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BEWARE
My Sticht plate and carabiner were stolen at MCC on Sunday 12th. I left it on floor for 5min and then it was gone, I know, my fault...
I had this carabiner since high school, so many memories...
Futhermore it was my second one stolen there, it happend one yaer ago so I have anniversary now !!
I asked staff but what can they do ?
In my opinion CCTV is needed, two cameras, one above bouldering area, second above far slaby wall.
Maciek
ps. to steal in church is a sin ! (but maybe not in england)
My Sticht plate and carabiner were stolen at MCC on Sunday 12th. I left it on floor for 5min and then it was gone, I know, my fault...
I had this carabiner since high school, so many memories...
Futhermore it was my second one stolen there, it happend one yaer ago so I have anniversary now !!
I asked staff but what can they do ?
In my opinion CCTV is needed, two cameras, one above bouldering area, second above far slaby wall.
Maciek
ps. to steal in church is a sin ! (but maybe not in england)
In reply to Maciek:
How about telling them in person instead of posting on a forum they may or may not see...?
How about telling them in person instead of posting on a forum they may or may not see...?
In reply to Maciek:
Don't think they've had any major problems with stuff being nicked. I often leave my harness, jumper etc lying around near the bouldering area and never lost anything yet but i guess it'll always happen to someone eventually.
I even managed to leave my harness complete with krab, belay & chalk bag attached on the floor there twice after i've gone home but it got picked up & put in reception at the end of the night on both occasions.
Don't think they've had any major problems with stuff being nicked. I often leave my harness, jumper etc lying around near the bouldering area and never lost anything yet but i guess it'll always happen to someone eventually.
I even managed to leave my harness complete with krab, belay & chalk bag attached on the floor there twice after i've gone home but it got picked up & put in reception at the end of the night on both occasions.
In reply to Maciek:
It may be a stupid suggestion , but why not look after your own personnel kit -possibly clip it to those half moon things that dangle all around your harness while not using it?
If you can’t look after your own kit, why expect someone else to? Would you go to the toilet and leave your mobile phone sat on a table? Be responsible for your own kit and don’t try and pass the buck - Please
It may be a stupid suggestion , but why not look after your own personnel kit -possibly clip it to those half moon things that dangle all around your harness while not using it?
If you can’t look after your own kit, why expect someone else to? Would you go to the toilet and leave your mobile phone sat on a table? Be responsible for your own kit and don’t try and pass the buck - Please
In reply to Alphin:
I'm not so sure - I was there on Sunday an there was a large Carabiner an S plate on the floor - near to the staff-only door (the one which leads to the reception area). It had been lying there for afew hours and no one seemed to own it - might have belonged to you. Lost or dropped rather than stolen.
I'm not so sure - I was there on Sunday an there was a large Carabiner an S plate on the floor - near to the staff-only door (the one which leads to the reception area). It had been lying there for afew hours and no one seemed to own it - might have belonged to you. Lost or dropped rather than stolen.
In reply to THE.WALRUS: Phew. I though someone had robbed the Ashes!
In reply to Alphin:
That's a bit harsh considering most people leave their wallet/phone/keys etc in their rucksack in a cubbyhole or on a bench when at the wall. If someone rifled through my bag and nicked my purse I'd be pissed off, despite the fact that I'd left it unattended. It's not blaming someone else (other than the thief), it's being annoyed that the trust you put in other climbers not to rob you has been broken.
That's a bit harsh considering most people leave their wallet/phone/keys etc in their rucksack in a cubbyhole or on a bench when at the wall. If someone rifled through my bag and nicked my purse I'd be pissed off, despite the fact that I'd left it unattended. It's not blaming someone else (other than the thief), it's being annoyed that the trust you put in other climbers not to rob you has been broken.
In reply to climbingpixie: Well said...
In reply to Maciek: I'm sure MCC would let you install CCTV but it might be cheaper for you to buy a new belay/krab!
I always keep my kit on the gear loops of my harness and strangely enough none of it has gone missing. If I ever want to get rid of some of it I'll leave it on the floor somewhere!
I always keep my kit on the gear loops of my harness and strangely enough none of it has gone missing. If I ever want to get rid of some of it I'll leave it on the floor somewhere!
In reply to Maciek:
I felt sorry for you until you had a dig at the English right at the end.
Now I feel it's more of a shame that you judge a whole country full of people based on two incidents.
You can replace the belay plate fairly quickly but prejudices can be harder to get over.
I felt sorry for you until you had a dig at the English right at the end.
Now I feel it's more of a shame that you judge a whole country full of people based on two incidents.
You can replace the belay plate fairly quickly but prejudices can be harder to get over.
In reply to Maciek:
it's a sad reflection of the state of the country that the first reaction you have is that everything should be watched and that cctv is needed. ......
it's a sad reflection of the state of the country that the first reaction you have is that everything should be watched and that cctv is needed. ......
In reply to Mita:
Yeah but you also can't put trust in everyone at the wall and assume no one's going to come and nick your stuff. It happens at the place I climb, people have been known to nick the locker key that people have tied around their bottles of water and then gone to the locker and stolen stuff... It's sad but true, anything you don't want stolen shouldn't be left where people can take it, I've been the victim twice (not at a wall)
Yeah but you also can't put trust in everyone at the wall and assume no one's going to come and nick your stuff. It happens at the place I climb, people have been known to nick the locker key that people have tied around their bottles of water and then gone to the locker and stolen stuff... It's sad but true, anything you don't want stolen shouldn't be left where people can take it, I've been the victim twice (not at a wall)
In reply to Flying Monkey:
Unfortunately, in a lot of places you don't have a choice. In Awesome Walls there aren't any lockers, just cubbyholes, so you have to leave stuff where people can get at it.
Unfortunately, in a lot of places you don't have a choice. In Awesome Walls there aren't any lockers, just cubbyholes, so you have to leave stuff where people can get at it.
In reply to Maciek: As you know I have also had stuff stolen from MCC... A mobile phone (admittedly my fault, but kinda sucks that I know it was one of the late night Tuesday climbers... Many thanks to whoever stole it!), and a Black Diamond ATC XP.
Yes, we should be more careful and look after our stuff... But to go round stealing people's gear aint on.
A CCTV... Yes would be expensive to initially set up, but it would have more than one advantage... For example the staff can't always be "on watch" in the main climbing arena. If they had a CCTV not only would keep watch over our belongings it would also help the staff keep an eye on climbers with bad technique... e.g. no one was in the main arena on Monday when one guy fell a great height on one of the lead walls, due to his belay partner giving out way to much slack, not paying attention and not having a sand bag. Perhaps if the staff had a CCTV this would not have happen? Also, footage from the CCTV can also be used against "trouble makers" and abusive customers.
Yes, we should be more careful and look after our stuff... But to go round stealing people's gear aint on.
A CCTV... Yes would be expensive to initially set up, but it would have more than one advantage... For example the staff can't always be "on watch" in the main climbing arena. If they had a CCTV not only would keep watch over our belongings it would also help the staff keep an eye on climbers with bad technique... e.g. no one was in the main arena on Monday when one guy fell a great height on one of the lead walls, due to his belay partner giving out way to much slack, not paying attention and not having a sand bag. Perhaps if the staff had a CCTV this would not have happen? Also, footage from the CCTV can also be used against "trouble makers" and abusive customers.
In reply to Duracell Bunny: Have you ever seen abusive customers there? Or trouble makers?
Good idea re: keeping an eye on people climbing
Good idea re: keeping an eye on people climbing
In reply to climbingpixie:
Thinking about it though, I don't know of anyone who's had stuff nicked at AW, despite the lack of safe storage facilities. I was chatting to one of the staff there a couple of weeks ago and got the impression that if anything was nicked it was usually when there were groups in, and someone had left their purse/phone sticking out of their shoe/somewhere similarly obvious.
CCTV might be a good idea but it seems overkill when theft from walls is not a huge problem. And I like the idea that no-one will have footage of me failing on a 4C, or taking a rest to get up the big overhanging wall. There are things a person wants to keep private.
Thinking about it though, I don't know of anyone who's had stuff nicked at AW, despite the lack of safe storage facilities. I was chatting to one of the staff there a couple of weeks ago and got the impression that if anything was nicked it was usually when there were groups in, and someone had left their purse/phone sticking out of their shoe/somewhere similarly obvious.
CCTV might be a good idea but it seems overkill when theft from walls is not a huge problem. And I like the idea that no-one will have footage of me failing on a 4C, or taking a rest to get up the big overhanging wall. There are things a person wants to keep private.
In reply to climbingpixie:
Ah, didn't realise...
> (In reply to Flying Monkey)
>
> Unfortunately, in a lot of places you don't have a choice. In Awesome Walls there aren't any lockers, just cubbyholes, so you have to leave stuff where people can get at it.
>
> Unfortunately, in a lot of places you don't have a choice. In Awesome Walls there aren't any lockers, just cubbyholes, so you have to leave stuff where people can get at it.
Ah, didn't realise...
In reply to Duracell Bunny: Do you think that CCTV is the answer to problems at climbing walls?
I look after my own things, if there are safe storage areas then use them.
I have been to MCC and unlike many other centre's they actually have secure lockers to use, which have no doubt cost them a lot of money.
Stealing things is totally unacceptable but this is the world we live in and it is not the responsibility of the venue at where it happens.
And as for the climbers....
CCTV at crags!?!?!?!
I didn't think so.
If you see 'bad practice' why not say something to them?
I only climb with people I trust and who are responsible. Keep this in mind - it could save your life.....
But hey, if you happen to have an accident at a climbing centre it must be their fault! NOT
I look after my own things, if there are safe storage areas then use them.
I have been to MCC and unlike many other centre's they actually have secure lockers to use, which have no doubt cost them a lot of money.
Stealing things is totally unacceptable but this is the world we live in and it is not the responsibility of the venue at where it happens.
And as for the climbers....
CCTV at crags!?!?!?!
I didn't think so.
If you see 'bad practice' why not say something to them?
I only climb with people I trust and who are responsible. Keep this in mind - it could save your life.....
But hey, if you happen to have an accident at a climbing centre it must be their fault! NOT
In reply to Flying Monkey: Theft seems to happen all the time, everywhere ya go, you can just keep it to a minimum by not taking half the stuff people take and just remember to keep it in eye sight if you can.... It is a shame that we can't trust as we used to....
The good this about MCC is that there are lockers, and I do use them, but am a little bit more unsure when I climb at Rope Race as there are only cubby holes to put your stuff in and I do feel a little insecure when I leave my things there, knowing that anyone can take it..... I just take my gear with me (Harness, boots, belay etc) and the right money now and leave my bag at home.... Don't seem to worry so much about leaving an empty rucksack in the cubby now...
I have also been a victim, not at the walls yet, but have had various bags taken, it's not nice....
The good this about MCC is that there are lockers, and I do use them, but am a little bit more unsure when I climb at Rope Race as there are only cubby holes to put your stuff in and I do feel a little insecure when I leave my things there, knowing that anyone can take it..... I just take my gear with me (Harness, boots, belay etc) and the right money now and leave my bag at home.... Don't seem to worry so much about leaving an empty rucksack in the cubby now...
I have also been a victim, not at the walls yet, but have had various bags taken, it's not nice....
In reply to Maciek: Having just spoken to John Dunne (owner of MCC) he said that it is regrettable that items have been stolen but it is completely the owners responsibility for their belongings. MCC is a public venue, as are Cafe's and pubs, and belongings should be kept accountable for, and under the individuals supervision or securely stored. MCC provide lockers to safely store belongings when not being used whilst climbing.
In reply to Maciek:
I had this carabiner since high school, so many memories...
Your profile says you are 29. If you left school at 16 that would make your carabiner at least 13 yrs old. You may only be left with memories if all your gear is that old.
I had this carabiner since high school, so many memories...
Your profile says you are 29. If you left school at 16 that would make your carabiner at least 13 yrs old. You may only be left with memories if all your gear is that old.
In reply to evolvdog: Never said that CCTV is the answer, I was merely pointing out that it has its advantages as well as disadvantages
As for the "bad practice", I'm afraid I did not see this person fall... I was in the bouldering area at the time, and only heard the loud bang, saw the guy after the incidence and then asked what had happen.
As for the "bad practice", I'm afraid I did not see this person fall... I was in the bouldering area at the time, and only heard the loud bang, saw the guy after the incidence and then asked what had happen.
In reply to lukea6: I'm not saying there are "trouble makers" at MCC everyday, but they do exist at MCC, just like everywhere else. As said above, I am just trying to point out there are advantages to having a CCTV other than "keeping an eye on customer's possessions".
By the way, ask the "security staff" on the car park if they have ever had to chuck anyone out of MCC... I'd be very suprise if they say no.
By the way, ask the "security staff" on the car park if they have ever had to chuck anyone out of MCC... I'd be very suprise if they say no.
In reply to Maciek: Hey, see what you mean about the feedback you are getting here.
Hopefully some of it will be of help to you?
(btw, nice climb on Wednesday, see you next week sometime)
Hopefully some of it will be of help to you?
(btw, nice climb on Wednesday, see you next week sometime)
In reply to Maciek:
Please everyone remember you are in Manchester - the thevies capital of the UK. If you do not lock your Car/locker/belay partner away they will steal it. If you do not look after your stuff it will go, and quickly. You only have your self to blame .
Please everyone remember you are in Manchester - the thevies capital of the UK. If you do not lock your Car/locker/belay partner away they will steal it. If you do not look after your stuff it will go, and quickly. You only have your self to blame .
In reply to Maciek: Ok, it seems as if some people have taken this thread the wrong way (which is understandable as it can cause some concern to some, depending on how you read the thread).
Basically, just to clear some things up...
I climb at MCC practically everyday, the reasons why I climb at MCC so often is because I enjoy the routes at MCC... I like the atmosphere at MCC... The staff are down to earth at MCC, and you're basically submerged into one big happy climbing community at MCC... If you were to approach me and ask where would I recommend doing indoor climbing, I would happily recommend MCC (which I have done many a times in the past... Plus I "proudly" wear the MCC t shirt at other indoor climbing walls)... By the way, I'm not getting paid to say this, ask anyone who knows me, and they'll tell you the same thing. Sad, I know.
So, please don't take this thread the wrong way... As said above my phone was nicked because it was my own fault (it wasn't in a locker, and I forgot to pick it up at the end of the night.. Completely my fault, as said above, nothing to do with MCC) Hence as said above (and by others) things do get stolen if you are careless, I was merely pointing out, as said above, that there are advantage to having CCTV. I did not say MCC should fit a CCTV. I just thought to have a thread like this it'd be nice to have productive ideas and reasons to this argument... I got the impression we live in a country of freedom of speech and ideas? To some, I have found, this is not the case.
There are probably 100 lockers at MCC, which are free to use by all customers. I'm sure Maciek like myself do not hold anything against MCC for these losses, hence why we both continue to climb at MCC. If anything, we were just pointing out that if you are careless with your gear it will get stolen.
As for the "trouble makers", again as said above, trouble makers exist everywhere, according to Wall Monkey "Please everyone remember you are in Manchester - the thevies capital of the UK." hence is it any surprise that there is the rare occasion that some customers do cause trouble? And the staff at MCC do deal with these people very well... Hence why I suggested one of the other advantages of having a CCTV would be for the staffs benefit, because they do actually take action against such people.
As for the "bad practice", the staff (as far as I know) at MCC do make sure the people who climb in MCC unattended can actually climb and belay properly, they do test every person who comes through that door. If they see "bad practice" being done at MCC they again do take action. But, the staff can't be everywhere at once, which is understandable. Climbing is a risk that the climber takes on him/herself.
I apologise to some if the above seem obvious, since those that know me, know I would never "slag off" MCC... Anyway, I am off climbing this evening... At MCC!
FREEDOM OF SPEECH PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Basically, just to clear some things up...
I climb at MCC practically everyday, the reasons why I climb at MCC so often is because I enjoy the routes at MCC... I like the atmosphere at MCC... The staff are down to earth at MCC, and you're basically submerged into one big happy climbing community at MCC... If you were to approach me and ask where would I recommend doing indoor climbing, I would happily recommend MCC (which I have done many a times in the past... Plus I "proudly" wear the MCC t shirt at other indoor climbing walls)... By the way, I'm not getting paid to say this, ask anyone who knows me, and they'll tell you the same thing. Sad, I know.
So, please don't take this thread the wrong way... As said above my phone was nicked because it was my own fault (it wasn't in a locker, and I forgot to pick it up at the end of the night.. Completely my fault, as said above, nothing to do with MCC) Hence as said above (and by others) things do get stolen if you are careless, I was merely pointing out, as said above, that there are advantage to having CCTV. I did not say MCC should fit a CCTV. I just thought to have a thread like this it'd be nice to have productive ideas and reasons to this argument... I got the impression we live in a country of freedom of speech and ideas? To some, I have found, this is not the case.
There are probably 100 lockers at MCC, which are free to use by all customers. I'm sure Maciek like myself do not hold anything against MCC for these losses, hence why we both continue to climb at MCC. If anything, we were just pointing out that if you are careless with your gear it will get stolen.
As for the "trouble makers", again as said above, trouble makers exist everywhere, according to Wall Monkey "Please everyone remember you are in Manchester - the thevies capital of the UK." hence is it any surprise that there is the rare occasion that some customers do cause trouble? And the staff at MCC do deal with these people very well... Hence why I suggested one of the other advantages of having a CCTV would be for the staffs benefit, because they do actually take action against such people.
As for the "bad practice", the staff (as far as I know) at MCC do make sure the people who climb in MCC unattended can actually climb and belay properly, they do test every person who comes through that door. If they see "bad practice" being done at MCC they again do take action. But, the staff can't be everywhere at once, which is understandable. Climbing is a risk that the climber takes on him/herself.
I apologise to some if the above seem obvious, since those that know me, know I would never "slag off" MCC... Anyway, I am off climbing this evening... At MCC!
FREEDOM OF SPEECH PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it is going to be long ....
In reply to Roblo:
I told them :o] And I started the thread to warn people to be a bit more cautios (not like me), isn't that obvoius ...?
In reply to SecretSquirrel:
This someone is me ...
In reply to Alphin:
Yes it is a stupid suggestion ;o] thx anyway, I checked few times my harnes,stuff, locker,car... my mates harnes and stuff, all floor in MCC, cafe, rockshop, reception, male toilet :o]
In reply to THE.WALRUS:
I think it was not mine ... my was purpule sticht plate and blue carabiner... and it was left for few minutes ... thx
In reply to Evolvdog:
For a amount of money I spent there they shoud have one now ;o]
I dropped it on a floor because I helped to take rope down, somebody forggot to untie a 8knot ... so I used my rope to climb up, and other person belayed me, route was in a corner and sometimes rope tends to be caught in a plate..., afterwards I was a bit tired, my mate asked me something etc ...
anyway I dont know why I expalin it to you, use imagination ...
"But hey, if you happen to have an accident at a climbing centre it must be their fault! NOT" - I am sorry but I completly disagree but this is for other thread ...
In reply to Clinger:
Yes you right, I was upset :o[ and I joked a bit to sarcastic... but what about famous english sense of humor? You English created Monty Python (and David Beckahm)
And trust me I can only compliment British climbers ...
In reply to Wingman@work:
nono no, first reaction was: I was so careless second third etc same, 10th was about CCTV ;o]
In reply to SeadogBones:
OK, it is his climbing centre and I not suprised by this, anyway even fake cameras and some warning signs/labels won't do any harm...
In replay to biscuit:
Good point ! maybe it was a few years less... in any case carabiner is not a rope, cam, harness and my carabiner was hi-end one ;o]
In reply to Wall monkey:
Good friend of mine told me after this accident: "Britain is a nation of shopkeepers but for every shopkeeper there are 100 thieves!" - funny ...
In replay to Duracell Bunny:
:o]
THX You ALL ! for opinions, suppor and abuse ;o]
see you around
In reply to Roblo:
I told them :o] And I started the thread to warn people to be a bit more cautios (not like me), isn't that obvoius ...?
In reply to SecretSquirrel:
This someone is me ...
In reply to Alphin:
Yes it is a stupid suggestion ;o] thx anyway, I checked few times my harnes,stuff, locker,car... my mates harnes and stuff, all floor in MCC, cafe, rockshop, reception, male toilet :o]
In reply to THE.WALRUS:
I think it was not mine ... my was purpule sticht plate and blue carabiner... and it was left for few minutes ... thx
In reply to Evolvdog:
For a amount of money I spent there they shoud have one now ;o]
I dropped it on a floor because I helped to take rope down, somebody forggot to untie a 8knot ... so I used my rope to climb up, and other person belayed me, route was in a corner and sometimes rope tends to be caught in a plate..., afterwards I was a bit tired, my mate asked me something etc ...
anyway I dont know why I expalin it to you, use imagination ...
"But hey, if you happen to have an accident at a climbing centre it must be their fault! NOT" - I am sorry but I completly disagree but this is for other thread ...
In reply to Clinger:
Yes you right, I was upset :o[ and I joked a bit to sarcastic... but what about famous english sense of humor? You English created Monty Python (and David Beckahm)
And trust me I can only compliment British climbers ...
In reply to Wingman@work:
nono no, first reaction was: I was so careless second third etc same, 10th was about CCTV ;o]
In reply to SeadogBones:
OK, it is his climbing centre and I not suprised by this, anyway even fake cameras and some warning signs/labels won't do any harm...
In replay to biscuit:
Good point ! maybe it was a few years less... in any case carabiner is not a rope, cam, harness and my carabiner was hi-end one ;o]
In reply to Wall monkey:
Good friend of mine told me after this accident: "Britain is a nation of shopkeepers but for every shopkeeper there are 100 thieves!" - funny ...
In replay to Duracell Bunny:
:o]
THX You ALL ! for opinions, suppor and abuse ;o]
see you around
As soon as any crime happens people shout "FIT CCTV".
CCTV is not the answer, CCTV does not stop crime, it only records it!
Yea they fit CCTV and it happens again, i'm sure it would be wonderful to see the person picking up your stuff and walking out. What if the staff don't know them or they are not know to the police? Do you then devote the rest of you life looking for them?
Two cameras is that it? with a nice wide view of the whole area you won't even notice someone picking up a carabiner.
There are 4,000,000 cameras in the UK and studys show that were some areas crime has fallen after CCTV was installed there are also place swhere crime has risen. In most cases the amount of recorded rises but the solved crime stays the same.
I would rather spend the money on good lockers and a big sign saying "DON'T LEAVE YOUR STUFF LYING AROUND"
CCTV is not the answer, CCTV does not stop crime, it only records it!
Yea they fit CCTV and it happens again, i'm sure it would be wonderful to see the person picking up your stuff and walking out. What if the staff don't know them or they are not know to the police? Do you then devote the rest of you life looking for them?
Two cameras is that it? with a nice wide view of the whole area you won't even notice someone picking up a carabiner.
There are 4,000,000 cameras in the UK and studys show that were some areas crime has fallen after CCTV was installed there are also place swhere crime has risen. In most cases the amount of recorded rises but the solved crime stays the same.
I would rather spend the money on good lockers and a big sign saying "DON'T LEAVE YOUR STUFF LYING AROUND"
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