Fred
> Why don't you calm down and learn to appreciate local history rather than spreading pointless rumours and slander?
Erm, I am sorry Anonymous, I did not realise I had reacted in any way that could be considered as 'not calm'. As far as I know, I am not spreading pointless rumours. This is how I have always known the font grading system to work.
History of certain areas? I am sorry, I think you have misunderstood. I was assuming the person who asked about font grades wanted to know what the system was originally created to do, and what it now does in the majority of places. There may be a few exceptions.
Come out of your anonymity and I may take you more seriously. Untill then I am assuming you are a troll.
Fred
In reply to Mark Stevenson:
Its a very different style to cuttings V3. Personally I would say its hard V2, but climbing with people like AllySmith and Paz, they recon its easier.
So soft V2 is probably about right.
Fred
Its a very different style to cuttings V3. Personally I would say its hard V2, but climbing with people like AllySmith and Paz, they recon its easier.
So soft V2 is probably about right.
Fred
In reply to FredMead: Im no boulderer and definitely no expert on the subject but Ive see nCrescent Arete and Pebble Arete both given V2 or Font 5+, but while Pebble Aret eis 5c, Crescent is only 5b. I thought thought the reason for CA being V2/5+ rather than the next grade down was that it was highball?
In reply to phsharpy: Be honest now... with that opening question in mind, are you an idiot??
In reply to Taxidea taxus: no
In reply to phsharpy: come on pete, tell the truth
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