UKC

Does anyone know why this route is called Ichabod, we just had quite a few discussions about it (having just climbed it at the weekend).

Can you help clear up a dispute???

Thanks

Heike

In reply to Heike:

No, go to bed.

In reply to Heike:

Yes, I know exactly why. It's because the previous guidebook editor had concluded his preface by saying there were still a number of good routes to be done on the crag, and 'the cry of Ichabod was not yet'.

Now admittedly I have no idea who Ichabod was (someone in the Bible, I'm thinking?) or what his cry was, and I look forward to being enlightened on this thread, but still I'm pretty sure the above is the answer. Although it's just a guess, really.

jcm

In reply to JLS:
Noooooo, I don't want toooo. Far too early.

In reply to Heike:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichabod


Chris

In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
Well, I checked who he was in the bible that didn't enlighten us too much...Something about his name meaning "the glory is departed from Israel", but I stand to be corrected.

In reply to Chris Craggs:

Just what I was going to post! I guess then his cry was that 'the glory is departed out of Israel' and the editor's (CF Holland?) point was that there was still glory to be had.

So now we know. Or of course I could be completely wrong.

jcm

In reply to Chris Craggs:
Alright, but that doesn't explain why someone would call it Ichabod...was it that this was deemed to be the last glory on the cliff or something like that?

In reply to Heike:

Route names don't have to mean anything in particular, though you may be correct. Good name and good route either way.


Chris

In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Ok. Probably something along those lines..maybe I'll find out more.

Cool route anyways. Now I can go to bed!

In reply to Heike:

Am I invisible?? I just posted higher up why he called it that. Holland's preface to the previous editions is in the present guidebook (an excellent practice btw). Look at its last paragraph.

jcm

In reply to Chris Craggs:

Sure, but usually they came about because somebody thought of something- or maybe some people don't...?

In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
No, sorry, just posting at the same time :-0
You are right...

In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
So, what exactly was the cry of Ichabod then....?

Anyone, please enlighten us!

In reply to Heike:

Not anything to do with the Legend of Sleepy Hollow is it? Can't see any connection other than the name, but maybe?

In reply to Heike:

Sorry, I do the guidebook geekery. You want the religious and Jewish geekery department. Mike TS may be along in a minute to sort you out.

I think it's as I said, 'the glory is departed out of Israel'. That seems to be what Ichabod means, somehow, according to that wikipedia piece. Possibly Holland meant literally the call of 'Ichabod', not the call made by Ichabod.

jcm

In reply to johncoxmysteriously: Maybe the first ascentionist was a fan of Johnny Depp?

In reply to Heike:

It sounds like a similar story to Sifta's Quid at the Roaches. Dave Salt (Sifta) proclaimed that all the routes that could be done, had been done i.e. the cry of Ichabod: the glory had gone from the Roaches/Scafell/Israel.

John Amies then proved him wrong by finding this innocuous little severe through a tunnel near Piece of Mind. And so named it Sifta's Quid after the bet, although he apparently never received the pound.

So 'Ichabod' is either a joke poked at the previous guidebook editor, or, it's a route named in misunderstanding of not what is meant by "the cry of Ichabod" but in how it is perceived. It could be taken as someone shouting 'Ichabod' as oppose to being shouted by Ichabod. It is most likely that the first ascentionist got all of this and was simply being clever with his route naming.

In reply to Heike:

Sadly I'm no longer in touch with Len Willis who was on the first ascent. He suffered a bad stroke shortly after I left the UAE, and I do not know whether he survived for long after that. I believe Geoff Oliver - who led it, is still alive and living in Cumbria, so someone may be able to find out.

In reply to Heike: Ichabod means 'The glory of the Lord has departed'

In reply to ruckman:

Apparently the cliffs of Scafell were very quiet and no one ever saw anyone. An the fear was that eventually one would not be the only party there thus leading one to exclaim "Eek a bod!" .. this was transcribed by the secretary, a religous lady, during the dictation of the guidook preface as "Ichabod". During the FA of Ichabod, Geoff Oliver spotted a solitary walker chasing sheep and duly exclaimed "Eek a bod!" and called the route this. The same religous lady transcribed the guidebook and made the same mistake.

In reply to JimR:

Very funny. You did make that up, didn't you?

By the way the cliffs were very quiet on Monday. Only two other bods there.

In reply to Heike:

Nope its absolutely true, told to me in the Wasdale Inn by a man with a funny face using a toilet seat as a collar